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Airplane-like first stage



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 15th 09, 12:45 PM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Greg D. Moore \(Strider\)[_151_]
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Default Airplane-like first stage

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
telephone...
Two other things that hit me as odd were the bats flying into the parked
F-117's at night because they couldn't echo-locate them, and soundwave
focused cameras not getting them into proper focus for the same reason,
although maybe the paint does something to sound reflection also.


Now that you mention it, I do recall that.

Batts are amazing creatures when it comes to their echolocation abilities,
but far from perfect. I do wonder if the flat surface on an F-117 could
really redirect a soundwave so successfully that not enough energy was
returned to a bat's ears. I tend to doubt it. But I suspect if it's true,
it had more to do with the shape than the paint.

Then there's the B-2 paperwork claim.
At least it's better than another book I had where the X-15 was dropped
from a B-29.

Pat




--
Greg Moore
Ask me about lily, an RPI based CMC.


  #2  
Old August 16th 09, 05:39 PM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Default Airplane-like first stage

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:


Batts are amazing creatures when it comes to their echolocation abilities,
but far from perfect.


I saw one run into a chain link fence once.

I do wonder if the flat surface on an F-117 could
really redirect a soundwave so successfully that not enough energy was
returned to a bat's ears. I tend to doubt it. But I suspect if it's true,
it had more to do with the shape than the paint.



If that were the case, you would think they would run into all sorts of
man-made objects with flat surfaces that weren't ninety degrees on to
their sonar.

Pat
  #3  
Old August 16th 09, 10:12 PM posted to sci.space.history
OM[_6_]
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Default Airplane-like first stage

On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 11:39:40 -0500, Pat Flannery
wrote:

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:


Batts are amazing creatures when it comes to their echolocation abilities,
but far from perfect.


I saw one run into a chain link fence once.


....Austin has become somewhat renown for its bat population in the
past couple of decades. One of the ordinances that keeps getting -
dare I say it? - batted around every few years is requiring homeowners
within a mile of the Town Lake Bridge, where the big portion of the
bat population hangs out(*), to either replace their chain link fences
with solid wooden ones, or buy those "privacy strips" that you can
weave through the links. The idea is to give the bats enough surface
for their radar to bounce off of and keep them from getting hung up in
the fences. The problem is sheer cost and logistics combined with the
fact that the only ones demanding it are some really weird people that
even the enviromentalist neo-hippies tend to avoid.

Besides that, it doesn't happen that often, and there's about two or
three million bats running around anyway, so who's going to miss a
small few...



(*) You may think I'm batty, but I"m reall not trying to be punny
about this one for a change. Really.
OM
--
]=====================================[
] OMBlog - http://www.io.com/~o_m/omworld [
] Let's face it: Sometimes you *need* [
] an obnoxious opinion in your day! [
]=====================================[
  #4  
Old August 17th 09, 01:59 AM posted to sci.space.history
Pat Flannery
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Default Airplane-like first stage

OM wrote:

...Austin has become somewhat renown for its bat population in the
past couple of decades. One of the ordinances that keeps getting -
dare I say it? - batted around every few years is requiring homeowners
within a mile of the Town Lake Bridge, where the big portion of the
bat population hangs out(*), to either replace their chain link fences
with solid wooden ones, or buy those "privacy strips" that you can
weave through the links. The idea is to give the bats enough surface
for their radar to bounce off of and keep them from getting hung up in
the fences.


You would think they could detect them, although maybe their sonar
scatters off of the rounded surfaces of the wire the fences are made out
of. The one I saw just bounced off the fence, sat down on the grass
dazed for a few moments, then flew off.
You may not want too many of them around, as they are quite prone to
carrying rabies.

Pat
  #5  
Old August 17th 09, 03:48 AM posted to sci.space.history
Greg D. Moore \(Strider\)[_153_]
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Default Airplane-like first stage

"Pat Flannery" wrote in message
...

You would think they could detect them, although maybe their sonar
scatters off of the rounded surfaces of the wire the fences are made out
of. The one I saw just bounced off the fence, sat down on the grass dazed
for a few moments, then flew off.


