Search: calculator for long numbers.

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60 digits)

Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

Lombo

Dear
"lombo243" [email protected] wrote in message
...
I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60
digits)

Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator
which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

Using AltaVista Advanced with the boolean search term:
calculator and precision and bit
http://www.cyphercalc.com/
They have 320 bit base and 320 bit exponent.

There were 10,000 other hits if this couldn't be made to work...

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

You could substitute A for one number and B for the other number, and
formulate this expression differently to get closer. It would seem...

David A. Smith

Kenneth P. Stox wrote:
lombo243 wrote:

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60
digits)

Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator
which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.


The Unix bc command will do this. Assuming you want the reciprocal of
the square of the difference of the two values, the answer is:

.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000019753 08641975308


Oops, you did say better than 40 places:


1.975308641975308641975308641975317421124828532235 939643347050754487425697302240512117055326\
93187022845433453572456773188368981693194164545076 499554983525922E-45

I should really read the entire thread before posting. ;- I see that
Benoît Morrissette has posted an even more accurate answer.

On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 02:04:34 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60 digits)


Just wondering, why?

Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

Lombo






Benoît Morrissette

On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 21:41:04 -0400, Benoit Morrissette
wrote:

On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 02:04:34 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60 digits)

Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

Lombo

I got this with the PowerToy Calc for Windows XP. Can be downloaded almost
everywhere. Try http://members.optushome.com.au/sinc...Downloads.html

1.97530864197530864197530864197531742112482853223 59396433470507544874256973022405121170553269318702 28454334535724567731883689816931941645450764995549 83525922915243713099541310010581293752896997659988 27181285190107743630461423531000664242102074265876 01049669833037911425484778632861619252150600661994 36407947329870546309760843238460988734196215295455 57318369801686643680409513034747509187399988503113 27876019852704790592735895291930010110945994862027 72702373783913916653743971689399684733564821380365 31987641992226e-45
Benoît Morrissette

OOppss... Link is not good. Better to go directly to the source:

http://www.microsoft.com/WINDOWSXP/h.../powertoys.asp
Benoît Morrissette

Thanks a lot to you all.

cyphercalc costs many if i read right The powerToyCalc I could tr I have XP.
In the meantime I found a calculater too that fittet perfect for my needs:

http://www.home52365.fsnet.co.uk/bcalc.htm and is freeware.



"Benoit Morrissette" schrieb im
Newsbeitrag ...
On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 02:04:34 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60
digits)


Just wondering, why?


Somewhere I read about that the pioneer10 and 11 slow down a very smale
fraction more than they should by gravity law. The acceleration to the sun
looks to be a little too strong out there.This is of course only just a very
very very smale fraction 1/10'000'000'000 or somethign that the acceleration
doesnt fit with the gravity law and I wondered what this could be.

What I considered was the Influence of the charges (Coulumb law) of the
atoms in the sun and pionner.

If you take two electric neutral atoms on a distance D the force of the
charges from one atom to the other are not zero because the electrons are
moveing around the atom center and
are sometimes closer to each other (D-2Atomradius in min) and sometimes a
litter more far from each other. (D+2Atomradius in max).

Because coulumbs law the Force gets smaler with the distance with a rate of
1/Distance^2, the forces of the electrons and protons of the two atoms to
each other are not zero in total
They would be zero if coloumb behaves with 1/Distance.

Well the effect is very very smale and can bethrown away in normale
circumstance.... but we look for a very smale change in the acceleration and
because teh Coulumb Force i stronger than gravity it could be that.

Welll I did a mistake in the numbers above..it should have been
1.0/(1.5e11 - 50e-12) where
1.5e11 is the distance Erd to sun in meter and 50e-12 the average*)
atomradius.

*) its a very rough approximation but enough for a short calculation.

I can't tell you the result. I have to repeat the calculation because I made
the 2.25e-22 instead 1.5e-11 error.
But probabily the effect is too smale to explain their difference.

cheers
Lombo.


Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator
which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

Lombo






Benoît Morrissette

On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:04:17 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:


Thanks a lot to you all.

cyphercalc costs many if i read right The powerToyCalc I could tr I have XP.
In the meantime I found a calculater too that fittet perfect for my needs:

http://www.home52365.fsnet.co.uk/bcalc.htm and is freeware.


Great calc!!


"Benoit Morrissette" schrieb im
Newsbeitrag ...
On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 02:04:34 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

I have a problem:

I should calculate:

1.0 / (2.25e22 - 50e-12)^2

and this down to the maximal precision. (at least 40 but rather 60
digits)


Just wondering, why?


Somewhere I read about that the pioneer10 and 11 slow down a very smale
fraction more than they should by gravity law. The acceleration to the sun
looks to be a little too strong out there.This is of course only just a very
very very smale fraction 1/10'000'000'000 or somethign that the acceleration
doesnt fit with the gravity law and I wondered what this could be.

What I considered was the Influence of the charges (Coulumb law) of the
atoms in the sun and pionner.

The "drag" on the spacecrafts caused by cosmic dust is billions times more
important than the Coulomb law... Second, the solar wind is pushing the
Pionneers away from Sun. Third, our instruments do not have the precision yet
to measure these effects.

There are a lot of trans-neptunian objects and Kuiper belt objects out there
that we havent found yet and they are the most likely candidates for altering
the trajectories or the Pionneers and Voyagers.

Have a nice day!!

Benoît Morrissette

If you take two electric neutral atoms on a distance D the force of the
charges from one atom to the other are not zero because the electrons are
moveing around the atom center and
are sometimes closer to each other (D-2Atomradius in min) and sometimes a
litter more far from each other. (D+2Atomradius in max).

Because coulumbs law the Force gets smaler with the distance with a rate of
1/Distance^2, the forces of the electrons and protons of the two atoms to
each other are not zero in total
They would be zero if coloumb behaves with 1/Distance.

Well the effect is very very smale and can bethrown away in normale
circumstance.... but we look for a very smale change in the acceleration and
because teh Coulumb Force i stronger than gravity it could be that.

Welll I did a mistake in the numbers above..it should have been
1.0/(1.5e11 - 50e-12) where
1.5e11 is the distance Erd to sun in meter and 50e-12 the average*)
atomradius.

*) its a very rough approximation but enough for a short calculation.

I can't tell you the result. I have to repeat the calculation because I made
the 2.25e-22 instead 1.5e-11 error.
But probabily the effect is too smale to explain their difference.

cheers
Lombo.


Does anybody know a claculator I can download or an online calculator
which
is usefull to calculate this? I found nothing so far.

I used an approximation but that does not do it.

Lombo






Benoît Morrissette


Benoît Morrissette

"Benoit Morrissette" wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:04:17 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

Somewhere I read about that the pioneer10 and 11 slow down a very smale
fraction more than they should by gravity law. The acceleration to the sun
looks to be a little too strong out there.

The main paper on this is:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0104064

Craig Markwardt has independently confirmed the result and gives
further analysis on the rate of change of the acceleration:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0208046

This is of course only just a very
very very smale fraction 1/10'000'000'000 or somethign that the acceleration
doesnt fit with the gravity law and I wondered what this could be.

The key point here is that it dosn't fit the law, the extra force
was constant over the range 40AU to 60AU.

What I considered was the Influence of the charges (Coulumb law) of the
atoms in the sun and pionner.

Coulomb force is r^-2 square and dipole force is r^-3 so the
acceleration would have dropped by more than half.

Anderson et al. also considered possible high voltage charge
on the craft interacting with the Solar System magnetic field.
See section VII, D of their paper (0104064).

The "drag" on the spacecrafts caused by cosmic dust is billions times more
important than the Coulomb law...

Gravitational effects of dust directly acting on the radio
signal have also been considered. See section XI, A.

Second, the solar wind is pushing the
Pionneers away from Sun.

