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Won't the gap filler burn off?



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 2nd 05, 05:05 AM
Burnham Treezdown
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Default Won't the gap filler burn off?

....when exposed to that kind of heat & turbulence?

Or is it made to take the heat, thereby making it suitable as a "gap
filler"....hmmmmm....kinda answered my own question....

I guess the smart thing to do would be to not send this post...but,
well....you know...!
  #2  
Old August 2nd 05, 05:55 AM
Andrew Lotosky
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Burnham Treezdown wrote:
...when exposed to that kind of heat & turbulence?

Or is it made to take the heat, thereby making it suitable as a "gap
filler"....hmmmmm....kinda answered my own question....

I guess the smart thing to do would be to not send this post...but,
well....you know...!


Nobody knows as this is the first time it's been photographed on orbit.
All the gap-filler protrusions they've seen have been after the shuttle
has landed, and they've been smaller than the ones on Discovery now.
The counter-argument to the EVA being discussed (and now it seems
approved) is that some of it might burn off, hence the usually smaller
protrusions on post-landing inspection.

I'm personally nervous about the way this is being thrown into the EVA.
"Ho-hum, no big deal to add this".

- First EVA to try and repair any spacecraft's heat shield.
- First EVA under an orbiter.
- First EVA to TOUCH anything down there.
- Thrown in as part of a busy EVA already.
- Not one of the repair methods that they were even slated to try on
this mission, much less actually do.

No sweat, right? I just hope its the first task on the EVA, as I'd
rather not have a worn out spacewalker try this.

Dear Lord, please don't let them **** up.

-A.L.

  #3  
Old August 2nd 05, 06:24 AM
Joe Delphi
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"Andrew Lotosky" wrote in message
oups.com...

I'm personally nervous about the way this is being thrown into the EVA.
"Ho-hum, no big deal to add this".

- First EVA to try and repair any spacecraft's heat shield.
- First EVA under an orbiter.
- First EVA to TOUCH anything down there.
- Thrown in as part of a busy EVA already.
- Not one of the repair methods that they were even slated to try on
this mission, much less actually do.


One of the stated goals of the mission is to evaluate in-space repair
techniques so this is within those boundaries. Its not like they decided
to do something completely unrelated to this mission. The people are
already up there, already trained, have more experience than anyone else in
doing this kind of thing, because they just did it during EVA #1 - why waste
the taxpayers dollars by waiting for another Shuttle flight to actually try
out what they learned during EVA #1?

JD


  #4  
Old August 2nd 05, 06:36 AM
DMF
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Andrew Lotosky wrote
Nobody knows as this is the first time it's been photographed on orbit.
All the gap-filler protrusions they've seen have been after the shuttle
has landed, and they've been smaller than the ones on Discovery now.
The counter-argument to the EVA being discussed (and now it seems
approved) is that some of it might burn off, hence the usually smaller
protrusions on post-landing inspection.

I'm personally nervous about the way this is being thrown into the EVA.
"Ho-hum, no big deal to add this".

- First EVA to try and repair any spacecraft's heat shield.
- First EVA under an orbiter.
- First EVA to TOUCH anything down there.
- Thrown in as part of a busy EVA already.
- Not one of the repair methods that they were even slated to try on
this mission, much less actually do.

No sweat, right? I just hope its the first task on the EVA, as I'd
rather not have a worn out spacewalker try this.


I'm with you... it sounds terribly risky. My biggest concern is that I read
that they were going to try and just pull the gap filler out. And if that
does not work they are going to cut off the part that is jutting out. Now
I'm no heat shield expert -- but it sure seems risky to be tugging on those
gap fillers. Does any one know if tugging on a gap filler can cause a tile
to
pop out, crack or loosen its bond? What then? I'd vote for leaving them
alone or cutting them off. (We do get to vote here on S.S.S., no? ;-)

Regards,
David


  #5  
Old August 2nd 05, 07:29 AM
Burnham Treezdown
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On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 22:36:39 -0700, "DMF" wrote:



I'm with you... it sounds terribly risky.


