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The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 24th 05, 03:50 PM
kenseto
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Default The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames. The SRians compare the passage
of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..

Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?

Ken Seto


  #2  
Old April 24th 05, 04:13 PM
jem
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kenseto wrote:

The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames. The SRians compare the passage
of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..

Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?


Yes
  #3  
Old April 24th 05, 04:25 PM
kenseto
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"jem" wrote in message
news:IGOae.32553$d43.18173@lakeread03...
kenseto wrote:

The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames. The SRians compare the

passage
of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..

Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?


Yes


Ah....but this would mean the existence of universal time (absolute time)
which is denied by SR. Also this is in conflict with what Alan Lightman said
in his book "Great Idea in Physics" page 120. He said: a clock second in one
frame correspond to less than a clock second in another frame. So how do you
explain these apparaent contradictory statements?

Ken Seto


  #4  
Old April 24th 05, 04:40 PM
Dirk Van de moortel
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"kenseto" wrote in message ...
The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames.


No.
This definition for time implies that time is not necessarily
the same for two observers who carry identical clocks.

The SRians compare the passage
of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..


No.
The elapsed time between two events can depend on the
clock on which the times of the events are read.


Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?


No.
It means that you are an imbecile.

Dirk Vdm


  #5  
Old April 24th 05, 05:21 PM
jem
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kenseto wrote:

"jem" wrote in message
news:IGOae.32553$d43.18173@lakeread03...

kenseto wrote:


The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames. The SRians compare the


passage

of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..

Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?


Yes



Ah....but this would mean the existence of universal time (absolute time)
which is denied by SR. Also this is in conflict with what Alan Lightman said
in his book "Great Idea in Physics" page 120. He said: a clock second in one
frame correspond to less than a clock second in another frame. So how do you
explain these apparaent contradictory statements?


Everyday language isn't the appropriate tool for describing what's going
on in Relativity (look to the mathematics of the SR model instead).

A stationary observer measures the duration of one second on a moving
clock to be less than one second on a stationary clock, and in this
sense clock seconds are of different durations in different reference
frames.

However, SR assumes all clocks are identical and are unaffected by
motion, so in this sense one second has the same duration in all
reference frames. Moving clocks simply accumulate fewer seconds than
stationary clocks. This desription is probably the better of the two.

  #6  
Old April 24th 05, 07:06 PM
Morituri-|-Max
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"kenseto" wrote in message
...

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames. The SRians compare the passage
of clock seconds directly in the twin paradox scenario confirms this
interpretation for time..


No paradox. It is the same in all frames. It isn't the same relative to
all frames.


  #7  
Old April 24th 05, 07:10 PM
Morituri-|-Max
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"kenseto" wrote in message
...

Ah....but this would mean the existence of universal time (absolute time)
which is denied by SR.


Nope.

Two twins are 18 years old.

One guy hops on Carl Sagans starship and zips around the galaxy at 99.999%
the speed of light for 5 years.

He comes back to earth and is no longer the same age as his brother.

However, time passed the same for each of them. Seconds passed at the same
rate for each of them.

Common Sensical? Definately Nope. Paradox? Nope.


  #8  
Old April 24th 05, 07:14 PM
Morituri-|-Max
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"jem" wrote in message
news:GFPae.32562$d43.23992@lakeread03...

However, SR assumes all clocks are identical and are unaffected by motion,
so in this sense one second has the same duration in all reference frames.
Moving clocks simply accumulate fewer seconds than stationary clocks.
This desription is probably the better of the two.


Actually clocks accumulate the same number of seconds, they only seem
different if you compare them later.. a second isn't some seperate property
of matter that hops around depending on how fast you are moving, it merely
seems different because everything is relative.


  #9  
Old April 24th 05, 07:15 PM
Uncle Al
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kenseto wrote:

The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

[snip]

Stop while you are nowhere.

--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/qz.pdf
  #10  
Old April 24th 05, 07:20 PM
Lefty
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The SRians Said: Time is What the Clock Measures

Are they members of the APS ?

http://www.aps.org/resources/

This definition for time implies that a clock second represents the same
"duration" (universal time?) in all frames.


This definition is almost completely useless. And while it may be true, time
is most importantly considered the 4th dimension of Mikowski spacetime.


Question:
Does this mean that a clock second is an interval of universal time?



No. What it means is that time (the dimension), does some really weird and
unexpected things. It's all relative.




 




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