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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter
of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Now imagine a three stage rocket built around this engine. The first stage Consists of a truncated cone that has a base diameter of 196.96 meters and a ring of 36 engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine arrangement - that doubles as a re-entry heat sheild. The vehicle has 316 support legs around the base to form its own self supporting platform. These legs are equipped with powered wheels that allow the vehicle to move on the ground after landing and before take off. The legs also have powered anchors, reusable hold down clamps. The stage length is 154.88 meters. The stage masses 217,415 metric tons empty and carries 136,164 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 154.88 meters in diameter. At the base of the cone, above the 36 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each 27.76 m in diameter, together they carry 816,988 metric tons of liquid oxygen. Total stage weight is 1,225,567 metric tons. All 36 engines produce nearly 2 million tons at lift off. The second stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter 112.81 meters. It is equipped with a ring of six engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine - that also doubles as a re-entry shield. The vehicles has 36 support legs around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift-off and landing gear during vertical touchdown. The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors as above. The stage length is 88.71 meters. The empty stage masses 50,993 metric tons and carries 25,582 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank that is 88.71 meters in diameter. At the base of the cone, above the 6 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each a sphere 15.90 meters in diameter. Altogether the 8 tanks carry a total oxygen load of 153,495 metric tons. Total stage weight is 230,070 metric tons. The third stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter of 64.61 meters. It is equipped with a single engine at its base - exhausting at the center of a heat sheild that is equipped with a door. Smaller vernier engines surround the heat sheild for vehicle recovery. There are 6 support leges around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift off and operate as landing gear during vertical touchdown. The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors. The stage length is 50.81 meters. The empty stage masses 9,580 metric tons and carries 4,806 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 50.81 meters in diameter. 28,839 metric tons of oxygen are carried in 8 tanks each 9.11 meters in diameter. Total stage weight is 43,225 metric tons. Payload fairing The payload fairing rides atop the third stage, and ispart of it. It consists of 6 clamshell type doors that open 20 degrees and are self powered and have a powered clamping mechanism. The fairing base sits atop the third stage and is 37 meters in diameter and has an overall length of 91.94 meters. It is cylindrical from the base for its first 23.78 meters. It then tapers at a half angle of 15.75 degrees until it comes to a point another 68.16 meters above the top of the cylinder. Total volume within the fairing 50,000 cubic meters. Total payload capacity 10,000 metric tons. Piloted option Around the base of the payload fariing is a 37 meter diameter torus that is 3 meters in diameter - this 116 meter long ring is equipped to carry a crew of up to 35 - although the vehicle is capable of unpiloted operations. 90 tele-operated humaniform robots are attached throughout the fairing volume to allow operators in the pressurized zone access to the cargo and spacecraft. These robots may also be teleoperated from the ground. Notes on Cost: Fighter aircraft and spacecraft range in prices from $5 million to $10 million per ton. Transport aircraft range in prices from $1 million to $1.8 million per ton. Cargo ships cost $1,500 to $2,000 per ton. The variation in cost has to do primarily with non-recurring engineering charges, scale of production, and volume produced - to a smaller degree the sort of environment and the nature of the materials used play a part. On the scale we're discussing here - it should be possible to achieve $2,000 per ton for structure cost, and $20 per ton propellant cost. This means each vehicle can be built for $664 million - the payload costs $20 million - and recurring cost per flight is $48 million. Notes on Size: Total mass of the empty vehicle is 331,986 metric tons. This is about the size of a very large ocean going ship. Its total length when fully stacked is 386.34 meters. Total mass at lift off is nearly 1.5 million tons and it burns nearly 1.2 million tons of propellant. Operation The first stage lights, and powers up, and the anchoring gear releases. The stage rises at 1.3 gees. When the vehicle reaches 3.5 km/sec the stage falls away and re-enters downrange. There it executes a powered touchdown at a downrange field. There it is partly refueled and flown back to the launch center ballistically, in a 'bounce back' maneuver. At the launch center it re-enters, lands - and motors over to the launch center again to be reused. The second stage ignites and continues upward achieving a final speed of 7.7 km per second and placing the fully loaded 53,225 metric tons into LEO. The second stage after release of the third stage, deorbits and re-enters so that it lands vertically in a powered touchdown near the launch center. Once down, it motors to the 400 meter tall assembly crane where it is placed atop the booster stage once again. The third stage ignites and enters a GTO and rises to GEO. There it executes a circularizing burn - and releases its payload after opening its nose shroud. Once the payload is released and the payload successfully deployed, the reusable kick stage, deorbits slowing to GTO velocity, and re-enters the atmosphere and lands at the launch center - motors over to the tower, and is placed again on the stack after refurbishment. Once the stack is assembled, the vehicle is then refueled and reused. A fleet of 6 vehicles are built to deploy 52 payloads per year - with a cycle time of 6 weeks. * * * * |
