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Juno yes, Moonrise no
[See http://www.spacedaily.com/news/nasa-04y.html for background.] --------------------- http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drm...823702,00.html Destination Jupiter Lockheed to build probe for 2010 NASA exploratory mission By Roger Fillion, Rocky Mountain News June 2, 2005 [EXCERPTS] Lockheed Martin in Jefferson County will build a spacecraft slated to embark on a detailed study of Jupiter as part of a NASA mission worth up to $700 million. Scientists are looking to the so-called Juno mission - announced by NASA on Wednesday - to learn how Earth and other planets were formed billions of years ago. "We don't have a really good understanding right now of how planets in our solar system are made," said Scott Bolton, a scientist at the nonprofit Southwest Research Institute in San Antonio. "Jupiter holds the key to telling us the story of the early solar system." Bolton will oversee the mission, serving as its principal investigator. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, Calif., will provide mission-project management. Lockheed Martin Space Systems will build the probe at its Waterton Canyon facilities. "We are absolutely delighted to be involved in a mission to Jupiter," said Lockheed spokesman Buddy Nelson. He said it was too early to know how many, if any, new jobs would be created. It also wasn't immediately known how much of a financial slice Lockheed would get as part of the project. The Juno mission is part of NASA's New Frontiers program. It was chosen for funding over another project, dubbed Moonrise, that proposed to drop robotic landers into a crater at the south pole of the moon, returning samples to Earth. [snip] "This was a very tough decision given the exciting and innovative nature of the two missions," Ghassem Asrar, deputy associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, said in a statement. According to NASA, the Juno mission will conduct a first-time, in-depth study of Jupiter. Under the planned mission, a spacecraft will be placed in a polar orbit around the giant planet to investigate the existence of an ice-rock core. [snip] According to NASA, the new mission must be ready for launch no later than June 30, 2010. Once launched, the spacecraft is expected to take about five years to reach Jupiter. |
#2
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In article . com,
"Allen Thomson" wrote: The Juno mission is part of NASA's New Frontiers program. It was chosen for funding over another project, dubbed Moonrise, that proposed to drop robotic landers into a crater at the south pole of the moon, returning samples to Earth. [snip] "This was a very tough decision given the exciting and innovative nature of the two missions," Ghassem Asrar, deputy associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, said in a statement. Given their both exciting and innovative, why the heck didn't they choose the one that adheres to NASA's new mission? The only worthwhile thing Bush has done since he took office was to remove the Moon taboo at NASA -- or so I had thought. But now we're funding another Jupiter mission, right in the middle of the VSE schedule? ,------------------------------------------------------------------. | Joseph J. Strout Check out the Mac Web Directory: | | http://www.macwebdir.com | `------------------------------------------------------------------' |
#3
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On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 15:51:36 -0500, Joe Strout wrote:
The Juno mission is part of NASA's New Frontiers program. "This was a very tough decision given the exciting and innovative nature of the two missions," Ghassem Asrar, deputy associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, said in a statement. Given their both exciting and innovative, why the heck didn't they choose the one that adheres to NASA's new mission? Might be throwing a bone to the outer planets advocates since JIMO has been delayed more or less indefinately. Brian |
#4
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Joe Strout wrote: Given their both exciting and innovative, why the heck didn't they choose the one that adheres to NASA's new mission? The only worthwhile thing Bush has done since he took office was to remove the Moon taboo at NASA -- or so I had thought. But now we're funding another Jupiter mission, right in the middle of the VSE schedule? Think it through- if you can return samples from the Moon with unmanned robots, why do you have to send people there? They don't want that concept to pop into anyone's head. Pat |
#5
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In article ,
Pat Flannery wrote: Think it through- if you can return samples from the Moon with unmanned robots, why do you have to send people there? To establish a base, of course. Why would anyone think that a lunar base is about returning samples? Nobody returns samples of vacuum from ISS... OK, maybe that's a bad example, but still. ,------------------------------------------------------------------. | Joseph J. Strout Check out the Mac Web Directory: | | http://www.macwebdir.com | `------------------------------------------------------------------' |
#6
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On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 17:10:58 -0500, in a place far, far away, Brian
Thorn made the phosphor on my monitor glow in such a way as to indicate that: The Juno mission is part of NASA's New Frontiers program. "This was a very tough decision given the exciting and innovative nature of the two missions," Ghassem Asrar, deputy associate administrator for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, said in a statement. Given their both exciting and innovative, why the heck didn't they choose the one that adheres to NASA's new mission? Might be throwing a bone to the outer planets advocates since JIMO has been delayed more or less indefinately. At least until the technology has been developed to the point at which it makes sense. |
#7
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On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 18:51:59 -0500, in a place far, far away, Pat
Flannery made the phosphor on my monitor glow in such a way as to indicate that: Given their both exciting and innovative, why the heck didn't they choose the one that adheres to NASA's new mission? The only worthwhile thing Bush has done since he took office was to remove the Moon taboo at NASA -- or so I had thought. But now we're funding another Jupiter mission, right in the middle of the VSE schedule? Think it through- if you can return samples from the Moon with unmanned robots, why do you have to send people there? Maybe because the goal isn't to return samples from the moon, which we did thirty-five years ago? |
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Pat Flannery wrote:
I never have figured out what exactly the proposed lunar base is supposed to do- the astronauts gather up rocks and examine them I suppose. That's going to get old after a month or so. Indeed. There's some sort of self-coherent case to be made for Mars exploration, even after you ignore all of Zubrin's frontier BS. Finding evidence of prior life (or especially current life) there would be quite significant, and I think that the amount of exploration needed for that might well be into the "cheaper to do with people" range. But the moon? I hesitate to say "who cares," but I'm thinking it. It doesn't make much sense for spaceship assembly, as it's located at the bottom of a (admittedly shallow) gravity well, so that building ships at an L point would save fuel. Even if the lunar base finds water and can smelt lunar soil somehow, it's going to be a long time before it can make anything as complex as a spacecraft given the possible funding level the project is going to have. I don't think anyone seriously suggests actually building spacecraft on the moon, but sometimes they discuss extracting oxygen from the soil. I've never seen anything to make me vaguely believe that this is economically or technologically worthwhile in the service of any larger end. -jake |
#9
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Jake McGuire wrote:
But the moon? I hesitate to say "who cares," but I'm thinking it. Lessee, who would care about the moon... hmmm... 1: Astronomers 2: Tourists 3: Anybody who wants to get fantastically rich in the beamed solar power industry 4: Anyone who feels they need helium-3 for fusion reactors 5: Anyone wanting to head into deep space and who needs lots of aluminum and/or oxygen 6: Anyone who wants to build big-ass space colonies 7: Anyone who wants to exploit, colonize or otherwise make use of astroids or outer-system moons and who needs to test out tech 8: The military 9: Anyone who wants to test really dangerous technology, from bionasties to nukes to antimatter drive systems |
#10
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Note NASA has offered a reward to the team who can come up with the
fastest way of extracting oxygen from lunar regolith. Once oxygen is extracted, the rest of the minerals might not be too difficult to get out. See http://fp.alexterrell.plus.com/test/...stellation.pdf for a possible scenario. |
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