A Space & astronomy forum. SpaceBanter.com

Go Back   Home » SpaceBanter.com forum » Astronomy and Astrophysics » Astronomy Misc
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

What's up with gravity wave detection?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #151  
Old September 13th 04, 12:23 AM
Jim Greenfield
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"George Dishman" wrote in message ...
Hi Jim, how ya doing.

"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"Androcles" wrote in message

...
"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...

| | | Have a look at how your computer works. There are a series of 0,1

,
| | | or (+1) if you like.
| |
| | Not really... it uses voltages.
| |
| | Nope! Code 11111100000100101100101010110010010010000110011011 0....
| | ........not a minus 1 to be seen!
|
| What do you mean, nope?
| I can assure you, MY computer uses voltages.
|
| And NOT this code??

Oh, you mean a theoretical computer, like a Turing Machine, designed by the
mathematician and Enigma codebreaker, Alan Turing.
That's the theory of computing, not HOW my computer WORKS.


I believe you must be missing the point (deliberately?)
The silicon atoms are either 'charged' or 'not charged'- there is NO
third possibility. Whatever keys the programmer uses to "work" the
computer have J*S to do with it. They are either yes/no on/off
0/(1) etc
THAT is HOW a computer "operates"


No it isn't. I suggest you read some datasheets before
trying to tell people how things work. The logic states
can be represented by anything you like as long as they
are distinguishable. Most computers use voltages though
currents are equally valid (look up IIL or "I squared
logic"), and in the future perhaps quantum states will
carry the information. The modem you use to connect to
the internet probably uses amplitude and phase-change
to represent data and is highly unlikely to be binary
unless you have a _very_ old modem.

The device I am currently working with has switchable
thresholds to match the surrounding circuitry. We use it
in 3.3V mode where a logic 1 is a voltage in the range
+2.0V to +3.6V while logic 0 is between -0.3V and +0.8V.
In 2.5V mode, logic 1 is +1.7V to +2.8V while logic 0 is
from -0.3V to +0.7V.

We are interfacing to an old system where logic 1 is
any voltage more negative than -32V and logic 0 is any
voltage more positive than -5V and we translate between
them using opto-isolators where logic 1 is an input
current greater than 0.5mA and logic 0 is less than
0.2mA giving output currents of -0.25mA and -0.1mA
respectively (50% CTR, active pull down).

Devices are actually operated by voltages, logic levels
are merely the interpretations we apply.

best regards
George


G'day stranger!
No dents in the cow-catcher, I trust? :-)

As for this computer bit ( ;-) ), my understanding of a silicon
chip, is that each atom has two possible states ONLY, and it is this
that allows them to be used as we do (some much better than others,
sob!)
I have still to be provided by a "less than zero" which occurs in
nature, by anybody. Entities claimed invariably are the result of
mistaking direction, position, or a human designation (electron/proton
situation). When calculations give a result which is
impossible/doesn't occur in nature, a light should go on in that
mathematician's head, that the math used is faulty/wrongly applied to
the situation.

Good to see you around- I must pull my finger out, and see where we
were at!

Jim G
c'=c+v (sorry!)
  #152  
Old September 13th 04, 09:54 PM
George Dishman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"George Dishman" wrote in message

...
...
Devices are actually operated by voltages, logic levels
are merely the interpretations we apply.


G'day stranger!
No dents in the cow-catcher, I trust? :-)


Smooth as a wheatfield after a hurricane.

As for this computer bit ( ;-) ), my understanding of a silicon
chip, is that each atom has two possible states ONLY, and it is this
that allows them to be used as we do (some much better than others,
sob!)


Nope, nothing like that. The logic states are represented
by voltages on aluminium tracks. The silicon is used to
make transistors that act simply as switches that connect
one voltage or another onto the tracks and those voltages
in turn operate more transistor switches.

I have still to be provided by a "less than zero" which occurs in
nature, by anybody. Entities claimed invariably are the result of
mistaking direction, position, or a human designation (electron/proton
situation).


Electron/ proton is a good example. You can designate the
charge on either as positive but that on the other must
always be negative. Or think of pair production such as
an electron/positron pair. In nature total charge is
conserved so if two particles are created and one has
positive charge the other must have an equal and opposite
(negative) charge if the total is to sum to zero.

When calculations give a result which is
impossible/doesn't occur in nature, a light should go on in that
mathematician's head, that the math used is faulty/wrongly applied to
the situation.


That's one reason scientists are highly sceptical of
claims of FTL phenomena, the elapsed proper time becomes
imaginary, but negative values are commonplace and not a
problem (except when they are not supposed to be there
as happened this morning).

Good to see you around- I must pull my finger out, and see where we
were at!


Well you were going to send some holiday snaps to make
me jealous (it seems a long time ago) but generally you
were looking at Alf, Bert and Charlie to see if it could
help you could grasp the 4D way of looking at time and
space. Unfortunately my web site got trashed during
maintenance at the ISP so I'll have to hunt down the
graphics and load them back up again (I wouldn't expect
you to have taken a local copy).

best regards
George


  #153  
Old September 14th 04, 04:37 AM
Jim Greenfield
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"George Dishman" wrote in message ...
"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"George Dishman" wrote in message

...
...
Devices are actually operated by voltages, logic levels
are merely the interpretations we apply.