I think more the issue is the number of signals. With all the time I've
spent in caves, I've never had a bat fly into my hair, like the old myth.


You may not want too many of them around, as they are quite prone to
carrying rabies.


Yes and no. The colonies that do get it tend burn through quickly. I
suspect more lifes are saved by bat control of the population than die due
to rabies.



Pat





--
Greg Moore
Ask me about lily, an RPI based CMC.


  #6  
Old August 17th 09, 04:05 AM posted to sci.space.history
Greg D. Moore \(Strider\)[_154_]
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Default Airplane-like first stage

"OM" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 11:39:40 -0500, Pat Flannery
wrote:

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:


Batts are amazing creatures when it comes to their echolocation
abilities,
but far from perfect.


I saw one run into a chain link fence once.


...Austin has become somewhat renown for its bat population in the
past couple of decades. One of the ordinances that keeps getting -
dare I say it? - batted around every few years is requiring homeowners
within a mile of the Town Lake Bridge, where the big portion of the
bat population hangs out(*), to either replace their chain link fences
with solid wooden ones, or buy those "privacy strips" that you can
weave through the links. The idea is to give the bats enough surface
for their radar to bounce off of and keep them from getting hung up in
the fences. The problem is sheer cost and logistics combined with the
fact that the only ones demanding it are some really weird people that
even the enviromentalist neo-hippies tend to avoid.


I think you mean sonar. ;-)


Besides that, it doesn't happen that often, and there's about two or
three million bats running around anyway, so who's going to miss a
small few...


Unfortunately in other parts of the country, right now bats are seeing a
die-off of 90-100% in some colonies due to white nose syndrome.



--
Greg Moore
Ask me about lily, an RPI based CMC.


  #7  
Old August 17th 09, 02:58 PM posted to sci.space.history
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Airplane-like first stage

OM wrote:
If you get bit by one locally,
you still go in for shots, but the local quacks aren't as worried
about it as they were ten years ago. The bat-sperts can't explain it,
but the risk isn't as great as it is in other areas where bats are
plentiful.


In the book "Bat Bomb" there was speculation that constant low level
exposure to bat feces dust could allow one to build up a resistance to
rabies, rather like if one had been vaccinated against it.

Pat
  #8  
Old August 17th 09, 03:03 PM posted to sci.space.history
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Airplane-like first stage

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:
I think more the issue is the number of signals. With all the time I've
spent in caves, I've never had a bat fly into my hair, like the old myth.


I've had several of them fly within a foot or so of me while out star
watching, but never had one collide with me either.



You may not want too many of them around, as they are quite prone to
carrying rabies.


Yes and no. The colonies that do get it tend burn through quickly. I
suspect more lifes are saved by bat control of the population than die due
to rabies.


Bat control of the _what_ population?
Or is this something about the undead?

Pat

  #9  
Old August 17th 09, 03:08 PM posted to sci.space.history
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Airplane-like first stage

Greg D. Moore (Strider) wrote:The idea is to give the bats enough surface
for their radar to bounce off of and keep them from getting hung up in
the fences. The problem is sheer cost and logistics combined with the
fact that the only ones demanding it are some really weird people that
even the enviromentalist neo-hippies tend to avoid.


I think you mean sonar. ;-)


Do you ever notice that pretty much everyone calls it "radar"?
Anyway, bats versus moth ACM (Acoustic Counter Measures):
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/21/science/21objam.html

Pat
  #10  
Old August 17th 09, 03:17 PM posted to sci.space.history
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Airplane-like first stage

OM wrote:

...They're not seeing anything like that down here. Otherwise there's
be hundreds of hippies and bat-freaks screaming and yelling that it's
our air conditioners and SUVs causing it.


Something weird is going on up here in Jamestown this year; our
now-normal early summer bird die-off due to West Nile Virus has once
again occurred, leaving the crows ruling the air, but now virtually the
whole flying insect population has vanished as well, except for some
dragonflies and gnats. I've see around three houseflies the whole
summer, and you can go outside at night with no mosquitoes around to
bite you.

Pat
 




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