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...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 12th 11, 09:27 PM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Jonathan
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Posts: 200
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


"bob haller" wrote in message
...

i sure hope this map is wrong


http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/438/fallout.jpg



What bothers me about the map is the radiation
doesn't dissipate very fast.

I don't know how much if any was released, it may
be small, but whatever amount, it's headed for the
US northwest coast and in a big hurry!


Northwest Pacific infrared loop
http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/mtsat/nwpac/loop-ir2.html

Northwest Pacific rainbow color infrared loop
http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/mtsat/nwpac/loop-rb.html


NHC Latest satellite imagery
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/satellite.shtml






  #12  
Old March 12th 11, 09:37 PM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Jonathan
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Posts: 200
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


"Jonathan" wrote in message
...



Putting the first two loops below together, looks like
all of California and north might be a fallout zone.
And in a lot less than ten days it look like.


Northwest Pacific infrared loop
http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/mtsat/nwpac/loop-ir2.html


Northeast Pacific infrared loop
http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/west/nepac/loop-avn.html

.................

NHC Latest satellite imagery
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/satellite.shtml




  #13  
Old March 12th 11, 09:51 PM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Brad Guth[_3_]
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Posts: 15,175
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???

On Mar 12, 11:51*am, bob haller wrote:
On Mar 12, 2:40*pm, Brad Guth wrote:



On Mar 12, 11:11*am, bob haller wrote:


On Mar 12, 2:07*pm, Brad Guth wrote:


On Mar 12, 10:57*am, bob haller wrote:


On Mar 12, 1:43*pm, Brad Guth wrote:


On Mar 12, 7:38*am, "Jonathan" wrote:


Look at this explosion at *47 seconds into the video.
A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
heavily reinforced containment building, must have
been the result of a badly overheated reactor.


Japan claims the reactor is intact. But that large of an explosion
could have caused all kinds of damage and leaks that
have yet to be found, or admitted by the Japanese govt.


Japan Nuclear Reactor EXPLOSION Fukushima Meltdownhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvC4WQrQwTs


Japan Nuclear Fallout Map? *(gulp)http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/438/fallout.jpg


Fukushima overhead viewhttp://everist.org/pics/misc/fukushima_worse.png


Japan is reporting the prevailing winds are out to sea.
They've already evacuated 300,000 from the area.
And Fukushima #1 is one of the largest 25 reactors
in the world. And was built ...way back..in 1970.
The first reactor built by it's builder.


s


That kind of reactor coolant dispersed radiation is certainly bad
news, especially downwind of those secondary spent fuel elements like
plutonium, but it's not likely to be quite as bad off as it could be.
Most of that reactor core will manage to burn its way through the
foundation of its containment, and due to gravity it'll eventually
sink out of sight without another steam explosion unless water is
added.


There’s a good chance that their primary containment vessel is either
badly damaged or nearly worthless. (it’s certainly no longer a sealed
containment)


However, this could get a whole lot worse, if any storm(s) or odd
weather brings any of that nasty cloud of radioactive steam/vapor back
towards land, they may have no option but to abandon ship (so to
speak).


Unfortunately, the ongoing ocean contamination until that containment
burn-through and its fuel sinking into the bedrock/crust of Earth may
take months, or possibly years before it’s 100% nullified. *On it’s
way into the crust/bedrock, there will be geothermal and radioactive
fuel saturated vapor explosions as that extremely hot core of mostly
uranium continues to interact with ground water or whatever artificial
coolant seawater getting pumped down the hole that’s melting its way
through basalt, and that superheated steam transported radiation will
likely become atmospheric and downwind nasty. *The local and global
cleanup cost to Japan should only be a few trillion dollars per year,
and with 128 million should only cost each and every person $10,000/
year once the bulk of those damaged reactors are nullified.


The good corporate news for other Big Energy, is this makes their BP
blowout fiasco seem woefully insignificant, and their oil as well as
coal worth even more. *Other than that, Japan has just put itself into
a no-win foreclosure, unless their rich and powerful start forking out
tens of billions per month.


Again, where and why were all those radon gas detections of pending
earthquakes kept secret or ignored?


*http://translate.google.com/#
*Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


scientists treport nuke plants worldwide arent built to survive 8 and
9 earthquakes since they are so rare, and would cost so much to build
they wouldnt be cost effective so entually a big one hits. They are
now pumping sea water to try and cool the core.


Will a big chunk of japan end up resembling this?


http://www.kiddofspeed.com/chernobyl-revisited/


Perhaps not nearly as bad as Chernobyl, unless another core goes
postal.