G'day stranger!
No dents in the cow-catcher, I trust? :-)


Smooth as a wheatfield after a hurricane.

As for this computer bit ( ;-) ), my understanding of a silicon
chip, is that each atom has two possible states ONLY, and it is this
that allows them to be used as we do (some much better than others,
sob!)


Nope, nothing like that. The logic states are represented
by voltages on aluminium tracks. The silicon is used to
make transistors that act simply as switches that connect
one voltage or another onto the tracks and those voltages
in turn operate more transistor switches.


This IS (sort of) what I was getting at; the switches only have two
positions- not the equivalent of the 3 choices expressed by (-1) 0
(+1)

I have still to be provided by a "less than zero" which occurs in
nature, by anybody. Entities claimed invariably are the result of
mistaking direction, position, or a human designation (electron/proton
situation).


Electron/ proton is a good example. You can designate the
charge on either as positive but that on the other must
always be negative. Or think of pair production such as
an electron/positron pair. In nature total charge is
conserved so if two particles are created and one has
positive charge the other must have an equal and opposite
(negative) charge if the total is to sum to zero.

When calculations give a result which is
impossible/doesn't occur in nature, a light should go on in that
mathematician's head, that the math used is faulty/wrongly applied to
the situation.


That's one reason scientists are highly sceptical of
claims of FTL phenomena, the elapsed proper time becomes
imaginary, but negative values are commonplace and not a
problem (except when they are not supposed to be there
as happened this morning).


Yeh- I slept in to!
I'm afraid that I still stick to the case, that a photon from a moving
source, would pass one from a stationary source (travelling in the
same direction, of course). The other time travel scenarios I am not
sure of, but 'feel' that the obstacle is energy application, not a
natural barrier to any greater speed.

Good to see you around- I must pull my finger out, and see where we
were at!


Well you were going to send some holiday snaps to make
me jealous (it seems a long time ago) but generally you
were looking at Alf, Bert and Charlie to see if it could
help you could grasp the 4D way of looking at time and
space. Unfortunately my web site got trashed during
maintenance at the ISP so I'll have to hunt down the
graphics and load them back up again (I wouldn't expect
you to have taken a local copy).

best regards
George


The scan (photo) files are a bit big (5000kbs)
Perhaps we can work something out on the other address?
(They are so good, I get jealous myself, just reviewing :-)
.........is that time travel?)

Have a good one
Jim G
(c'=c+v left out in your case :-) )
  #154  
Old September 14th 04, 08:15 PM
George Dishman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"George Dishman" wrote in message

...
"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"George Dishman" wrote in message

...
...
Devices are actually operated by voltages, logic levels
are merely the interpretations we apply.

....
As for this computer bit ( ;-) ), my understanding of a silicon
chip, is that each atom has two possible states ONLY, and it is this
that allows them to be used as we do (some much better than others,
sob!)


Nope, nothing like that. The logic states are represented
by voltages on aluminium tracks. The silicon is used to
make transistors that act simply as switches that connect
one voltage or another onto the tracks and those voltages
in turn operate more transistor switches.


This IS (sort of) what I was getting at; the switches only have two
positions- not the equivalent of the 3 choices expressed by (-1) 0
(+1)


You use "sort of" in an all-encompassing style. Look
again at what you said that prompted this as well as
your response above:

"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...
"Androcles" wrote in message

...
"Jim Greenfield" wrote in message
om...

| | | Have a look at how your computer works. There are a series of

0,1,
| | | or (+1) if you like.
| |
| | Not really... it uses voltages.
| |
| | Nope! Code 11111100000100101100101010110010010010000110011011 0....
| | ........not a minus 1 to be seen!
|
| What do you mean, nope?
| I can assure you, MY computer uses voltages.
|
| And NOT this code??


The symbols "0" and "1" are representational only,
computers operate on voltages that are 'real' values
(i.e. can take _any_ value, not just multiples of
some quantum) and can be positive or negative as
shown by the real life examples I gave.

I have still to be provided by a "less than zero" which occurs in
nature, by anybody. Entities claimed invariably are the result of
mistaking direction, position, or a human designation (electron/proton
situation).


Electron/ proton is a good example. You can designate the
charge on either as positive but that on the other must
always be negative. Or think of pair production such as
an electron/positron pair. In nature total charge is
conserved so if two particles are created and one has
positive charge the other must have an equal and opposite
(negative) charge if the total is to sum to zero.


You also ignored the key example that disproves
your claim. I'll snip the rest as it is unrelated
to this topic and I've replied by email on our
previous discussion on SR.

best regards
George


 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Beyond Linear Cosmology and Hypnotic Theology Yoda Misc 0 June 30th 04 07:33 PM
Empirically Refuted Superluminal Velocities. EL Astronomy Misc 22 October 31st 03 05:07 PM
Oceanographers Catch First Wave Of Gravity Mission's Success Ron Baalke Science 13 August 7th 03 06:24 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 SpaceBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.