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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
So the $3.9B question.
No shuttle extension, means there will be "the gap". How much will it cost us to contract the Russians to send up an Orion docking adapter for attachment to the shuttle docking port? Or is it a de-facto Orion requirement that it be able to dock with the existing shuttle docking port? What was the original Constellation CEV plan for this? Use an Ares V that an Orion would rendevous and dock with and then tranport to the ISS for installation? Also AFAICT we have no US equiv to a Progress vehicle. And no Ares V. So what's the plan? Dave |
#2
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
David Spain wrote:
So the $3.9B question. No shuttle extension, means there will be "the gap". How much will it cost us to contract the Russians to send up an Orion docking adapter for attachment to the shuttle docking port? Or is it a de-facto Orion requirement that it be able to dock with the existing shuttle docking port? What was the original Constellation CEV plan for this? Use an Ares V that an Orion would rendevous and dock with and then tranport to the ISS for installation? Also AFAICT we have no US equiv to a Progress vehicle. And no Ares V. So what's the plan? Dave Cygnus and Falcon, private ventures. For years NASA was decried for preventing private space businesses, now they are encouraging them (in fact, optimistically betting on them). The first Dragon launch comes in May (demonstrator only, no ISS approach). Cross your fingers it is as successful as the HTV was, which is the other alternative for launching the docking adapter. Mike |
#3
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
Mike Ross writes:
Cygnus and Falcon, private ventures. For years NASA was decried for preventing private space businesses, now they are encouraging them (in fact, optimistically betting on them). The first Dragon launch comes in May (demonstrator only, no ISS approach). Cross your fingers it is as successful as the HTV was, which is the other alternative for launching the docking adapter. Mike Right, I've been down this path before and how APAS/LIDS conversion is done via ATLAS was explained to me, by Jorge IIRC. But I never inquired way back then as to 'how' ATLAS was to be delivered. I suppose back then I thought maybe the last shuttle of an extended shuttle run, but now that is not possible. Just trying to connect the dots. Anything about this in 'official' print somewhere? I've got this link from 2009 on ATLAS http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/hy...-standard.html but nothing on how to get it there... Dave |
#4
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
Pat Flannery writes:
Cygnus is supposed to be our Progress equivalent: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cygnus_spacecraft ...or a unmanned variant of Dragon. Thanks Pat. Once again my ignorance is on display. I was aware of the Dragon automated cargo capacity, sheesh some memory I have, but not Cygnus. Dave |
#5
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
Didn't cross-post correctly, sorry for the duplicate in sci.space.station...
David Spain writes: Mike Ross writes: Cygnus and Falcon, private ventures. For years NASA was decried for preventing private space businesses, now they are encouraging them (in fact, optimistically betting on them). The first Dragon launch comes in May (demonstrator only, no ISS approach). Cross your fingers it is as successful as the HTV was, which is the other alternative for launching the docking adapter. Mike Right, I've been down this path before and how APAS/LIDS conversion is done via ATLAS was explained to me, by Jorge IIRC. But I never inquired way back then as to 'how' ATLAS was to be delivered. I suppose back then I thought maybe the last shuttle of an extended shuttle run, but now that is not possible. Just trying to connect the dots. Anything about this in 'official' print somewhere? I've got this link from 2009 on ATLAS http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/hy...-standard.html but nothing on how to get it there... Dave |
#6
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
David Spain writes:
Also AFAICT we have no US equiv to a Progress vehicle. And no Ares V. So what's the plan? Well OK we have the Cygnus -and/or- Dragon, BUT... Given it's nature wouldn't an ATLAS (APAS To LIDS Adapter) be TOO big for either of these? And if so, what about a Progress or HTV? Could the installation be completely automated? -or- Will this require a special one-off type ELV mission to get ATLAS into orbit? -and- Will it require an Orion/Orion-lite mission to rendevous/dock with ATLAS and carry it to the ISS for installation? Would an Orion-lite be 'light' enough, to stack an Orion-lite and ATLAS onto a Falcon 9 or Atlas 5 ala the Apollo CM/LM style? Surely we don't want to wait for the mythical heavy-lift booster in order to orbit an ATLAS? According to this article, the original Constellation plan appearently called for the first two Orion missions to deliver the new docking adapters to the ISS: http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...tellation.html But this article doesn't mention how the ATLAS gets to orbit and given the tight margins I find it hard to believe it was to go up on an Ares-I? In any case that all seems moot now. I think this tune needs somthing... hmm.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/More_cowbell ? Dave |
