The War We Refuse To Win

"Scott Lowther" wrote in message
...
Rand Simberg wrote:

On Wed, 12 May 2004 01:58:12 GMT, in a place far, far away, Scott
Lowther made the phosphor on
my monitor glow in such a way as to indicate that:

This is not World War III,

Yes, it is. You just don't realize it yet.

Actually, it's WW IV. WW III was the Cold War (which fortunately
didn't turn out as badly as many predicted).

I suppose that could be argued. Of course, the same schmucks who want to
deny the existence of "WWIV" are the same ones who wanted us to lose
"WWIII"...


In a lot of ways that is a lying smear.

Quite typical.

Oh, yes, you did say "it could be argued" and I don't deny that those who
wanted us to lose the Cold War might also deny the exixtence of WWIII
or WWIV whatever, but your logic is wrong.

Mike Walsh

Ool ) wrote:
: "Eric Chomko" wrote in message ...
: Scott Lowther ) wrote:
: : Ool wrote:

: : I wouldn't mind the thoughts of vengeance as much if you could also
: : succeed at something peaceful that takes brains. But, quite frankly,
: : I don't see it happening any more. You've turned into dumb, bullying
: : jocks.

: : This from the land that gave the world Stormtroopers?

: I didn't know George Lucas is German...

Yeah, I think the original poster doesn't know the difference between
"jack booted thugs" and "stormtroopers".

: : Your whining might be taken seriously if it wasn't merciless day and
: : night bombardment coupled with total land warfare that brought your
: : nation to it's knees and ended your reign of terror.

: That was then, and now they have a far better public school system and a
: far better public transportation system than do we.

: Exactly! And less work hours and more holidays. Still no sense of
: humor, though, although other countries are catching up...

Don't forget the beer, or is it bier?

: Save your reactionary
: jingosim for someone else. I still wonder if you actually have the balls
: to nuke Mecca?

: I wouldn't dare anyone on that! There are so many nutcases out
: there and it doesn't take much to push a button...

But, you see if we think exactly like the terrorists...

: : It wasn't negotiation that stopped the fascists. it won't be negotiation
: : that stops the Islamists.

: Maybe we could use the same strategy that stopped the Christians or
: the Jews. I mean, weren't they easy to get rid of? Just throw a few
: of them to the lions or gas a few millions and look--now they're dead
: religions, only to be found in the history books, as opposed to, say,
: on televangelist channels or in the daily news...

: Maybe we should find Sadr and rather than assassinate him like his father
: we should humiliate him instead? What do you think?

: Yeah, that should do it. His followers will be so ashamed they'll
: turn atheist faster than you can roll in a prayer carpet. Good think-
: ing!

There is a case for not making him a martyr.

Eric

: --
: __ “A good leader knows when it’s best to ignore the __
: ('__` screams for help and focus on the bigger picture.� '__`)
: //6(6; ©OOL mmiv :^)^\\
: `\_-/ http://home.t-online.de/home/ulrich....lmann/redbaron \-_/'

Scott Lowther ) wrote:
: Eric Chomko wrote:

: : Did we assume that everybody in Berlin, Hamburg, Tokyo or Hiroshima were
: : enemies? Adn after that war was over... did we rebuild not jsut their
: : physical infrastructure, but their *cultures*?
:
: No we gave them capitalism and for the most part it worked in Japan and
: Germany.

: AFTER we spent *years* turning their cities into burned rubble. AFTER we
: used nuclear weapons. We didn;t just take down the German and Japanese
: governments...w e defeated their *people*, and then rebuilt their
: *cultures.*

Ah, bull****. We didn't defeat their people. We overthrough their
governments and set up new ones. That worked in the mid 40s. There is no
proof that we can pull it off in the 21st century. The world is a
different place. There is no way a country the size of Germany or Japan
could rule a whole continent today.

: Then is is jihad. Say it!

: Well, DUH. You just now figured out that Jihad has been declared upon
: the US and the west?

Okay, so this is the Christians and the Jews against the Muslims?

: : I'm not a big fan of Christianity. But the wackiest of back-woods,
: : shunned Christian fundy loonies can't hold a candle to what is accepted
: : in the Muslim world. Can you imagine a Christian minister announcing
: : that it'd be okay for a Christian to take a MUslim woman as a slave? I
: : can't But I don;t need to imagine a Muslim Imam making a similar
: : announcement... it's already happened.
:
: So you want to make it a war against Muslims and the rest of the world?

