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DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 17th 13, 09:42 AM posted to sci.space.history
snidely
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Posts: 1,303
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

Time flies when you're having fun, eh?

Meg Gannon, for NBCNews and Space.com:

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/20-years-ago-novel-dc-x-reusable-rocket-launched-history-6C10936007

/dps

--
Who, me? And what lacuna?


  #2  
Old August 18th 13, 04:11 PM posted to sci.space.history
Greg \(Strider\) Moore
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Posts: 790
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

Time flies when you're having fun, eh?

Meg Gannon, for NBCNews and Space.com:

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/20-years-ago-novel-dc-x-reusable-rocket-launched-history-6C10936007


20 years. Damn.


/dps


--
Greg D. Moore http://greenmountainsoftware.wordpress.com/
CEO QuiCR: Quick, Crowdsourced Responses. http://www.quicr.net

  #3  
Old August 19th 13, 01:25 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.astro,sci.physics,sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_2_]
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Posts: 1,388
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

In article ,
says...

"Greg (Strider) Moore" wrote in message
m...
Time flies when you're having fun, eh?

Meg Gannon, for NBCNews and Space.com:

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/20-years-ago-novel-dc-x-reusable-rocket-launched-history-6C10936007


20 years. Damn.



It is appropriate that SpaceX is testing such similar flight
characteristics as the DC-X is undergoing its celebration:

SpaceX's Grasshopper test rocket flies sideways successfully.
Alan Boyle, Science Editor NBC News
Aug. 14, 2013 at 9:24 PM ET
http://www.nbcnews.com/science/space...lly-6C10923106

Quite. And, they're doing it on what NASA would consider an impossibly
small budget for such a task.

It's also worth noting that between the DC-X flight and today, NASA
spent some time, and quite a lot of money, building, but never actually
flying, the X-vehicle intended to prove reusable launch vehicle
technologies: X-33. In the end, nearly all of the new technologies
incorporated into X-33 would be abandoned, with NASA proclaiming failure
based on the "immaturity" of those technologies. So NASA marches
towards yet another large, (mostly) expendable launch vehicle, more
reminiscent of a 1960's high level approach to the problem than a 2010's
approach.

Jeff

--
"the perennial claim that hypersonic airbreathing propulsion would
magically make space launch cheaper is nonsense -- LOX is much cheaper
than advanced airbreathing engines, and so are the tanks to put it in
and the extra thrust to carry it." - Henry Spencer
  #4  
Old August 19th 13, 06:34 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.astro,sci.physics,sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_2_]
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Posts: 1,388
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

In article ,
says...

It's worth noting that Grasshopper is doing things in the opposite
direction from the DC-X/DC-Y programs.

DC-X started with a reusable vehicle that couldn't make orbit, with
the idea that once they'd proved out the reusability side of things
they could scale things to get something that could make orbit.

Grasshopper is starting with a vehicle that reliably makes orbit and
doing incremental modifications to make large parts of the system
reusable.

The first approach (SSTO reusable) seems the intuitive way to go at
it. However, this seems to be an area where intuition may not be
correct.


Agreed. Starting from a working, presumably profitable, expendable
orbital vehicle seems to be a plus in this case.

But, the other (big) difference here is that SpaceX is starting with an
existing TSTO and working on upgrading/modifying the first stage to be
reusable. This is, arguably, a far easier problem to solve than the
reusable SSTO problem, which NASA said wasn't within our technological
grasp when they tried to explain the failure of X-33 to fly.

Furthermore, it remains to be seen how much work it will take to make
the second stage reusable. I have high hopes that it will prove
possible. But, it could very well be that making the second stage
reusable is very nearly as hard of a problem to solve as the reusable
SSTO problem.

Jeff
--
"the perennial claim that hypersonic airbreathing propulsion would
magically make space launch cheaper is nonsense -- LOX is much cheaper
than advanced airbreathing engines, and so are the tanks to put it in
and the extra thrust to carry it." - Henry Spencer
  #5  
Old August 20th 13, 03:45 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.astro,sci.physics,sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Martha Adams
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Posts: 371
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

On 8/18/2013 5:08 PM, Robert Clark wrote:
"Greg (Strider) Moore" wrote in message
m...
Time flies when you're having fun, eh?