Backup cooling systems shouldn't have failed, nor having been so
poorly configured in the first place. *Seawater cooling is their last
resort, though really bad for the fish and anything else that survives
in the ocean.


Why weren't the neutralizing control rods automatically inserted?


Were these reactors being operated and maintained by monkeys?


*http://translate.google.com/#
*Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


wonder if fred j mc call will ever post here again? he spent so much
time posting about how safe nuke power is..... well was.


the main power failed and the backup generators started but failed
because of eartquake damage......


and heres the fallout maphttp://www.kiddofspeed.com/chernobyl-revisited/


There are safer reactors and obviously better protected backup systems
for cooling. *However, nothing beats the failsafe nature of a reactor
that's fueled by thorium.


As is, looks like the next upgrade for Japan's nuclear energy will
have to be rated to survive a 9.5, such as putting it on a very large
floating platform that can be towed out to sea and sunk in the deepest
trench would do the trick.


*http://translate.google.com/#
*Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -


I doubt that would help, theres a theory that seems possible since the
offical looking fallout map shows fatal levels of radiation in the
western US in about 10 days.

The reactor exploded freeing much of its fuel which burned and is now
in the atmosphere.

When chernobyl disaster occured only a tiny fraction of the core
burned, 95% of the fuel is still on site covered by that concrete
scarphous, however thats spelled.

so this accident can be far far worse.

If its true and a fatal cloud is coming to the western US there will
be mass ghaos as never seen before.

i sure hope this map is wrong

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/438/fallout.jpg


That's a worse possible case event whereas the fuel is literally
exploded and vaporized into the atmosphere. I don't believe there's
any chance of that happening, and there's not even enough fuel to
cover that much of our part of Earth with such a lethal dosage anyway,
that is unless all 4 reactors go thermonuclear and those winds remain
exactly right. However, 1% of that dosage could become highly
problematic.

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

  #14  
Old March 12th 11, 10:41 PM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Robert Clark
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Posts: 1,150
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???

On Mar 12, 10:38*am, "Jonathan" wrote:
Look at this explosion at *47 seconds into the video.
A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
heavily reinforced containment building, must have
been the result of a badly overheated reactor.

Japan claims the reactor is intact. But that large of an explosion
could have caused all kinds of damage and leaks that
have yet to be found, or admitted by the Japanese govt.

Japan Nuclear Reactor EXPLOSION Fukushima Meltdownhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvC4WQrQwTs


Battle to stabilise earthquake reactors
12 March 2011.
UPDATE 6: 10.15 am GMT
"Three of Fukushima Daiichi's six reactors were in operation when
yesterday's quake hit, at which point they shut down automatically and
commenced removal of residual heat with the help of emergency diesel
generators. These suddenly stopped about an hour later, and this has
been put down to tsunami flooding by the International Atomic Energy
Agency (IAEA).
"The loss of the diesels led the plant owners Tokyo Electric Power
Company (Tepco) to immediately notify the government of a technical
emergency situation, which allows officials to take additional
precautionary measures.
Even now, the primary focus of work at the site remains to connect
enough portable power modules to fully replace the diesels and enable
the full operation of cooling systems."
http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/RS...1203111 .html

If the main problem is just getting enough portable power there then
there are portable gas turbine generators capable of putting out 10's
of megawatts. You could also use the power from a nuclear aircraft
carrier at a power range of 200 megawatts, though there might concern
about bringing it off shore in a zone subject to tsunamis.



Bob Clark

  #15  
Old March 13th 11, 12:41 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Sylvia Else[_2_]
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Posts: 458
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???

On 13/03/2011 2:38 AM, Jonathan wrote:
Look at this explosion at 47 seconds into the video.
A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
heavily reinforced containment building, must have
been the result of a badly overheated reactor.


A claim that appears to be wrong in almost every detail.

Sadly, a public perception that the reactor suffered a catastrophic
meltdown will probably persist, and spoil the chances of nuclear
reactors being built in the future. Since power is still required, coal
will be used instead.

Sylvia,
  #16  
Old March 13th 11, 01:00 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Androcles[_40_]
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Posts: 94
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


"Sylvia Else" wrote in message
...
| On 13/03/2011 2:38 AM, Jonathan wrote:
| Look at this explosion at 47 seconds into the video.
| A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
| heavily reinforced containment building, must have
| been the result of a badly overheated reactor.
|
| A claim that appears to be wrong in almost every detail.
|
| Sadly, a public perception that the reactor suffered a catastrophic
| meltdown will probably persist, and spoil the chances of nuclear
| reactors being built in the future. Since power is still required, coal
| will be used instead.
|
The reactor suffered a catastrophic earthquake in a region known to
be prone to catastrophic earthquakes. And where did this "hydrogen"
come from to produce a chemical reaction with oxygen, rather than
high pressure steam? Hype hype hype hydrogen bad, hydrogen bombs
and Hindenbergs. Green good.
An earthquake is going to hit Los Angeles. Are they rushing to leave?
No, of course not, they haven't been discovered as great movie stars
yet. But when it does, please help, we need your money. Lots of money.




