Private, uncrewed, suborbital test flights to start this year.

In sci.space.history Fred J. McCall wrote:
Rick Jones wrote:

What is that in English?-) - for example is 10,000 MSL 10,000 feet
or something else?


It's feet, which are the standard aviation units for altitude until
you get into what was the Russian sphere. It's MSL as opposed to
HAE.

MSL - Mean Sea Level? What does HAE translate to?

rick
--
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where do you want to be today?
these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway...
feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH...

In sci.space.policy Pat Flannery wrote:

I worked as a weather reporter at an airport for twelve years, and
we used MSL (Mean Sea Level) and AGL (Above Ground Level). For
example, Jamestown airport is at 1,497 feet above MSL, so an
aircraft flying 2,000 feet overhead would be flying at 3,497 MSL and
2,000 feet AGL. HAE is a abbreviation used with GPS that means
Height Above Ellipsoid:
http://webhelp.esri.com/arcpad/8.0/r..._gpsheight.htm

To explain some of what that URL was saying, I searched on height
above ellipsoid and came across
http://www.esri.com/news/arcuser/0703/geoid1of3.html

rick
--
the road to hell is paved with business decisions...
these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway...
feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH...

On 5/16/2011 6:01 AM, Rick Jones wrote:
In sci.space.history Fred J. wrote:
Rick wrote:

What is that in English?-) - for example is 10,000 MSL 10,000 feet
or something else?


It's feet, which are the standard aviation units for altitude until
you get into what was the Russian sphere. It's MSL as opposed to
HAE.

MSL - Mean Sea Level? What does HAE translate to?

I worked as a weather reporter at an airport for twelve years, and we
used MSL (Mean Sea Level) and AGL (Above Ground Level).
For example, Jamestown airport is at 1,497 feet above MSL, so an
aircraft flying 2,000 feet overhead would be flying at 3,497 MSL and
2,000 feet AGL.
HAE is a abbreviation used with GPS that means Height Above Ellipsoid:
http://webhelp.esri.com/arcpad/8.0/r..._gpsheight.htm

Pat

Pat

On May 11, 11:56*pm, Robert Clark wrote:
On Jan 6, 5:42*am, Robert Clark wrote:

*All of Armadillo Aerospace, Blue Origins, and Masten Space Systems
plan on making uncrewed suborbital test flights this year. And Blue
Origins believes they can begin crewed suborbital test flights next
year. This could be the time frame in which SpaceShipTwo will be
making its firstsuborbitaltest flights.
*See the links to the respective suborbital programs he

Suborbital RLV.
https://c3.ndc.nasa.gov/flightopport...rms/suborbital


Just saw this:

Blue Origin carrying out "rocket launch activity".
"NOTAM Text:
"FDC 1/0432 ZAB NM.. TEMPORARY FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS VAN HORN TX.
EFFECTIVE 1105051200 UTC UNTIL 1105051900 UTC. PURSUANT TO 14 CFR
SECTION 91.143 TEMPORARY FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS ARE IN EFFECT DUE TO
ROCKET LAUNCH ACTIVITY WITHIN A 17 NAUTICAL MILE RADIUS OF 312706N/
1044546W OR THE SALT FLAT /SFL/ VORTAC 125 DEGREE RADIAL AT 24.3
NAUTICAL MILES, SFC TO 10,000 MSL. BLUE ORIGIN LLC, 805-598-9309 IS IN
CHARGE OF THE OPERATION. ABQ ARTCC /ZAB/ 505-856-4500 IS THE FAA
COORDINATION FACILITY."http://hobbyspace.com/nucleus/?itemid=29314

*And Armadillo Aerospace was set to make their first test flight to
100,000 ft, 30 km, in April, but an unauthorized person, a hunter, in
the launch zone caused them to scrub the launch:

Armadillo Aerospace's "Tube Rocket" 'Stig' completed.
Industry News by BEN BROCKERT, Armadillo Aerospace
SUNDAY, APRIL 03, 2011http://www.rocketryplanet.com/content/view/3593/29/#ixzz1M6apKJvr

*Unfortunately, White Sands Missile Range (WSMR) which is next door to
the launch site at SpacePort America has not granted a right to launch
since the canceled April flight.