#2
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
wrote in message
... Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Not even if I were using drugs would I be able to imagine something so ridiculous as this. |
#3
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
Now,
imagine a 200 GW laser power satellite on orbit. It has the capacity to beam energy to the upper stage of the vehicle just described. Now imagine that a second stage engine is equipped to receive laser energy from space, sufficient to produce 339,556 metric tons of thrust by heating 167 metric tons of hydrogen per second - to exhaust it at 20 km/sec. This requires the power 33 TW of laser energy - the output of 167 power satellites. The second stage is equipped with a stretched second stage hydrogen tank with a 16.84 meter spacer between spherical end caps, which is filledwith 129,644 metric tons of hydrogen in the 105.55 m long stretched tank. the base of the second stage is the same, but has a 16.84 m long 88.71 m diameter cylinder inserted mid way through the stage, before narrowing to a 64.61 meter at the top - with a 112.81 meter base. This vehicle delivers 102,658 metric tons to GEO - using the same booster and an improved upper stage. A stretched deep space stage is attached to the top of this two stage booster. The deep space stage is a stretched version of the third stage which is capable of landing on the moon and returning to Earth - with 20,000 tons of payload. The vehicle is also capable of executing a powered touchdown on Mars and returning to Earth - again with 20,000 tons of payload. A laser propelled version of this vehicle is capable of flying to the asteroid belt, surveying to find rich feedstock for human industry, and attaching laser powered rockets that use the asteroid itself as propellant. |
#4
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
wrote in message
... Now, imagine a 200 GW laser power satellite on orbit. It has the capacity to beam energy to the upper stage of the vehicle just described. No it doesn't. There's no such thing as a laser that powerful. There's also no satellite that can generate that much power. Oh, and what if the laser misses the 'target'? Of course, in _your_ imagination, it wouldn't do that. |
#5
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
On 9 Aug, 04:57, wrote:
Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Now imagine a three stage rocket built around this engine. The first stage Consists of a truncated cone that has a base diameter of 196.96 meters and a ring of 36 engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine arrangement - that doubles as a re-entry heat sheild. *The vehicle has 316 support legs around the base to form its own self supporting platform. *These legs are equipped with powered wheels that allow the vehicle to move on the ground after landing and before take off. *The legs also have powered anchors, reusable hold down clamps. *The stage length is 154.88 meters. *The stage masses 217,415 metric tons empty and carries 136,164 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 154.88 meters in diameter. *At the base of the cone, above the 36 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each 27.76 m in diameter, together they carry 816,988 metric tons of liquid oxygen. *Total stage weight is 1,225,567 metric tons. *All 36 engines produce nearly 2 million tons at lift off. The second stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter 112.81 meters. *It is equipped with a ring of six engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine - that also doubles as a re-entry shield. *The vehicles has 36 support legs around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift-off and landing gear during vertical touchdown. The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors as above. *The stage length is 88.71 meters. *The empty stage masses 50,993 metric tons and carries 25,582 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank that is 88.71 meters in diameter. *At the base of the cone, above the 6 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each a sphere 15.90 meters in diameter. *Altogether the 8 tanks carry a total oxygen load of 153,495 metric tons. *Total stage weight is 230,070 metric tons. The third stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter of 64.61 meters. *It is equipped with a single engine at its base - exhausting at the center of a heat sheild that is equipped with a door. *Smaller vernier engines surround the heat sheild for vehicle recovery. *There are 6 support leges around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift off and operate as landing gear during vertical touchdown. *The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors. *The stage length is 50.81 meters. *The empty stage masses 9,580 metric tons and carries 4,806 