#7
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
On 4/16/2010 11:25 AM, David Spain wrote:
Also AFAICT we have no US equiv to a Progress vehicle. Cygnus is supposed to be our Progress equivalent: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cygnus_spacecraft ....or a unmanned variant of Dragon. Pat |
#8
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
David Spain wrote:
Mike Ross writes: Cygnus and Falcon, private ventures. For years NASA was decried for preventing private space businesses, now they are encouraging them (in fact, optimistically betting on them). The first Dragon launch comes in May (demonstrator only, no ISS approach). Cross your fingers it is as successful as the HTV was, which is the other alternative for launching the docking adapter. Mike Right, I've been down this path before and how APAS/LIDS conversion is done via ATLAS was explained to me, by Jorge IIRC. But I never inquired way back then as to 'how' ATLAS was to be delivered. I suppose back then I thought maybe the last shuttle of an extended shuttle run, but now that is not possible. Just trying to connect the dots. Anything about this in 'official' print somewhere? I've got this link from 2009 on ATLAS http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/hy...-standard.html but nothing on how to get it there... ATLAS is dead, replaced by CDA, which will fly on HTV in the unpressurized compartment. |
#9
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
David Spain wrote:
David Spain writes: Also AFAICT we have no US equiv to a Progress vehicle. And no Ares V. So what's the plan? Well OK we have the Cygnus -and/or- Dragon, BUT... Given it's nature wouldn't an ATLAS (APAS To LIDS Adapter) be TOO big for either of these? And if so, what about a Progress or HTV? Could the installation be completely automated? -or- Will this require a special one-off type ELV mission to get ATLAS into orbit? -and- Will it require an Orion/Orion-lite mission to rendevous/dock with ATLAS and carry it to the ISS for installation? Would an Orion-lite be 'light' enough, to stack an Orion-lite and ATLAS onto a Falcon 9 or Atlas 5 ala the Apollo CM/LM style? Surely we don't want to wait for the mythical heavy-lift booster in order to orbit an ATLAS? According to this article, the original Constellation plan appearently called for the first two Orion missions to deliver the new docking adapters to the ISS: http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...tellation.html But this article doesn't mention how the ATLAS gets to orbit and given the tight margins I find it hard to believe it was to go up on an Ares-I? It would have flown on top of the Orion, under a modified boost protective cover. Obviously Ares I performance was an issue. ATLAS has been replaced by CDA. ATLAS stood for APAS To LIDS Adapter System. The APAS was mounted on the PMAs, which themselves were really just APAS to CBM adapters. Someone eventually figured out it would be simpler just to make a LIDS to CBM adapter and cut out the middleman, hence CDA. It replaces both ATLAS and the PMAs. CDA is thin enough to fit in the unpressurized compartment of an HTV and will be installed via the SSRMS on Node 2 forward and zenith. Two HTV flights will deliver the two CDAs. The PMAs will be moved to unused CBMs for storage. |
#10
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Who attaches the Orion Docking Adapter to the ISS?
On 4/16/2010 3:22 PM, David Spain wrote:
Pat writes: Cygnus is supposed to be our Progress equivalent: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cygnus_spacecraft ...or a unmanned variant of Dragon. Thanks Pat. Once again my ignorance is on display. I was aware of the Dragon automated cargo capacity, sheesh some memory I have, but not Cygnus. I hadn't even heard of that till a couple of months ago when I was digging around for info on COTS and ran into it. I still like the Robot Samurai face peering out of the Japanese HTV cargo ship: http://spaceflightnow.com/h2b/htv1/090814fueling/ .... no chance at all that that thing will deploy arms and legs when no one is watching. But we have a counter for it if it tries anything funny up there...meet NASA's killer robot that will ride on the last Shuttle flight: http://news.cnet.com/8301-17912_3-20002479-72.html So what happened to "Robonaut 1"? Well, rumor has it that the last thing the Columbia astronauts saw was it crouching on the port wing, tearing a hole in it while laughing maniacally. God-Damn Toaster. God-Damn Cylon Toaster. Pat |
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