"What is that?"

My boyfriend and I wanted to watch the meteor shower this past weekend and I was determined to get somewhere nice and dark so we could see as much as possible. We went out on Sunday the 12th to an area of New Jersey that's mostly just farms so there was minimal light pollution.

Dan had noticed what we initially thought were just two very dim stars. They were light enough that there would have been no way we would have noticed them if there was any light pollution where we were. But after looking at them for a few seconds we noticed that they were moving. They were far enough apart that they were obviously two separate items, but they were moving in perfect unison. We were able to watch them move across the sky for a minute or so, so I imagine they must have been moving pretty fast, judging by how far away I assumed they were. The entire time we watched them, they stayed the exact same distance apart, and in the same formation (one was just slightly higher than the other, but they were mostly one behind the other.)

I am not a hobbyist, nor do I pretend to know anything about this. The extent of my expertise is that I could lay on the beach and stare at the stars for hours! But my immediate thought was maybe they were satellites? I was under the impression that, under the right circumstances, you could sometimes see them with the naked eye. I posted about it on facebook and was immediately shot down by a friend who told me that you could not, so now I'm really curious about what this could have been. I'm pretty convinced that they were not airplanes. They didn't look like any planes I've ever seen, moved too slowly to be planes, and I find it very hard to believe that planes would keep in such PERFECT formation to each other.

Please don't think I expect any exact answers ("it was satellite such and such run by such and such..."), I'm just really curious and looking for some possibilities of what it COULD maybe be.

Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if this isn't where this belongs!!!

On Fri, 17 Aug 2012 00:36:59 +0000, Sweet Chaos
wrote:

Please don't think I expect any exact answers ("it was satellite such
and such run by such and such..."), I'm just really curious and looking
for some possibilities of what it COULD maybe be.

Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if this isn't where this
belongs!!!

There are lots of satellites that are visible with the naked eye. See
http://www.satobs.org/ for more information.

On 17/08/2012 01:36, Sweet Chaos wrote:

Please don't think I expect any exact answers ("it was satellite such
and such run by such and such..."), I'm just really curious and looking
for some possibilities of what it COULD maybe be.

It is quite possible your expectations can be exceeded. Very accurate
programmes are online to predict satellite positions see below.

sci.astro.amateur might get you more observers though. This group is
full of nutters who have NEW THEORIES OF THE UNIVERSE and have not yet
learnt where the shift key is on their keyboard. .amateur was split off
to deal with observational hobby astronomy and avoid the kooks.

BTW You appear to be using some parasitic front end banter website to
post to Usenet and probably seeing lots of adverts as a result.

Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if this isn't where this
belongs!!!

If you know your location, date and time when you saw them and direction
of travel there is a very good chance of identifying them. Try:

http://www.heavens-above.com/

Set your location from the map or database (database gets the time zone
right for you) and select daily predictions for all satellites brighter
than 4.5 (dimmest) and you should be in business.

When it isn't doing anything else BMEWS exercises by tracking satellites
and space junk and these programmes use that data to allow you to
identify satellites at more or less any date.

Also check out their predictions of Iridium flares for the coming week -
they really are quite something to see!

Regards,
Martin Brown

Sweet Chaos wrote:
My boyfriend and I wanted to watch the meteor shower this past weekend
and I was determined to get somewhere nice and dark so we could see as
much as possible. We went out on Sunday the 12th to an area of New
Jersey that's mostly just farms so there was minimal light pollution.

Dan had noticed what we initially thought were just two very dim
stars. They were light enough that there would have been no way we
would have noticed them if there was any light pollution where we
were. But after looking at them for a few seconds we noticed that
they were moving. They were far enough apart that they were obviously
two separate items, but they were moving in perfect unison. We were
able to watch them move across the sky for a minute or so, so I
imagine they must have been moving pretty fast, judging by how far
away I assumed they were. The entire time we watched them, they
stayed the exact same distance apart, and in the same formation (one
was just slightly higher than the other, but they were mostly one
behind the other.)