  #17  
Old March 13th 11, 01:18 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
[email protected] |
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Posts: 307
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


An earthquake is going to hit Los Angeles. Are they rushing to leave?
No, of course not, they haven't been discovered as great movie stars
yet. But when it does, please help, we need your money. Lots of money.



Better hope the 30 foot sea wall protects the California coast
nuclear reactor when the great waves come into shore from
the big one off shore.

The devil is in the details with type of disaster.

Some designs are less dangerous than others.
I won't say some are safer than others ;-)............rig
  #18  
Old March 13th 11, 01:38 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Androcles[_40_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 94
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


wrote in message
...
|
| An earthquake is going to hit Los Angeles. Are they rushing to leave?
| No, of course not, they haven't been discovered as great movie stars
| yet. But when it does, please help, we need your money. Lots of money.
|
|
| Better hope the 30 foot sea wall protects the California coast
| nuclear reactor when the great waves come into shore from
| the big one off shore.
|
| The devil is in the details with type of disaster.
|
| Some designs are less dangerous than others.
| I won't say some are safer than others ;-)............rig
|

Better hope the levies can protect New Orleans against Katrina... oh
wait, they didn't. Too late, never mind. Still, Americans can always
pray, they are good at that. Thank gawd I'm saved, and if I'm not
then its gawd's will. Send money.




  #19  
Old March 13th 11, 02:32 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Harold Burton
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Posts: 27
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan - a figment of an idiot's imagination

In article ,
Sylvia Else wrote:

On 13/03/2011 2:38 AM, Jonathan wrote:
Look at this explosion at 47 seconds into the video.
A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
heavily reinforced containment building, must have
been the result of a badly overheated reactor.



A claim that appears to be wrong in almost every detail.




What do you expect from an idiot like Jonathan?
  #20  
Old March 13th 11, 03:06 AM posted to rec.arts.poems,sci.space.policy,alt.politics,sci.physics
Jonathan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 200
Default ...Nuclear MELTDOWN in Japan, is US Threatened???


"Sylvia Else" wrote in message
...
On 13/03/2011 2:38 AM, Jonathan wrote:
Look at this explosion at 47 seconds into the video.
A violent hydrogen explosion, demolishing such a
heavily reinforced containment building, must have
been the result of a badly overheated reactor.


A claim that appears to be wrong in almost every detail.

Sadly, a public perception that the reactor suffered a catastrophic
meltdown will probably persist, and spoil the chances of nuclear reactors
being built in the future. Since power is still required, coal will be
used instead.




TOKYO (Nikkei)--Tokyo Electric Power Co.'s (9501) Fukushima No. 1 nuclear
plant in Fukushima Prefecture may be experiencing a meltdown in the wake of
Friday's massive earthquake, the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency said
Saturday.

The agency said cesium, a radioactive material produced by nuclear fission,
was detected near the facility.

Fuel rods were exposed to the air as the water level in the reactor fell,
said one observer.
http://e.nikkei.com/e/fr/tnks/Nni20110312D12JF423.htm



Reports of problem at 2nd Japan nuclear reactor
Posted by CBSNews.com staff

"They are working furiously to find a solution to cool the core, and this
afternoon in Europe we heard that they have begun to inject sea water into
the core," said Mark Hibbs, a senior associate at the Nuclear Policy Program
for the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. "That is an indication
of how serious the problem is and how the Japanese had to resort to unusual
and improvised solutions to cool the reactor core."
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_1...in;contentBody


Fukushima Nuclear Power Plant

One of the monitoring posts is also indicating higher than normal
level."[30] At 13:30 JST, radioactive caesium-137 was detected near reactor
1, which indicates that the core had experienced a partial-meltdown. Kyodo
News Service later reported that partial melting had occurred.

In a press conference, a speaker of the Japanese nuclear authorities was
translated to English as having said that a nuclear meltdown was in progress
and that a pipe had burst at unit 1. However, the Japanese prime minister
soon denied that a nuclear meltdown was in progress
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fukushi...quake_event s


I'm glad you're so confident about the safety of a reactor built in 1967
from a design dating to the 1950's. And you're confidence of the
candor of Japanese public officials is also rather, well... quaint~

s


Sylvia,





 




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