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 50.81 meters in diameter. *28,839 metric tons of oxygen are carried in 8 tanks each 9.11 meters in diameter. *Total stage weight is 43,225 metric tons. Payload fairing The payload fairing rides atop the third stage, and ispart of it. *It consists of 6 clamshell type doors that open 20 degrees and are self powered and have a powered clamping mechanism. *The fairing base sits atop the third stage and is 37 meters in diameter and has an overall length of 91.94 meters. *It is cylindrical from the base for its first 23.78 meters. *It then tapers at a half angle of 15.75 degrees until it comes to a point another 68.16 meters above the top of the cylinder. *Total volume within the fairing 50,000 cubic meters. *Total payload capacity 10,000 metric tons. Piloted option Around the base of the payload fariing is a 37 meter diameter torus that is 3 meters in diameter - this 116 meter long ring is equipped to carry a crew of up to 35 - although *the vehicle is capable of unpiloted operations. *90 tele-operated humaniform robots are attached throughout the fairing volume to allow operators in the pressurized zone access to the cargo and spacecraft. *These robots may also be teleoperated from the ground. Notes on Cost: Fighter aircraft and spacecraft range in prices from $5 million to $10 million per ton. *Transport aircraft range in prices from $1 million to $1.8 million per ton. *Cargo ships cost $1,500 to $2,000 per ton. The variation in cost has to do primarily with non-recurring engineering charges, scale of production, and volume produced - to a smaller degree the sort of environment and the nature of the materials used play a part. *On the scale we're discussing here - it should be possible to achieve $2,000 per ton for structure cost, and $20 per ton propellant cost. *This means each vehicle can be built for $664 million - the payload costs $20 million - and recurring cost per flight is $48 million. Notes on Size: Total mass of the empty vehicle is 331,986 metric tons. *This is about the size of a very large ocean going ship. *Its total length when fully stacked is 386.34 meters. *Total mass at lift off is nearly 1.5 million tons and it burns nearly 1.2 million tons of propellant. Operation The first stage lights, and powers up, and the anchoring gear releases. *The stage rises at 1.3 gees. * When the vehicle reaches 3.5 km/sec the stage falls away and re-enters downrange. *There it executes a powered touchdown at a downrange field. *There it is partly refueled and flown back to the launch center ballistically, in a 'bounce back' maneuver. *At the launch center it re-enters, lands - and motors over to the launch center again to be reused. The second stage ignites and continues upward achieving a final speed of 7.7 km per second and placing the fully loaded 53,225 metric tons into LEO. *The second stage after release of the third stage, deorbits and re-enters so that it lands vertically in a powered touchdown near the launch center. *Once down, it motors to the 400 meter tall assembly crane where it is placed atop the booster stage once again. The third stage ignites and enters a GTO and rises to GEO. *There it executes a circularizing burn - and releases its payload after opening its nose shroud. Once the payload is released and the payload successfully deployed, the reusable kick stage, deorbits slowing to GTO velocity, and re-enters the atmosphere and lands at the launch center - motors over to the tower, and is placed again on the stack after refurbishment. Once the stack is assembled, the vehicle is then refueled and reused. A fleet of 6 vehicles are built to deploy 52 payloads per year - with a cycle time of 6 weeks. * * * * You are assuming that heavy lift is need for SSP. In fact what you require is the phase locking of small (a few Kw) units. - Ian Parker |
#6
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
"Alan Erskine" wrote in message
... wrote in message ... Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Not even if I were using drugs would I be able to imagine something so ridiculous as this. ============================================ "Ridiculous" is a very bad word, because it shuts-off thinking. I might go for "extravagant," but I'd like to point out, if it's out toward the far end of a good imagination, it's realistic, and I have guessed a scenario where the national effort would be directed to building a "small" fleet of these things. If you restart your thinking, maybe you can guess something too. Titeotwawki -- mha [sci.space.policy 208 Aug 09] |
#7
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
On Aug 9, 12:35*am, "Alan Erskine" wrote:
wrote in message ... Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Not even if I were using drugs would I be able to imagine something so ridiculous as this. Why? Are you not familiar with the scaling laws of rocket engines? As early as 1959 the US Army concluded that there was no fundamental reason rockets of several thousand tons thrust could not be built if there were a reason for it. Furthermore,study after study since that time also concluded that vehicle cost could be reduced by; 1) increasing launcher size 2) making components reusable 3) increasing flight rate This proposal achieves that. |
#8
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
On Aug 9, 2:53*am, "Alan Erskine" wrote:
wrote in message ... Now, imagine a 200 GW laser power satellite on orbit. *It has the capacity to beam energy to the upper stage of the vehicle just described. No it doesn't. *There's no such thing as a laser that powerful. Are you familiar with Bob Forward's plans to use laser light sails to send payloads interstellar distances? This rocket is far less powerful than that. *There's also no satellite that can generate that much power. Not today. However the powersats that have been proposed can generate that much power. 480 sq km of sunlight - harvested by a mylar disk 24.72 km in diameter, shaped by very low pressure gas into a near parabolic shape, illuminating a thin film PV/FEL/MEMs device 400 m in diameter - does produce 200 GW of controlled laser energy. Oh, and what if the laser misses the 'target'? * You misapprehend a detail. The laser cannot miss the receiver. That's because the power laser beam is functionally GENERATED BY the receivers 'pilot beam' which interacts with the nonlinear optics IN the laser controlled window to create a conjugate beam that makes its way back precisely to the receiver. This is just the methodology proposed by SDI to shoot down thousands of warheads at once. Except here the reciver is cooperating. Now, what happens when the pilot beam disappears? The power beam shuts off. Of course, in _your_ imagination, it wouldn't do that. Nonsense. I've worked out the details which you haven't yet. Of course that doesn't stop you from growling your nonsense does it? |
#9
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
On Aug 9, 5:23*am, Ian Parker wrote:
On 9 Aug, 04:57, wrote: Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Now imagine a three stage rocket built around this engine. The first stage Consists of a truncated cone that has a base diameter of 196.96 meters and a ring of 36 engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine arrangement - that doubles as a re-entry heat sheild. *The vehicle has 316 support legs around the base to form its own self supporting platform. *These legs are equipped with powered wheels that allow the vehicle to move on the ground after landing and before take off. *The legs also have powered anchors, reusable hold down clamps. *The stage length is 154.88 meters. *The stage masses 217,415 metric tons empty and carries 136,164 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 154.88 meters in diameter. *At the base of the cone, above the 36 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each 27.76 m in diameter, together they carry 816,988 metric tons of liquid oxygen. *Total stage weight is 1,225,567 metric tons. *All 36 engines produce nearly 2 million tons at lift off. The second stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter 112.81 meters. *It is equipped with a ring of six engines around the base - exhausting into a zero height aerospike engine - that also doubles as a re-entry shield. *The vehicles has 36 support legs around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift-off and landing gear during vertical touchdown. The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors as above. *The stage length is 88.71 meters. *The empty stage masses 50,993 metric tons and carries 25,582 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank that is 88.71 meters in diameter. *At the base of the cone, above the 6 engines are 8 smaller oxygen tanks each a sphere 15.90 meters in diameter. *Altogether the 8 tanks carry a total oxygen load of 153,495 metric tons. *Total stage weight is 230,070 metric tons. The third stage Consists of a smaller truncated cone that has a base diameter of 64.61 meters. *It is equipped with a single engine at its base - exhausting at the center of a heat sheild that is equipped with a door. *Smaller vernier engines surround the heat sheild for vehicle recovery. *There are 6 support leges around the base to form its own inter-stage connection during lift off and operate as landing gear during vertical touchdown. *The legs are powered and can also operate as anchors. *The stage length is 50.81 meters. *The empty stage masses 9,580 metric tons and carries 4,806 metric tons of hydrogen in a single spherical tank 50.81 meters in diameter. *28,839 metric tons of oxygen are carried in 8 tanks each 9.11 meters in diameter. *Total stage weight is 43,225 metric tons. Payload fairing The payload fairing rides atop the third stage, and ispart of it. *It consists of 6 clamshell type doors that open 20 degrees and are self powered and have a powered clamping mechanism. *The fairing base sits atop the third stage and is 37 meters in diameter and has an overall length of 91.94 meters. *It is cylindrical from the base for its first 23.78 meters. *It then tapers at a half angle of 15.75 degrees until it comes to a point another 68.16 meters above the top of the cylinder. *Total volume within the fairing 50,000 cubic meters. *Total payload capacity 10,000 metric tons. Piloted option Around the base of the payload fariing is a 37 meter diameter torus that is 3 meters in diameter - this 116 meter long ring is equipped to carry a crew of up to 35 - although *the vehicle is capable of unpiloted operations. *90 tele-operated humaniform robots are attached throughout the fairing volume to allow operators in the pressurized zone access to the cargo and spacecraft. *These robots may also be teleoperated from the ground. Notes on Cost: Fighter aircraft and spacecraft range in prices from $5 million to $10 million per ton. *Transport aircraft range in prices from $1 million to $1.8 million per ton. *Cargo ships cost $1,500 to $2,000 per ton. The variation in cost has to do primarily with non-recurring engineering charges, scale of production, and volume produced - to a smaller degree the sort