Valeev is by no means the worst offender

"hanson" wrote in message
...
ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAHA....
"Androcles", anagrammically alias "Sol Dancer"
is indeed the "sole dancer" come rain or shine
.... ahahahaha...


Yeah, it means pure Androcles travels alone, dancing over virgin snow,
but it's more literally "Sundancer". I'm the Sundance kid. Butch Cassidy
was born Bob Parker, y'know, but we couldn't both be Parkers
so he changed to Cassidy when I switched from Longabaugh to Parker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Cassidy

History has me all screwed up.

That driven snow of yours has too many tyre tracks and gets all slushy,
but as the sunlight strikes through the trees and you travel alone, dancing,
you'll get a stroboscopic effect that makes you have epileptic fits. That's
the Sol dancer, and from now until the rest of your personal eternity every
time you see it you'll think of me.

Changing the subject, Droolin' Doolin has said I'm cynical.
Nobody has ever paid me such an enormous compliment before!
How 'bout that? I'm all puffed up with pride now.
'Course, he also said I'm dishonest...can't have it all.

http://www.i-cynic.com/

Androcles, still searching for an honest man.

"Androcles" wrote in message
"hanson" wrote:

"hanson" wrote:
ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAHA....
"Androcles", anagrammically alias "Sol Dancer"
is indeed the "sole dancer" come rain or shine
.... ahahahaha...

Androcles wrote:
Yeah, it means pure Androcles travels alone, dancing over virgin snow,
but it's more literally "Sundancer". I'm the Sundance kid. Butch Cassidy
was born Bob Parker, y'know, but we couldn't both be Parkers
so he changed to Cassidy when I switched from Longabaugh to Parker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Cassidy

History has me all screwed up.

hanson wrote:
.... I am sorry to hear that, Andro, Demand reparations from history
for that horrible fate of yours. Do like the Holocaust industrialists do.

Androcles wrote:
That driven snow of yours has too many tyre tracks and gets all slushy,
but as the sunlight strikes through the trees and you travel alone,
dancing, you'll get a stroboscopic effect that makes you have
epileptic fits. That's the Sol dancer, and from now until the rest of
your personal eternity every time you see it you'll think of me.

hanson wrote:
.... ahahahaha.. would that ease your horrific inner pains if you
knew that for sure? ... If you convince yourself of that then you
are 99.99999.... % there... in your own never-never land.....

Androcles wrote:
Changing the subject, Droolin' Doolin has said I'm cynical.
Nobody has ever paid me such an enormous compliment before!
How 'bout that? I'm all puffed up with pride now.
'Course, he also said I'm dishonest...can't have it all.

http://www.i-cynic.com/

Androcles, still searching for an honest man.

hanson wrote:
..... ahahaha... Start searching within yourself. He ain't out there.
Thanks for the laughs.... ahahaha... ahahahanson

"hanson" wrote in message
...

"Androcles" wrote in message
"hanson" wrote:

"hanson" wrote:
ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAHA....
"Androcles", anagrammically alias "Sol Dancer"
is indeed the "sole dancer" come rain or shine
.... ahahahaha...

Androcles wrote:
Yeah, it means pure Androcles travels alone, dancing over virgin snow,
but it's more literally "Sundancer". I'm the Sundance kid. Butch Cassidy
was born Bob Parker, y'know, but we couldn't both be Parkers
so he changed to Cassidy when I switched from Longabaugh to Parker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Cassidy

History has me all screwed up.

hanson wrote:
... I am sorry to hear that, Andro, Demand reparations from history
for that horrible fate of yours. Do like the Holocaust industrialists do.

No you are not, you lying *******, you are gloating over it.
****ing crocodile tears... just like Elmer Fudd when wuvly Brunhilde
died.
"Kill the Wabbit!" indeed. Terrible. That movie brought real tears to
my eyes, I tell ya.
Sing along wiv me:
Fudd/Cha-cha: "O Brunehilde, you're so wuvly."
Bugs/Andro: "Yes I know, I can't help it."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJAXJWm8G4A

And give me your helmet made with the steel matrix with
certain portions of Fe, Ni, Cr, and free neutrons floating
in a metal lattice causing Na-scented hydrogen embattlements.


Androcles wrote:
That driven snow of yours has too many tyre tracks and gets all slushy,
but as the sunlight strikes through the trees and you travel alone,
dancing, you'll get a stroboscopic effect that makes you have epileptic
fits. That's the Sol dancer, and from now until the rest of your personal
eternity every time you see it you'll think of me.

hanson wrote:
... ahahahaha.. would that ease your horrific inner pains if you knew that
for sure? ... If you convince yourself of that then you
are 99.99999.... % there... in your own never-never land.....

Androcles wrote:
Changing the subject, Droolin' Doolin has said I'm cynical.
Nobody has ever paid me such an enormous compliment before!
How 'bout that? I'm all puffed up with pride now.
'Course, he also said I'm dishonest...can't have it all.

http://www.i-cynic.com/

Androcles, still searching for an honest man.

hanson wrote:
.... ahahaha... Start searching within yourself. He ain't out there.
Thanks for the laughs.... ahahaha... ahahahanson

Cha-cha, I'm a cynic.
The Cynics were more blunt when it came to exposing foolishness. They'd hang
out in the streets like a pack of dogs ("Cynic" comes from the Greek word
for dog), watch the passing crowd, and ridicule anyone who seemed pompous,
pretentious, materialistic or downright wicked. Fiercely proud of their
independence, they led disciplined and virtuous lives. The most famous of
the ancient Cynics was Diogenes, who reportedly took up residence in a tub
to demonstrate his freedom from material wants. This cranky
street-philosopher would introduce himself by saying, "I am Diogenes the
dog. I nuzzle the kind, bark at the greedy and bite scoundrels." He'd use a
lantern by daylight, explaining that he was searching for an honest man.
Even Alexander the Great didn't escape unscathed. When the young conqueror
found Diogenes sitting in the marketplace and asked how he could help him,
the old philosopher replied that "you can step out of my sunlight."

