Coming full circle

On Thu, 27 Apr 2017 11:02:57 -0400, JBL wrote:

There's something I don't quite get here. I have been an infrequent
visitor to this group off and on for over 20 years and have seldom
posted anything. I have seen more than a fair share of idiots come and
go, and I have even seen folks I had one time respected end up going
down the spiral. One thing that has always amazed me is why on Earth
people keep responding to this guy? I for the life of me can't figure
it out. I have him filtered, so only see him IF someone not filtered
responds to him and it happens ALL the time. Why waste all the time?
The guy is either a desperate attention getter, delusional, or has some
mental aberration but why oh why do people keep responding? Now THAT is
something that always amuses and yet sometimes annoys me.

JBL


Given that someone, somewhere, would be the focus of 1461's attention;
then isn't it better for all concerned if his focus would remain here
(on SAA)?

Bill

--
Email address is a Spam trap.

On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 7:50:24 PM UTC+1, Bill wrote:


Given that someone, somewhere, would be the focus of 1461's attention;
then isn't it better for all concerned if his focus would remain here
(on SAA)?

Bill

--

I still find it amazing that a person would find the 1461 weekdays that correspond to the 1461 rotations confined with 4 orbital complete orbital circuits is a point of derision.

The transition of a planet from an evening appearance to an annual dawn appearance is the entire basis of timekeeping insofar as it provided an annual marker for one of the most magnificent astronomical observations -

"On account of the precession of the rising of Sirius by one day in the course of 4 years therefore it shall be, that the year of 360 days and the 5 days added to their end, so one day shall be from this day after every 4 years added to the 5 epagomenae before the New Year" Canopus Decree, 236 BC

I can't even imagine the care that was taken by whoever made that observation as it is outrageous in

On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 8:07:49 PM UTC+1, Gerald Kelleher wrote:
On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 7:50:24 PM UTC+1, Bill wrote:


Given that someone, somewhere, would be the focus of 1461's attention;
then isn't it better for all concerned if his focus would remain here
(on SAA)?

Bill

--

I still find it amazing that a person would find the 1461 weekdays that correspond to the 1461 rotations confined with 4 orbital complete orbital circuits is a point of derision.

The transition of a planet from an evening appearance to an annual dawn appearance is the entire basis of timekeeping insofar as it provided an annual marker for one of the most magnificent astronomical observations -

"On account of the precession of the rising of Sirius by one day in the course of 4 years therefore it shall be, that the year of 360 days and the 5 days added to their end, so one day shall be from this day after every 4 years added to the 5 epagomenae before the New Year" Canopus Decree, 236 BC

I can't even imagine the care that was taken by whoever made that observation as it is outrageous in terms of attentiveness -

http://www.gautschy.ch/~rita/archast...liacsirius.JPG


The cult of 1465 rotations for 4 annual circuits is so strange and I have detailed exactly where the idea that there are more rotations than weekdays came from via a solar vs sidereal' fiction but I have yet to see a single individual appalled at what they are prepared to believe. Calling me 1461 says more about those who are both radical and fundamentalist like no other people that has existed on Earth, truly !.

On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 12:12:04 PM UTC-7, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

The cult of 1465 rotations for 4 annual circuits is so strange and I have detailed exactly where the idea that there are more rotations than weekdays came from via a solar vs sidereal' fiction but I have yet to see a single individual appalled at what they are prepared to believe. Calling me 1461 says more about those who are both radical and fundamentalist like no other people that has existed on Earth, truly !.

Sure, the Sun rises 1461 times over 4 years, we all know this, and that's how many solar days there are in that same time period.

Sirius (your favorite star) however, rises 1465 times over that same period, since on one day each year it rises *twice* on one day for each of those (4) years. this past year, for example, that day was December 29th here in my neighborhood, go here...

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/cgi-bin/aa_m...diego&height=0

.... and go ahead and scroll down to that date!

As anyone can see for themselves, on December 29th, in my area, Sirius rises at 00:02 41S (just after midnight) and then rises again at 23:58 41S (just before midnight) OF THE SAME DAY! Clearly, Sirius rises one more time per year than does the Sun. Thus, over 4 years it rises 4 more times than does the Sun.

Later this year Sirius will rise twice on October 25th from my area.

Therefore we have... wait for it... sidereal days and years! Just definitions, just like solar days and years.

Is there any possible way that you, or anyone else, can refute this? Do you have even a single logical brain cell in your head?

You can do this same calculation for your own location, choosing from a couple of dozen bright stars, by going here...

http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/mrst.php

.... and entering your city's name in either form A or form B, depending on where in the world you live.