Meg Gannon, for NBCNews and Space.com:

http://www.nbcnews.com/science/20-years-ago-novel-dc-x-reusable-rocket-launched-history-6C10936007


20 years. Damn.



It is appropriate that SpaceX is testing such similar flight
characteristics as the DC-X is undergoing its celebration:

SpaceX's Grasshopper test rocket flies sideways successfully.
Alan Boyle, Science Editor NBC News
Aug. 14, 2013 at 9:24 PM ET
http://www.nbcnews.com/science/space...lly-6C10923106

Bob Clark


================================================== ====

Thanks for reminders I was a little off base there. At the
moment I wrote my head was full of video imagery and of my
old quote, '...as God and Heinlein intended.' With some
frustration thrown in from the decades getting wasted by
politicians vs urgent preparations for an unknown future
by squabbling and grafty politicians. Who like wars to
make payoff for their 'friendly' military arms makers,
while space access work must accomplish miracles on an
uncertain and inappropriately tiny budget.

Yes, I recall Apollo landers and the DCX more recently,
thanks for the tickle I needed at the moment.

Titeotwawki -- Martha Adams [Tues 2013 Aug 20]



  #6  
Old August 26th 13, 12:00 AM posted to sci.space.history
OM[_19_]
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Posts: 34
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

On Monday, August 19, 2013 7:25:16 AM UTC-5, Jeff Findley wrote:

It's also worth noting that between the DC-X flight and today, NASA
spent some time, and quite a lot of money, building, but never actually
flying, the X-vehicle intended to prove reusable launch vehicle
technologies: X-33.


....This isn't that surprising, to be honest. Something that's been bounced around over the years since the only space history presence on Usenet was sci.columbia was the fact that before and after the "Glory Days" there was, and still is, a heavy influence upon NASA to follow the "Langley Approach". In other words, Langley's talented group going back to the origins of the N.A.C.A. came up with ideas/discoveries/designs, published papers on them, and then let others come along and actually *do* something with the info. "That's not the way we do things at Langley" was a credo/dogma that, had it not been shelved by the double-whammy of Sputnik and Gagarin, would have arguably kept the US out of the crash programs that participation in the Space Race called for, if not to mention closing the "Missile Gap" regardless of whether it was for real or fueled by mutual suspicion/distrust. Once that flag was on the Moon, however, the "Langley Approach" clearly began to hold more sway than "Go Fever" had for the previous decade.

[sigh] Once upon a time, this thread would have brought on all sorts of debates/flamewars, only to be eventually corrected into silence by Henry...

OM
  #7  
Old September 16th 13, 01:06 PM posted to rec.arts.sf.science,sci.astro,sci.physics,sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Jeff Findley[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,388
Default DC-X Anniversary -- 20 on the 18th

In article ,
says...

The DC-X may yet live again:

Jeff Foust
?@jeff_foust
"DARPA's Pam Melroy: about to kick off Experimental Spaceplane 1 (XS-1)
program, a reusable 1st stage. Industry day early OCtober. #aiaaspace"
https://twitter.com/jeff_foust/statu...77568337166336

The planned suborbital follow on to the DC-X might have been able to
fulfill such a role. And the X-33 even if you replaced the failed composite
tanks with aluminum-lithium could still have served this purpose as a
reusable first stage.


DARPA To Start Reusable Launch Vehicle Program
By Jeff Foust, special to SpaceNews.com | Sep. 12, 2013
http://www.spacenews.com/article/lau...arpa-to-start-
reusable-launch-vehicle-program

Jeff
--
"the perennial claim that hypersonic airbreathing propulsion would
magically make space launch cheaper is nonsense -- LOX is much cheaper
than advanced airbreathing engines, and so are the tanks to put it in
and the extra thrust to carry it." - Henry Spencer
 




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