Copenhagen Suborbitals is shotting for a Thursday, June 2nd test
flight:

Copenhagen Suborbitals Upcoming Launch Attempt in June.
by Nancy Atkinson on May 30, 2011
http://www.universetoday.com/86097/c...tempt-in-june/

Their first attempt was scrubbed in August last year due to a stuck
LOX valve:

Danish rocketeers postpone launch.
5 September 2010 Last updated at 09:43 ET
By Jonathan Amos, Science correspondent, BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034


Bob Clark

On May 31, 4:22*pm, Robert Clark wrote:
...
*And Armadillo Aerospace was set to make their first test flight to
100,000 ft, 30 km, in April, but an unauthorized person, a hunter, in
the launch zone caused them to scrub the launch:

Armadillo Aerospace's "Tube Rocket" 'Stig' completed.
Industry News by BEN BROCKERT, Armadillo Aerospace
SUNDAY, APRIL 03, 2011http://www.rocketryplanet.com/content/view/3593/29/#ixzz1M6apKJvr

*Unfortunately, White Sands Missile Range (WSMR) which is next door to
the launch site at SpacePort America has not granted a right to launch
since the canceled April flight.

*Copenhagen Suborbitals is shotting for a Thursday, June 2nd test
flight:

Copenhagen Suborbitals Upcoming Launch Attempt in June.
by Nancy Atkinson on May 30, 2011http://www.universetoday.com/86097/copenhagen-suborbitals-upcoming-la...

* Their first attempt was scrubbed in August last year due to a stuck
LOX valve:

Danish rocketeers postpone launch.
5 September 2010 Last updated at 09:43 ET
By Jonathan Amos, Science correspondent, BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034


Congratulations to Copenhagen Suborbitals in succeeding in the
launch. However, the reports are that it veered off course and
underwent an automatic abort. It reached an altitude of 2.5 km of the
planned 15 to 16 km.
It appears their next focus will have to be on attitude and guidance
control.

Bob Clark

In article 3e59d3ad-292c-4c6b-bb58-bd1894f53b97
@c20g2000vbv.googlegroups.com, says...

On May 31, 4:22*pm, Robert Clark wrote:
...
*And Armadillo Aerospace was set to make their first test flight to
100,000 ft, 30 km, in April, but an unauthorized person, a hunter, in
the launch zone caused them to scrub the launch:

Armadillo Aerospace's "Tube Rocket" 'Stig' completed.
Industry News by BEN BROCKERT, Armadillo Aerospace
SUNDAY, APRIL 03, 2011http://www.rocketryplanet.com/content/view/3593/29/#ixzz1M6apKJvr

*Unfortunately, White Sands Missile Range (WSMR) which is next door to
the launch site at SpacePort America has not granted a right to launch
since the canceled April flight.

*Copenhagen Suborbitals is shotting for a Thursday, June 2nd test
flight:

Copenhagen Suborbitals Upcoming Launch Attempt in June.
by Nancy Atkinson on May 30, 2011http://www.universetoday.com/86097/copenhagen-suborbitals-upcoming-la...

* Their first attempt was scrubbed in August last year due to a stuck
LOX valve:

Danish rocketeers postpone launch.
5 September 2010 Last updated at 09:43 ET
By Jonathan Amos, Science correspondent, BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034


Congratulations to Copenhagen Suborbitals in succeeding in the
launch. However, the reports are that it veered off course and
underwent an automatic abort. It reached an altitude of 2.5 km of the
planned 15 to 16 km.
It appears their next focus will have to be on attitude and guidance
control.

Reports on ARocket indicate that the trajectory problem was understood
before the launch. This is essentially because the rocket had *no*
active guidance system. The plan is that the operational vehicle will
have active guidance.