of environment and the nature of the materials used play a part. *On the scale we're discussing here - it should be possible to achieve $2,000 per ton for structure cost, and $20 per ton propellant cost. *This means each vehicle can be built for $664 million - the payload costs $20 million - and recurring cost per flight is $48 million. Notes on Size: Total mass of the empty vehicle is 331,986 metric tons. *This is about the size of a very large ocean going ship. *Its total length when fully stacked is 386.34 meters. *Total mass at lift off is nearly 1.5 million tons and it burns nearly 1.2 million tons of propellant. Operation The first stage lights, and powers up, and the anchoring gear releases. *The stage rises at 1.3 gees. * When the vehicle reaches 3.5 km/sec the stage falls away and re-enters downrange. *There it executes a powered touchdown at a downrange field. *There it is partly refueled and flown back to the launch center ballistically, in a 'bounce back' maneuver. *At the launch center it re-enters, lands - and motors over to the launch center again to be reused. The second stage ignites and continues upward achieving a final speed of 7.7 km per second and placing the fully loaded 53,225 metric tons into LEO. *The second stage after release of the third stage, deorbits and re-enters so that it lands vertically in a powered touchdown near the launch center. *Once down, it motors to the 400 meter tall assembly crane where it is placed atop the booster stage once again. The third stage ignites and enters a GTO and rises to GEO. *There it executes a circularizing burn - and releases its payload after opening its nose shroud. Once the payload is released and the payload successfully deployed, the reusable kick stage, deorbits slowing to GTO velocity, and re-enters the atmosphere and lands at the launch center - motors over to the tower, and is placed again on the stack after refurbishment. Once the stack is assembled, the vehicle is then refueled and reused. A fleet of 6 vehicles are built to deploy 52 payloads per year - with a cycle time of 6 weeks. * * * * You are assuming that heavy lift is need for SSP. In fact what you require is the phase locking of small (a few Kw) units. * - Ian Parker- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Not when you look at lowest system cost. There are cost differences when scale changes. While it is feasible to build on the scale you speak of, it is not AS cost effective. Demonstration projects using subscale systems - will certainly be built as you suggest. The size I propose here is nearly optimal to transition from chemical launcher, to chemical/laser launcher, and deep space laser probes, and laser recovery of asteroidal feedstock. haha.. even at 200 GW per satellite - which is broken down using conjugate optics into many many beams some as small as 10 kW - you still have to combine 100s of satellites to do heavy lifting with laser energy - so 200 GW satellite size WILL also operate in phase locked mode - sharing a common pilot beam from a common receiver to usefully combine energies to do heavy lifting. What's interesting is if you look at the consumption curve of each person throughout the day and by season at each latititude in an industrial society, and then you shift that curve by longitude and latitutde for each person - and then sumall the component curves - to get a global energy demand curve - you end up with something like 210 TW average power - which peaks at over 300 TW and drops to less than 100 TW - throughout the day. This means there will be 1,500 satellites of this size!! So, they'll certainly operate in a variety of modes - including combining their outputs for space workmostly. Harvesting asteroids, sending out space probes, sending out interstellar probes, and so forth. This means that there are certain times of the day that you'll have the 33 TW available for launch for 10 minutes or so at a time. You'll be limited to launching fewer than 6 vehicles per day - once your system is fully use and integrated into the world's economy. Ultimately - 100 or so of the 200 GW satellites will be permanently dedicate to supporting space operations. |
#10
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Super-heavy lift reusable launcher
On Aug 9, 7:12*am, "Martha Adams" wrote:
"Alan Erskine" wrote in message ... wrote in message .... Imagine a hydrogen oxygen rocket engine with an exit nozzle diameter of 17 meters in diameter, 36 meters long and produces a thrust of 53,300 tonnes with a specific impulse of 450 seconds. Not even if I were using drugs would I be able to imagine something so ridiculous as this. ============================================ "Ridiculous" is a very bad word, because it shuts-off thinking. *I might go for "extravagant," but I'd like to point out, if it's out toward the far end of a good imagination, it's realistic, and I have guessed a scenario where the national effort would be directed to building a "small" fleet of these things. *If you restart your thinking, maybe you can guess something too. Titeotwawki -- mha *[sci.space.policy 208 Aug 09] Reading declassifie reports about what is possible also helps. What's surprising is that many of these reports are 50 years old - and are based on sound engineering and materials science practices of the 1940s and 50s. Using today's abilities - we can far exceed the visionary thinking of the 50s - if the folks doing the thinking had the technical skill to design a rocket with a slide rule and handbook of materials! lol. |
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