Solar radiation pressure is about 100,000 times larger than the
effect of the solar wind, see section VII, B of 0104064.

Third, our instruments do not have the precision yet
to measure these effects.

The solar radiation pressure is measured and easily visible in
the results. See figure 6 of 0104064. It falls to less than the
unknown effect at about 14AU.

There are a lot of trans-neptunian objects and Kuiper belt objects out there
that we havent found yet

One aim of the project was to look for such objects by detecting
peturbations in the motion. The craft would accelerate as it
approached an object and be slowed once past it. None were found.

and they are the most likely candidates for altering
the trajectories or the Pionneers and Voyagers.

Anderson et al. also considered the gravitational effect of
the Kuiper belt as a whole but again the acceleration would
have varied considerably over the measured range. See
Figure 15 and section VII, E of 0104064.

George

"George Dishman" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...

"Benoit Morrissette" wrote in
message ...
On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:04:17 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

Somewhere I read about that the pioneer10 and 11 slow down a very smale
fraction more than they should by gravity law. The acceleration to the
sun
looks to be a little too strong out there.

The main paper on this is:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0104064

Craig Markwardt has independently confirmed the result and gives
further analysis on the rate of change of the acceleration:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0208046

This is of course only just a very
very very smale fraction 1/10'000'000'000 or somethign that the
acceleration
doesnt fit with the gravity law and I wondered what this could be.

The key point here is that it dosn't fit the law, the extra force
was constant over the range 40AU to 60AU.

really constant?This is more exciting then i ever thought. How is it between
1AU and 40AU? Does the extraforce increase "smoothly" or is it like a jump
at 40AU?
Could this somehow be realted with the galaxy rotation phenomena where the
far stars also looks to expire an acceleration to the gravity center
stronger than it should be by the gravity law? (dark matter/modified newton
mechanics)?

Thanks for the links. Is there still more information somewhere?


What I considered was the Influence of the charges (Coulumb law) of the
atoms in the sun and pionner.

Coulomb force is r^-2 square and dipole force is r^-3 so the
acceleration would have dropped by more than half.

Anderson et al. also considered possible high voltage charge
on the craft interacting with the Solar System magnetic field.
See section VII, D of their paper (0104064).

The "drag" on the spacecrafts caused by cosmic dust is billions times
more
important than the Coulomb law...

Gravitational effects of dust directly acting on the radio
signal have also been considered. See section XI, A.

Second, the solar wind is pushing the
Pionneers away from Sun.

Solar radiation pressure is about 100,000 times larger than the
effect of the solar wind, see section VII, B of 0104064.

Third, our instruments do not have the precision yet
to measure these effects.

The solar radiation pressure is measured and easily visible in
the results. See figure 6 of 0104064. It falls to less than the
unknown effect at about 14AU.

There are a lot of trans-neptunian objects and Kuiper belt objects out
there
that we havent found yet

One aim of the project was to look for such objects by detecting
peturbations in the motion. The craft would accelerate as it
approached an object and be slowed once past it. None were found.

and they are the most likely candidates for altering
the trajectories or the Pionneers and Voyagers.

Anderson et al. also considered the gravitational effect of
the Kuiper belt as a whole but again the acceleration would
have varied considerably over the measured range. See
Figure 15 and section VII, E of 0104064.

George



Lombo243

On Wed, 20 Aug 2003 20:26:48 +0100, "George Dishman"
wrote:


"Benoit Morrissette" wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Aug 2003 23:04:17 +0200, "lombo243" [email protected] wrote:

Somewhere I read about that the pioneer10 and 11 slow down a very smale
fraction more than they should by gravity law. The acceleration to the sun
looks to be a little too strong out there.

The main paper on this is:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0104064

Craig Markwardt has independently confirmed the result and gives
further analysis on the rate of change of the acceleration:
http://www.arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0208046

....snip...
George

Great papers, i stand corrected. My last idea: dark energy. The rest of the
universe is repelling the spacecrafts back where they came from...
Benoît Morrissette