Still, the launch was done anyway in order to prove that certain other
systems work. The sea launch worked. The rocket engine worked (even if
it did have problems with combustion stability). For a first launch of
prototype hardware, it was a successful "baby step" towards the eventual
goal of launching a person.

Jeff
--
" Solids are a branch of fireworks, not rocketry. :-) :-) ", Henry
Spencer 1/28/2011

On Mon, 6 Jun 2011 09:39:38 -0400, Jeff Findley
wrote:

In article 3e59d3ad-292c-4c6b-bb58-bd1894f53b97
, says...

On May 31, 4:22*pm, Robert Clark wrote:
...
*And Armadillo Aerospace was set to make their first test flight to
100,000 ft, 30 km, in April, but an unauthorized person, a hunter, in
the launch zone caused them to scrub the launch:

Armadillo Aerospace's "Tube Rocket" 'Stig' completed.
Industry News by BEN BROCKERT, Armadillo Aerospace
SUNDAY, APRIL 03, 2011http://www.rocketryplanet.com/content/view/3593/29/#ixzz1M6apKJvr

*Unfortunately, White Sands Missile Range (WSMR) which is next door to
the launch site at SpacePort America has not granted a right to launch
since the canceled April flight.

*Copenhagen Suborbitals is shotting for a Thursday, June 2nd test
flight:

Copenhagen Suborbitals Upcoming Launch Attempt in June.
by Nancy Atkinson on May 30, 2011http://www.universetoday.com/86097/copenhagen-suborbitals-upcoming-la...

* Their first attempt was scrubbed in August last year due to a stuck
LOX valve:

Danish rocketeers postpone launch.
5 September 2010 Last updated at 09:43 ET
By Jonathan Amos, Science correspondent, BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034


Congratulations to Copenhagen Suborbitals in succeeding in the
launch. However, the reports are that it veered off course and
underwent an automatic abort. It reached an altitude of 2.5 km of the
planned 15 to 16 km.
It appears their next focus will have to be on attitude and guidance
control.

Reports on ARocket indicate that the trajectory problem was understood
before the launch. This is essentially because the rocket had *no*
active guidance system. The plan is that the operational vehicle will
have active guidance.

Still, the launch was done anyway in order to prove that certain other
systems work. The sea launch worked. The rocket engine worked (even if
it did have problems with combustion stability). For a first launch of
prototype hardware, it was a successful "baby step" towards the eventual
goal of launching a person.

Jeff

Are you posting from 1930?
(Hermann Oberth, Wernher von Braun)

Or does somebody try to re-invent the "wheel" ?



w.

In article , [email protected]
says...

On Mon, 6 Jun 2011 09:39:38 -0400, Jeff Findley
wrote:

In article 3e59d3ad-292c-4c6b-bb58-bd1894f53b97
, says...

On May 31, 4:22*pm, Robert Clark wrote:
...
*And Armadillo Aerospace was set to make their first test flight to
100,000 ft, 30 km, in April, but an unauthorized person, a hunter, in
the launch zone caused them to scrub the launch:

Armadillo Aerospace's "Tube Rocket" 'Stig' completed.
Industry News by BEN BROCKERT, Armadillo Aerospace
SUNDAY, APRIL 03, 2011http://www.rocketryplanet.com/content/view/3593/29/#ixzz1M6apKJvr

*Unfortunately, White Sands Missile Range (WSMR) which is next door to
the launch site at SpacePort America has not granted a right to launch
since the canceled April flight.

*Copenhagen Suborbitals is shotting for a Thursday, June 2nd test
flight:

Copenhagen Suborbitals Upcoming Launch Attempt in June.
by Nancy Atkinson on May 30, 2011http://www.universetoday.com/86097/copenhagen-suborbitals-upcoming-la...

* Their first attempt was scrubbed in August last year due to a stuck
LOX valve:

Danish rocketeers postpone launch.
5 September 2010 Last updated at 09:43 ET
By Jonathan Amos, Science correspondent, BBC News
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034


Congratulations to Copenhagen Suborbitals in succeeding in the
launch. However, the reports are that it veered off course and
underwent an automatic abort. It reached an altitude of 2.5 km of the
planned 15 to 16 km.
It appears their next focus will have to be on attitude and guidance
control.