: So you want to have the women in your life gang raped, enslaved and
: murdered?

No, but what does that have to do with fighting a holy war?

: The problem with fighting on their terms is that you LOWER yourself to
: their level. Can't we win by raising up to a better level?

: Indeed so. Orbital nuclear bombardment. Nice and impersonal.

To hell with fallout, God is on our side, right?

: : Our options are to either fight like our enemies, but stronger and
: : faster and smarter and better... or let them nibble away at us until we
: : are a memory.
:
: There has to be something in between. What makes you think that their way
: is winning?

: They don't have to win for us to lose.

What do you mean by that?

Eric

: --
: Scott Lowther, Engineer
: Remove the obvious (capitalized) anti-spam
: gibberish from the reply-to e-mail address

Sander Vesik wrote in message ...
offensive virulent hatemongering.

There are people out there who would gleefully rape your sister and
saw your head off. And you have the gall to accuse me of hatemongering
for pointing it out in a time of global war?

Your moral relativism is astonishing.

Eric Chomko wrote:

Ool ) wrote:

: : This from the land that gave the world Stormtroopers?

: I didn't know George Lucas is German...

Yeah, I think the original poster doesn't know the difference between
"jack booted thugs" and "stormtroopers".

Astonishing the lack of historical knowledge you and Ulrich are
demonstrating. Next you'll have us believe that Kristalnacht was a white
sale at Woolworths.



--
Scott Lowther, Engineer
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gibberish from the reply-to e-mail address

Eric Chomko wrote:

: Then is is jihad. Say it!

: Well, DUH. You just now figured out that Jihad has been declared upon
: the US and the west?

Okay, so this is the Christians and the Jews against the Muslims?

It's certainly the Muslims (or at least a goodly fraction of them)
against the Christians, Jews, atheists, agnostics, Hindus, Buddhists,
pagans, etc.



: So you want to make it a war against Muslims and the rest of the world?

: So you want to have the women in your life gang raped, enslaved and
: murdered?

No, but what does that have to do with fighting a holy war?

Because this holy war will have that result unless it is won by the
west. Ask the Scandinavian women gang raped by Muslim immigrants (Norway
and Denmark, IIRC).



: The problem with fighting on their terms is that you LOWER yourself to
: their level. Can't we win by raising up to a better level?

: Indeed so. Orbital nuclear bombardment. Nice and impersonal.

To hell with fallout, God is on our side, right?

Fallout is overrated as a danger. Especially compared to Islamofascism
domination.


: : Our options are to either fight like our enemies, but stronger and
: : faster and smarter and better... or let them nibble away at us until we
: : are a memory.
:
: There has to be something in between. What makes you think that their way
: is winning?

: They don't have to win for us to lose.

What do you mean by that?

Ask any Israeli who has lost family to a suicide bomber. Then scale that
up to global scale.

--
Scott Lowther, Engineer
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Hop David wrote:

I sure hope it stays that way. When Americans like Scott say it's time
we bring out our nuclear bombs and show our enemies what REAL terror is,
I will not remain quiet.

Feel free to serve as a human shield. Some suggested viewing:
http://www.attackcartoons.com/shields.gif

--
Scott Lowther, Engineer
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gibberish from the reply-to e-mail address

achieve a
: good end to it by singing Kumbaya while our citizens are beheaded.

Right, but we are fighting a limited conventional war against guerrillas
in their country. That is exactly what we did in VietNam. So if the
pattern follows in 9 years and two adminstrations later we will leave and
we will have accomplished nothing.

If we elect Kerry and leave next year, we will *still* have accomplished
nothing. So what's the point?

Mike Rhino wrote:

If we elect Kerry and leave next year, we will *still* have accomplished
nothing. So what's the point?

Less diplomatic, financial, and life cost.

Yeah... and France saved a lot of diplomatic, financial, and life
expense by not stopping Hitler early. At least... they saved for a
*while*...

--
Scott Lowther, Engineer
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gibberish from the reply-to e-mail address

G EddieA95 wrote:
achieve a
: good end to it by singing Kumbaya while our citizens are beheaded.

Right, but we are fighting a limited conventional war against guerrillas
in their country. That is exactly what we did in VietNam. So if the
pattern follows in 9 years and two adminstrations later we will leave and
we will have accomplished nothing.

If we elect Kerry and leave next year, we will *still* have accomplished
nothing. So what's the point?

There is now essentially nothing the US can do that would not make things
worse, so whats your point?

--
Sander

+++ Out of cheese error +++