On the other hand, this kind of thing is more what NASA's glory days
were all about - heroic, untried, improvised solutions to emergencies.
I realize this is nowhere near the scale of Apollo 13 but it's a big
improvement from "Duh, we can't do anything about it" as seen on the
last shuttle flight.

Remember, NASA was suffering from terrible PR after the Hubble was
launched and found to have the defective mirror. Once the astronauts
went up there and fixed it everybody loved NASA again - "Our boys
STILL got it!" Although we don't know if there actually would be any
serious consequences from the exposed gap filler, a successful EVA
under semi-spontaneous conditions to fix it, followed by a safe
landing, just might negate some of the current doubts and bashing.

Except for certain people on this newsgroup, of course. Can't expect
miracles.


My biggest concern is that I read
that they were going to try and just pull the gap filler out. And if that
does not work they are going to cut off the part that is jutting out. Now
I'm no heat shield expert -- but it sure seems risky to be tugging on those
gap fillers.



Yeah, tugging around the edge of a tile doesn't seems a little risky -
but then, they've got the Tile Repair kit right there, what better way
to test it out?
  #6  
Old August 2nd 05, 07:58 AM
Lorian
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Has this extra EVA been scheduled?

L.


  #7  
Old August 2nd 05, 08:00 AM
DMF
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Burnham Treezdown wrote...
Yeah, tugging around the edge of a tile doesn't seems a little risky -
but then, they've got the Tile Repair kit right there, what better way
to test it out?


Here's a link to a local news report (KPIX SF) where they interviewed
a guy named Dan Leiser of NASA/Ames who helped develop the gap
fillers. They said he preferrs cutting the gap fillers off. I wonder what
the argument is for pulling them out (maybe if they are loose they can
be pulled out without too much force).



Regards,
David



  #8  
Old August 2nd 05, 08:04 AM
Derek Lyons
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"Andrew Lotosky" wrote:

All the gap-filler protrusions they've seen have been after the shuttle
has landed, and they've been smaller than the ones on Discovery now.
The counter-argument to the EVA being discussed (and now it seems
approved) is that some of it might burn off, hence the usually smaller
protrusions on post-landing inspection.


Which, on the face of it seems stupid. Compare the postlanding
dimensions of the protrusion with the prelaunch dimensions and you
have the inflight size.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL
  #9  
Old August 2nd 05, 08:07 AM
Derek Lyons
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"Joe Delphi" wrote:

One of the stated goals of the mission is to evaluate in-space repair
techniques so this is within those boundaries. Its not like they decided
to do something completely unrelated to this mission. The people are
already up there, already trained, have more experience than anyone else in
doing this kind of thing, because they just did it during EVA #1 - why waste
the taxpayers dollars by waiting for another Shuttle flight to actually try
out what they learned during EVA #1?


OK - let's see what they did in EVA #1 and how it compares to the
newly planned EVA.

- First EVA to try and repair any spacecraft's heat shield.


Hmm... No work done with the gap fillers on EVA #1.

- First EVA under an orbiter.


Hmm... Didn't go under the orbiter or out on the arm/boom during EVA
#1.

- First EVA to TOUCH anything down there.


Hm... The tiles from EVA #1 have yet to be evaluated to ensure that
there was no induced damage.

Tell me again exactly how they gained so much experience in EVA #1 to
apply to EVA #2?

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL
  #10  
Old August 2nd 05, 08:12 AM
Derek Lyons
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Burnham Treezdown wrote:

On Mon, 1 Aug 2005 22:36:39 -0700, "DMF" wrote:
I'm with you... it sounds terribly risky.


On the other hand, this kind of thing is more what NASA's glory days
were all about - heroic, untried, improvised solutions to emergencies.


Not noticeably. Most solutions were either tried and trained for
beforehand, or extensively tested on the ground before radioing up to
the spacecraft, or were simple extensions of existing techniques.

None of which apply here.

Yeah, tugging around the edge of a tile doesn't seems a little risky -
but then, they've got the Tile Repair kit right there, what better way
to test it out?


What better way? The way they already plan to - by putting the
'repaired' tile into an arcjet facility. Only idiots would place the
lives of the astronauts and the irreplaceable Shuttle itself in danger
for an utterly un-needed 'test'.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL
 




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