Reports on ARocket indicate that the trajectory problem was understood
before the launch. This is essentially because the rocket had *no*
active guidance system. The plan is that the operational vehicle will
have active guidance.

Still, the launch was done anyway in order to prove that certain other
systems work. The sea launch worked. The rocket engine worked (even if
it did have problems with combustion stability). For a first launch of
prototype hardware, it was a successful "baby step" towards the eventual
goal of launching a person.

Are you posting from 1930?
(Hermann Oberth, Wernher von Braun)

Or does somebody try to re-invent the "wheel" ?

This is an "amateur" attempt at putting a person in "space". That is, a
short, suborbital flight. Such a feat has been done by large
governments (Mercury-Redstone), a small company (Spaceship One), but
never by a group of "amateurs". If successful, this would mean that
suborbital space travel is "easy enough" to be considered a "hobby".
That would be an amazing "first", in my opinion.

Jeff
--
" Solids are a branch of fireworks, not rocketry. :-) :-) ", Henry
Spencer 1/28/2011

Some reports are that Virgin Galactic is having difficulty scaling up
the hybrid engine on SpaceShipOne to the size needed for
SpaceShipTwo:

So Sir Richard: How’s the Engine Coming?
Postedby Doug Messieron May 23, 2011, at 7:07 pmin News.
http://www.parabolicarc.com/2011/05/...engine-coming/

So How’s The Engine Coming?
http://www.transterrestrial.com/?p=34067

There is also speculation there that they may consider switching to a
liquid fueled propulsion system.
There was a report that by using a cryogenic (hydrogen) engine, that
SpaceShipTwo could be single-stage-to-SUBorbit:

SpaceShipTwo could be single stage to suborbit says ESA firm.
By Rob Coppinger on April 29, 2010 4:24 PM
http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/hy...-single-s.html

The Vinci engine considered in the study is still under development
by the ESA. However, already in service engines might be comparable to
the Vinci:

Vinci(rocket engine).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinci_(rocket_engine)

Some of the comments at the two blog pages above on the SpaceShipTwo
hybrid engine mentioned that hybrids are not as "safe" as claimed by
Virgin Galactic. For instance the claim that hybrids can not explode.
This is not literally correct since the nitrous oxide (N2O) used as
oxidizer can literally explode under some circumstances. One commenter
at the parabolicarc.com blog suggests this is what happened in the
2007 nitrous accident at Scaled Composites.
A team working towards a rocket-propelled land speed record decided
against using nitrous for these safety reasons:

Land speed record bid could make space flight safer.
16:20 27 May 2011 by Paul Marks
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...er.html?page=1


Bob Clark

In sci.space.history Robert Clark wrote:

So Sir Richard: How’s the Engine Coming?
Postedby Doug Messieron May 23, 2011, at 7:07 pmin News.
http://www.parabolicarc.com/2011/05/...engine-coming/

Fascinating:

The stories have persisted and, if anything, have grown
stronger. The latest one circulating in Mojave is that the test in
March didn’t go well, and that the propulsion team has decided to
abandon the hybrid rocket for a liquid system. There is also a
confirmed report that Virgin Galactic has formed its own
propulsion team and hired the former director of SpaceX’s Texas
engine testing facility — and an expert in liquid propulsion — as
a member of it.

So How’s The Engine Coming?
http://www.transterrestrial.com/?p=34067

Remember that Barber Nichols Inc (BNI) has already produced a
34,000-lb thrust peroxide and kerosine engine for an unknown
customer (probably Blue Origin) and BNI also built the SpaceX
Merlin engine turbo pumps
(http://www.barber-nichols.com/produc...e_turbopumps/).

I thought that SpaceX bragged about the engines being all their own?

rick jones
--
the road to hell is paved with business decisions...
these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway...
feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH...