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NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 25th 09, 02:14 AM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Sylvia Else
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,063
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

jonathan wrote:
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the notion of returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony.

An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.

ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material
that would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I
suspect that shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than
putting the necessary equipment onto the moon.

Sylvia.
Ads
  #2  
Old September 25th 09, 03:06 AM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
kT
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,032
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

Sylvia Else wrote:
jonathan wrote:
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the notion of
returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only
meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony.

An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.

ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material
that would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I
suspect that shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than
putting the necessary equipment onto the moon.


Personally I'm more interested in what happens when statistical
cratering rate anomalies meet unanticipated hydrated and icy bodies.

Sylvia.

  #3  
Old September 25th 09, 05:21 AM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
BradGuth
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 21,544
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

On Sep 24, 6:14*pm, Sylvia Else wrote:
jonathan wrote:
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.


NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924


This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is */very harsh/ *on the notion of returning
men to the Moon. See below.


What curious timing? *One might just think this 'science' is nothing more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony..


An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......


"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.


"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.


"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml


Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.


ARE THEY LUNATICS? *(literally speaking....yes they are)


AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.


WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.


And let *"Moon Water" *serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.


*Jonathan


Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?


Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight


"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material
that would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I
suspect that shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than
putting the necessary equipment onto the moon.

Sylvia.


But that would be too easy, and it wouldn't offer job and benefit
security.

~ BG
  #4  
Old September 25th 09, 10:08 AM posted to alt.global-warming,sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,312
Default "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

Well, its also perhaps one part of the Science community trying to upstage
the upcoming impact.
I'm intrigued also by the fact that a measurement made on a flypast back in
the last decade has just come to light as a confirmation to the Indian
results.
The thing is this.
On the moon, you get impacts all the time, a good number of these bodies
contain water ice. So is it very surprising that the effects of evaporating
water are detected?
The more intriging finding in my view, is the discovery of water ice at much
higher levels and closer to the surface at lower latitudes on Martian fresh
craters.


Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"jonathan" wrote in message
...
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the notion of
returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only
meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony.

An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.

ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf



s




  #5  
Old September 25th 09, 10:09 AM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Brian Gaff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,312
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

And why would he know any way?
Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Sylvia Else" wrote in message
...
jonathan wrote:
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the notion of
returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only
meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony.

An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.

ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material
that would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I suspect
that shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than putting the
necessary equipment onto the moon.

Sylvia.



  #6  
Old September 25th 09, 01:35 PM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
kT
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,032
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

Brian Gaff wrote:

And why would he know any way?


It was a rant, Brian. He was ranting. On the usenet. Get it?

Brian

  #7  
Old September 25th 09, 03:06 PM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Sylvia Else
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,063
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

kT wrote:
Sylvia Else wrote:
jonathan wrote:
Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's future
is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the notion of
returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing
more
than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call it, only
meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon Colony.

An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony instead.

ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material
that would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I
suspect that shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than
putting the necessary equipment onto the moon.


Personally I'm more interested in what happens when statistical
cratering rate anomalies meet unanticipated hydrated and icy bodies.


Yes, clearly that's a worry. No doubt about it. But one has to be
willing to address more than one problem at a time.

Sylvia.
  #8  
Old September 25th 09, 03:16 PM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Sylvia Else
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,063
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

jonathan wrote:
"Sylvia Else" wrote in message
...

Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material that
would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I suspect that
shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than putting the necessary
equipment onto the moon.



Thanks for replying. I would think the same thing. That any mining
would come at the very end of a long and expensive train of hardware.
A couple of generations.

Don't get me wrong. I also believe that moving into space is
the path to a better future. If not our ultimate salvation.


Now, well, I'm not so sure about that.

If we established self-sufficient colonies in space, then that would
obviate the eggs in one basket situation we have now, where a major
planatory disaster could wipe out the human race.

But the contentious question is, would that matter? After all, said
colonies would do nothing to mitigate the suffering that would occur
during the disaster. All the colonies would do would be to continue the
existence of the race. But is that so important? If the human race were
to be completely wiped out, there would, by definition, be no one left
to suffer the consquences. So beyond the pain and suffering involved the
the process, which would happen anyway, there is no down side to human
extinction.

A particular question is, if survival of the human race is deemed
important, what price should be put on it? How much is the taxpayer
willing to pay to ensure the race's survival? My guess would be, not
that much.

Sylvia.



  #9  
Old September 25th 09, 03:26 PM posted to sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
Entity
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default NASA: "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

On Sep 25, 9:16*am, Sylvia Else wrote:
jonathan wrote:
"Sylvia Else" wrote in message
.. .


Given the quantities they're talking about, and the amount of material that
would have to be processed to get a useful amount of water, I suspect that
shipping water from Earth would still be cheaper than putting the necessary
equipment onto the moon.


Thanks for replying. I would think the same thing. That any mining
would come at the very end of a long and expensive train of hardware.
A couple of generations.


Don't get me wrong. I also believe that moving into space is
the path to a better future. If not our ultimate salvation.


Now, well, I'm not so sure about that.

If we established self-sufficient colonies in space, then that would
obviate the eggs in one basket situation we have now, where a major
planatory disaster could wipe out the human race.

But the contentious question is, would that matter? After all, said
colonies would do nothing to mitigate the suffering that would occur
during the disaster. All the colonies would do would be to continue the
existence of the race. But is that so important? If the human race were
to be completely wiped out, there would, by definition, be no one left
to suffer the consquences. So beyond the pain and suffering involved the
the process, which would happen anyway, there is no down side to human
extinction.

A particular question is, if survival of the human race is deemed
important, what price should be put on it? How much is the taxpayer
willing to pay to ensure the race's survival? My guess would be, not
that much.

Sylvia.


No, but they sure do like to pay a lot to wipe it out!
  #10  
Old September 25th 09, 04:34 PM posted to alt.global-warming,sci.space.shuttle,sci.space.policy,alt.politics
James
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 58
Default "Water on the Moon!" This is the Shameless Science!

Brian Gaff wrote:
Well, its also perhaps one part of the Science community trying to
upstage the upcoming impact.
I'm intrigued also by the fact that a measurement made on a flypast
back in the last decade has just come to light as a confirmation to
the Indian results.
The thing is this.
On the moon, you get impacts all the time, a good number of these
bodies contain water ice. So is it very surprising that the effects
of evaporating water are detected?
The more intriging finding in my view, is the discovery of water ice
at much higher levels and closer to the surface at lower latitudes on
Martian fresh craters.


Brian

Timing is everything; An Example of the Lowest Form
of Science.

NASA finds ice on the moon
http://www.reuters.com/article/scien...36167620090924

This 'Big Discovery' comes just as the Augustine Report on NASA's
future is being released. A report which is /very harsh/ on the
notion of returning
men to the Moon. See below.

What curious timing? One might just think this 'science' is nothing
more than a politically motivated show, 'politico-science'...call
it, only meant
as a last-ditch effort to save the dying idea of building a Moon
Colony.
An idea even Tom Hanks considers without reason......

"I think in the history of the human race, the moon has been
the first place we've gone to and said, 'OK, we don't need
to go back there again.'" Hanks said.

"And maybe we should do it again?" Axelrod asks.

"Well," Hanks says, "the question would be why?"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in881421.shtml

Moon Water is .."THE REASON WHY". A drop of moon water per liter
of lunar soil..Wow! FORGET GLOBAL WARMING, we need to be
mining water on the flippin' moon for a Trillion Dollar Colony
instead.
ARE THEY LUNATICS? (literally speaking....yes they are)

AMERICA'S SINGLE GREATEST SCIENTIFIC PROGRAM
for the next fifty years, a Gilded Safari to the Moon!
That's incredibly sad, if not tragic, considering what the world
will soon become due to fossil fueled climate change.

WHILE THE WORLD BURNS these 'scientists' hold a press conference
that's nothing more than a political dog-and-pony show.
To justify an immoral waste of taxpayer funds.
They should be fired.

And let "Moon Water" serve as the fitting epitaph for America's
manned space program.

Jonathan



Moon-Water-Factory or Space Solar Power?
Which makes sense?

Executive Summary
NASA'S SPACE SOLAR POWER EXPLORATORY RESEARCH
AND TECHNOLOGY (SERT) PROGRAM
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=10202&page=1


SUMMARY REPORT
of the Review of U.S. Human Space Flight

"The U.S. human spaceflight program appears to be on an
unsustainable trajectory. It is perpetuating the perilous practice
of pursuing goals that do not match allocated resources."
http://www.ostp.gov/galleries/press_...tineforweb.pdf



If this were true, it should be bigger news than we've seen so far. It
would change the whole paradigm of getting started in space exploration.


 




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