On 04/30/2017 02:50 PM, Bill wrote:
On Thu, 27 Apr 2017 11:02:57 -0400, JBL wrote:

There's something I don't quite get here. I have been an infrequent
visitor to this group off and on for over 20 years and have seldom
posted anything. I have seen more than a fair share of idiots come and
go, and I have even seen folks I had one time respected end up going
down the spiral. One thing that has always amazed me is why on Earth
people keep responding to this guy? I for the life of me can't figure
it out. I have him filtered, so only see him IF someone not filtered
responds to him and it happens ALL the time. Why waste all the time?
The guy is either a desperate attention getter, delusional, or has some
mental aberration but why oh why do people keep responding? Now THAT is
something that always amuses and yet sometimes annoys me.

JBL


Given that someone, somewhere, would be the focus of 1461's attention;
then isn't it better for all concerned if his focus would remain here
(on SAA)?

Bill



I certainly think so, yes, but try telling that to the idiots who
continue responding to him. Even after I posted, someone decided to yet
again re-quote what the primary idiot said, somehow in response to MY
comment, so the secondary idiot has done it yet again, making the
primary's filtered comments visible in my feed. But then again, when
was the last time this group actually remained ON topic, not for the
last 15 years anyhow.

JBL

On Monday, 1 May 2017 02:13:49 UTC+2, JBL wrote:
On 04/30/2017 02:50 PM, Bill wrote:
On Thu, 27 Apr 2017 11:02:57 -0400, JBL wrote:

There's something I don't quite get here. I have been an infrequent
visitor to this group off and on for over 20 years and have seldom
posted anything. I have seen more than a fair share of idiots come and
go, and I have even seen folks I had one time respected end up going
down the spiral. One thing that has always amazed me is why on Earth
people keep responding to this guy? I for the life of me can't figure
it out. I have him filtered, so only see him IF someone not filtered
responds to him and it happens ALL the time. Why waste all the time?
The guy is either a desperate attention getter, delusional, or has some
mental aberration but why oh why do people keep responding? Now THAT is
something that always amuses and yet sometimes annoys me.

JBL


Given that someone, somewhere, would be the focus of 1461's attention;
then isn't it better for all concerned if his focus would remain here
(on SAA)?

Bill



I certainly think so, yes, but try telling that to the idiots who
continue responding to him. Even after I posted, someone decided to yet
again re-quote what the primary idiot said, somehow in response to MY
comment, so the secondary idiot has done it yet again, making the
primary's filtered comments visible in my feed. But then again, when
was the last time this group actually remained ON topic, not for the
last 15 years anyhow.

JBL

s.a.a. has always been a resource for anonymous communication by cooks and dummies.
Years ago it was a hotbed of trolls and fouled-mouthed, anonymous scum.
In a largely visual hobby, it used to be the absolute normal here to attack anyone posting links to images.
Bullying was as commonplace here as the infant school playground and of a similar average intellect much of the time.
The common dough of drooling idiocy was interspersed, like a stale, currant bun, by some seriously bright minds and topical experts.
They stood out like jewels against the backdrop of general tawdriness.
Why should anyone hang around here when crude anonymity provided a waste mountain worthy of a large fleet of river barges?

If it has not molded itself to your personal taste then you always have the nuclear option.
Simply post on topic and see how many respond.
From long experience it will be almost none.
How many ways are there to ask the same basic questions?

s.a.a stagnated into its present form because there are an infinite number of far better alternatives.
With only half a dozen regulars practicing their typing it would be a skewed optimist who hoped for anything better than it is.

I have often likened it to a slowly sinking lifeboat, bobbing on a featureless sea.
Blind and deaf to what goes on around it, the inhabitants are blissfully aware of their situation.
Only those who look in, from time to time _DEMAND_ their filters not be sullied.
Do you pop into your local bar form tie to time and demand the present drunks behave as they did in your own, drunken youth?

The regulars here enjoy power beyond the dreams of avarice.
By sharing this space with so few others their voices are heard with clarity and examined for its content and interest.

Elsewhere they would need to shout above the din.
A far more competitive environment exists out there.
One which constantly pushes standards ever higher.
Alas, its shared insights must be constantly filtered for content which inspires the reader.

It must also be carefully monitored and moderated to avoid anonymous trash gaining any foothold.

Therein lies your answer to all that is "wrong" with s.a.a in your narrow vision.
s.a.a. is but one dingy bar in a backstreet where few dare to venture these days.
It is all tumbleweed, scorpions and dingoes, these days, and no business survives without customers.
Nobody ever cleans the tables nor the vomit on the floor.
But nor is there any barman! So you can become a habitual drunk on your own words.

It has never been the same here since the Internet was diverted as a superhighway bypass for the exchange of knowledge and trash.
Why risk the trolls and bullies on Ye Olde s.a.a. when you have merely "to Google" for an answer to EVERYTHING?
If s.a.a. offends you then become a 7th or 8th regular and post what you'd like to read.
There really are no class monitors here. It's all razor sharp, double edged swords of self discipline at dawn. ;-)

Or, you could start a blog or website to share your brilliant insights and skills.
Or just join a large and respected forum like CN or Stargazer's lounge.
There are Yahoo groups by the thousand for those inclined to a similarly outdated format to Abusenet but with a [very] loosely attached gallery.
There are now countless other outlets for your creativity and genius.
Where you will be rightly and properly admired and respected by serious amateurs across the entire globe.[And, no doubt beyond.]

on s.a.a you will be silently directed to read the notice above the bar:
"If you don't like what you see.. Don't let the door hit you on the way out!"
At least you have a free choice these days.
Just climb back on your over-bored mouse, sin the wheels, take two lefts and a right you're back on the superhighway to the sum of all human knowledge.
Warts, and all. ;-)

On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 11:12:58 PM UTC+1, palsing wrote:
On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 12:12:04 PM UTC-7, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

The cult of 1465 rotations for 4 annual circuits is so strange and I have detailed exactly where the idea that there are more rotations than weekdays came from via a solar vs sidereal' fiction but I have yet to see a single individual appalled at what they are prepared to believe. Calling me 1461 says more about those who are both radical and fundamentalist like no other people that has existed on Earth, truly !.

Sure, the Sun rises 1461 times over 4 years, we all know this, and that's how many solar days there are in that same time period.


As the Earth turns once each weekday the Sun comes into view as your location exits the circle of illumination followed by the appearance of the stars the same day as your location enters the circle of illumination and into the dark side (night). There is also another type of day experienced only at the North and South poles where the Sun comes into view once each year followed by the stars as the polar surface points turn parallel to the orbital plane, this day is the familiar Polar day/night cycle and represents one of the planet's two types of days that exist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFrP6QfbC2g&t=8s

Amazing that the motions which give ungrateful people life are ignored for no other reason than foolish people a few centuries ago made a dumb conclusion and ran with it. It didn't matter that the existing 24 hour system and Lat/Long system determines a maximum Equatorial speed of 1037.5 miles per hour, they went ahead and created havoc with timekeeping and so it remains.

For a person who had so much difficulty with the transition of Venus from an evening appearance (left of the Sun) to a dawn appearance (right of the Sun) the jewel that is the star Sirius makes the same transition as the Earth moves through space and the star is lost from view for a period. Its transition ,when stellar circumpolar motion is extracted is parallel to the orbital plane much as ElNath,Castor and Pollux are seen to do -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdFrE7hWj0A

So, you rely on the continuous stream of the Sun's appearance at dawn followed by the other stars appearance at twilight to determine that indeed the Earth turns once each 24 hours and work from there . If you want to have the Earth turn twice in a single day to account for the appearance of Sirius and the other stars twice in one day then the world you inhabit is far more fundamentalist and radical than anything Western civilization has seen before.

The Polar surface rotation and the attendant Polar day/night cycle is the antidote for the awful situation humanity has found itself in.

On Monday, 1 May 2017 09:29:22 UTC+2, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

The Polar surface rotation and the attendant Polar day/night cycle is the antidote for the awful situation humanity has found itself in.

You can't blame Trumpet@Twit for everything.

He's only been [nominally] in charge of the asylum for 100 days.

People can't enjoy graffiti on what is a new perspective which takes into account the fact that the Earth has a single annual surface rotation to the Sun as a function of its orbital motion with its characteristic polar dawn, noon, twilight and midnight which are better known presently as the Solstices and Equinoxes where this rotation combines with daily rotation.

I have been to the forums where participants need these so-called moderators to watch over them and they all insist that math is necessary to be curious about anything. The fact is that only reliable judgment of normal motions people apply every day in going about their business is needed to make sense of these new insights and indeed the older ones such as witnessing a rotation of the Earth and its two distinctive day/night cycles -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdFrE7hWj0A

People are not mindless beasts, they can escape into imaging which lights up their ability to reason properly and exercise a faculty that has largely been lost to voodoo and those who are in love with their own words.

On Sunday, April 30, 2017 at 11:12:58 PM UTC+1, palsing wrote:


Later this year Sirius will rise twice on October 25th from my area.


The astronomical event known as a heliacal rising and especially of Sirius is a single annual event and represents an orbital marker as the star exists just far enough to the right side of the Sun to escape its glare.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with local horizons associated with sunrise and sunset, it is strictly the relationship of a background star to the central and stationary Sun with the changes in that relationship strictly a consequence of the orbital motion of the Earth. Disentangling the rising of Sirius with the Sun comes about by disengaging stellar circumpolar motion and allowing the Earth's orbital motion to create the transition from an evening star to a morning star. It is a simple matter of combining two graphics to create this important narrative,seen from space it looks something like this -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeQwYrfmvoQ

Seen from the surface of the Earth the stellar transition looks like this -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdFrE7hWj0A


You and so many others got educated on the the planetary transition from an even appearance to a dawn appearance and now you just got one about the background stars and its significance for timekeeping and more importantly - proof of the Earth's orbital motion around the Sun.