I am not a hobbyist, nor do I pretend to know anything about this. The
extent of my expertise is that I could lay on the beach and stare at
the stars for hours! But my immediate thought was maybe they were
satellites? I was under the impression that, under the right
circumstances, you could sometimes see them with the naked eye. I
posted about it on facebook and was immediately shot down by a friend
who told me that you could not, so now I'm really curious about what
this could have been. I'm pretty convinced that they were not
airplanes. They didn't look like any planes I've ever seen, moved too
slowly to be planes, and I find it very hard to believe that planes
would keep in such PERFECT formation to each other.

Please don't think I expect any exact answers ("it was satellite such
and such run by such and such..."), I'm just really curious and
looking for some possibilities of what it COULD maybe be.

Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if this isn't where this
belongs!!!


Satellites seems to be a likely identification. Could be either a satellite
in orbit with its final stage booster in a similar orbit, or a space
experiment that uses two satellites, or - less likely - military aircraft in
formation at high altitude*, without the usual strobe lights and flashing
lights. Whether this ever happens over land I do not know.

*e.g., mid-air refueling exercise.

--
Mike Dworetsky

(Remove pants sp*mbl*ck to reply)

Originally Posted by Mark Sieving

There are lots of satellites that are visible with the naked eye. See
http://www.satobs.org/ for more information.

Thank you!

Originally Posted by Mark Sieving

It is quite possible your expectations can be exceeded. Very accurate
programmes are online to predict satellite positions see below.

That's awesome!

Originally Posted by Martin Brown

BTW You appear to be using some parasitic front end banter website to
post to Usenet and probably seeing lots of adverts as a result.

Huh? I'm confused. spacebanter.com?

Originally Posted by Martin Brown

If you know your location, date and time when you saw them and direction
of travel there is a very good chance of identifying them. Try:

http://www.heavens-above.com/

Set your location from the map or database (database gets the time zone
right for you) and select daily predictions for all satellites brighter
than 4.5 (dimmest) and you should be in business.

I tried that site when I first started looking around here but it kinda confused me more than anything so I quit and registered here lol

Originally Posted by Martin Brown

Also check out their predictions of Iridium flares for the coming week -
they really are quite something to see!

I'll take a look! Thanks for all your help!

Originally Posted by Mike Dworetsky

Satellites seems to be a likely identification. Could be either a satellite
in orbit with its final stage booster in a similar orbit, or a space
experiment that uses two satellites, or - less likely - military aircraft in
formation at high altitude*, without the usual strobe lights and flashing
lights. Whether this ever happens over land I do not know.

*e.g., mid-air refueling exercise.

Awesome! It's cool to know that I might have been right! Haha. I refuse to believe it was any type of plane =p


Thanks again to everyone who took the time to respond. I appreciate your input! =)

On Thursday, August 16, 2012 5:36:59 PM UTC-7, Sweet Chaos wrote:
My boyfriend and I wanted to watch the meteor shower this past weekend

and I was determined to get somewhere nice and dark so we could see as

much as possible. We went out on Sunday the 12th to an area of New

Jersey that's mostly just farms so there was minimal light pollution.



Dan had noticed what we initially thought were just two very dim stars.

They were light enough that there would have been no way we would have

noticed them if there was any light pollution where we were. But after

looking at them for a few seconds we noticed that they were moving. They

were far enough apart that they were obviously two separate items, but

they were moving in perfect unison. We were able to watch them move

across the sky for a minute or so, so I imagine they must have been

moving pretty fast, judging by how far away I assumed they were. The

entire time we watched them, they stayed the exact same distance apart,

and in the same formation (one was just slightly higher than the other,

but they were mostly one behind the other.)



I am not a hobbyist, nor do I pretend to know anything about this. The

extent of my expertise is that I could lay on the beach and stare at the

stars for hours! But my immediate thought was maybe they were

satellites? I was under the impression that, under the right

circumstances, you could sometimes see them with the naked eye. I posted

about it on facebook and was immediately shot down by a friend who told

me that you could not, so now I'm really curious about what this could

have been. I'm pretty convinced that they were not airplanes. They

didn't look like any planes I've ever seen, moved too slowly to be

planes, and I find it very hard to believe that planes would keep in

such PERFECT formation to each other.



Please don't think I expect any exact answers ("it was satellite such

and such run by such and such..."), I'm just really curious and looking

for some possibilities of what it COULD maybe be.



Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if this isn't where this

belongs!!!









--

Sweet Chaos

What you saw is very likely one of these guys...

http://www.satobs.org/noss.html

.... I've seen them many, many times, and they look just as you have described

\Paul A

On 18/08/2012 00:22, Sweet Chaos wrote:
Mark Sieving;1221007 Wrote:

There are lots of satellites that are visible with the naked eye. See
http://www.satobs.org/ for more information.

Thank you!

Mark Sieving;1221007 Wrote:

It is quite possible your expectations can be exceeded. Very accurate
programmes are online to predict satellite positions see below.

That's awesome!

Martin Brown;1221008 Wrote:

BTW You appear to be using some parasitic front end banter website to
post to Usenet and probably seeing lots of adverts as a result.

Huh? I'm confused. spacebanter.com?

Yes. That is a parasitic website that takes conversations occurring on
the ancient *free* Usenet text newsgroups (in this case sci.astro) and
repackages them with adverts for commercial gain. The posts you make on
that site are reflected onto Usenet where experts hang out.

You can see the entirety of Usenet by going to Google groups although I
suggest you get a real newsreader and subscribe to free AOIE newsfeed or
Teranews (one time sub $5 for text only). There is a newsgroup to cover
almost every interest although these days some are low traffic.

https://groups.google.com/forum/?fro...orum/sci.astro
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fro....astro.amateur

The "new" Google groups is inferior to the old service at

https://groups.google.com/?hl=en-GB&noredirect=true

You can also search these archives for old posts and subjects which can
be invaluable as they go back to about 1990. Google broke the indexes
though so you may not always find posts that you know are there.

Martin Brown;1221008 Wrote:

If you know your location, date and time when you saw them and direction

of travel there is a very good chance of identifying them. Try:

http://www.heavens-above.com/

Set your location from the map or database (database gets the time zone

right for you) and select daily predictions for all satellites brighter

than 4.5 (dimmest) and you should be in business.

I tried that site when I first started looking around here but it kinda
confused me more than anything so I quit and registered here lol

The trouble is "here" isn't where you think it is. Here is actually
Usenet and you are seeing a pale reflection of it inside a website.

Many old hands consider the parasitic behaviour of -banter sites rather
distasteful since they are making money off freely given advice.

Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin Brown wrote:

Huh? I'm confused. spacebanter.com?

Yes. That is a parasitic website that takes conversations occurring on
the ancient *free* Usenet text newsgroups (in this case sci.astro) and
repackages them with adverts for commercial gain. The posts you make on
that site are reflected onto Usenet where experts hang out.

Hello Martin
What am I missing?

I went to spacebanter.com and expected to see what you describe.

I agree the site is "parasitic" in some sense, but so is Google Groups!
But - where are the adverts? Don't you see them unless you register?
I use Safari 6.0 with everything enabled and no pop-up blocking.

Having said that, groups are much less readable on the site thanif you
are using a threaded newsreader or Google Groups..

--
I recommend Macs to my friends, and Windows machines
to those whom I don't mind billing by the hour

Originally Posted by palsing[_2_]

What you saw is very likely one of these guys...

http://www.satobs.org/noss.html

.... I've seen them many, many times, and they look just as you have described

\Paul A

This is so cool!! Thanks so much!