Fudd/Cha-cha: "O Brunehilde, you're so wuvly."
Bugs/Andro: "Yes I know, I can't help it."

ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAHA....AHAHAHAHAHA....

"Androcles" wrote:
"hanson" wrote:
"Androcles" wrote:
"hanson" wrote:

"hanson" wrote:
"Androcles", anagrammically alias "Sol Dancer"
is indeed the "sole dancer" come rain or shine
.... ahahahaha...

Androcles wrote:
Yeah, it means pure Androcles travels alone, dancing over virgin snow,
but it's more literally "Sundancer". I'm the Sundance kid. Butch Cassidy
was born Bob Parker, y'know, but we couldn't both be Parkers
so he changed to Cassidy when I switched from Longabaugh to Parker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Cassidy

History has me all screwed up.

hanson wrote:
... I am sorry to hear that, Andro, Demand reparations from history
for that horrible fate of yours. Do like the Holocaust industrialists do.

Andorcles, the Sol Dancer, wrote:
No you are not, you lying *******, you are gloating over it.

hanson wrote:
uhhh....ahhh... ohhh... ----- WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT? -----

Always remember, you Sol Dancer, hanson is pure, clean & pristine
like the driven snow and hence without fault nor blame, as he will now
do what you love to see more and above everything else. Hanson will....
----------- [snip the rest of your crap] ----------------

There, there. See...and now for good measure, here a new one for you:
---------- HANSON SHINES!... Androcles just dances ----------
ahahahahahahahahahaha.... AHAHAHAHA.. ahahahanson

"hanson" wrote in message
...
ahahahaha... AHAHAHAHAHA....AHAHAHAHAHA....

"Androcles" wrote:
"hanson" wrote:
"Androcles" wrote:
"hanson" wrote:

"hanson" wrote:
"Androcles", anagrammically alias "Sol Dancer"
is indeed the "sole dancer" come rain or shine
.... ahahahaha...

Androcles wrote:
Yeah, it means pure Androcles travels alone, dancing over virgin snow,
but it's more literally "Sundancer". I'm the Sundance kid. Butch
Cassidy
was born Bob Parker, y'know, but we couldn't both be Parkers
so he changed to Cassidy when I switched from Longabaugh to Parker.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butch_Cassidy

History has me all screwed up.

hanson wrote:
... I am sorry to hear that, Andro, Demand reparations from history
for that horrible fate of yours. Do like the Holocaust industrialists
do.

Andorcles, the Sol Dancer, wrote:
No you are not, you lying *******, you are gloating over it.

hanson wrote:
uhhh....ahhh... ohhh... ----- WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT? -----

I didn't say anything was wrong with it.


Always remember, you Sol Dancer, hanson is pure, clean & pristine
like the driven snow


Yes, driven on slushy snow with tyre tracks all over it, whereas I'm pure
and
clean as virgin snow, the golden sunlight beam on your eye. I gave you the
Sundance curse, I will be with you forever.

Now sing along with me:
Fudd/Cha-cha: "O Brunehilde, you're so wuvly."
Bugs/Sundance: "Yes I know, I can't help it."


[snip your impure crap]

Deirdre Sholto Douglas wrote:

jmfbahciv wrote:
Deirdre Sholto Douglas wrote:

a fact which I'm reminded of every
time I find myself up to my elbows in dirty glassware or
on the floor peering up into the the bowels of some piece
of non-functioning equipment.
Do you do plumbing in your work?

Heaven forfend, the maintenance folk would murder me

grin

if I tried...I'm allowed to dissect my own stuff, anything
which counts a building intrastruction is their bailiwick.

I was thinking of emergency lab gear repairs. I had assumed
that your critters required water.

Which is not to say I don't get my fix of plumbing issues
at home, but my usual response is to tell Himself that
there's water pouring out from under the sink cabinet
and then scoot off to work. :-)

grin Work is always a safe refuge.


(Microbio has an additional yuck! factor...it frequently
stinks in the most literal of gag-inducing sense of the
word...Shewanella came by the "putrefaciens" designator
very honestly and some of the Geobacters, when grown
in certain media, smell like blood.
Sounds like farming :-). The words Shewanella and Geobacters
are new to me.

Soil critters.

Thanks.


No wonder my daughter
opted for Molecular instead of Micro. :-))
Good for her. Did, or do, you have a lab at home?

No...the capital costs are prohibitive, to say nothing of the
safety concerns.


so your fridge isn't growing critters for the purpose of study...

My bugs aren't pathogens, but just saying
"Microbial culture" can frighten some people...they've only
heard about the nasties like Anthrax or MRSA (the antibio-
tic resistant Staph aureus) and frequently don't make the
distinction between my pets and their anti-social relatives.

Yea. and they demand flu shots and eat lots of yogurt and cheese
and expect vegetables to taste good. Plus have no digestive
problems.


I do the wet lab bench work on site and the reading, writing
and research from my office at home. I just came off a
spate of lab work and am now in the process of a week of
literature reading...it's the best of both worlds, in truth.

sounds like it. If I may ask another personal question..

Do you like writing?

Note that I'm not ignoring your other posts; they simply
require thinking for a while.

/BAH

jmfbahciv wrote:

Deirdre Sholto Douglas wrote:

if I tried...I'm allowed to dissect my own stuff, anything
which counts a building intrastruction is their bailiwick.

I was thinking of emergency lab gear repairs. I had assumed
that your critters required water.

In as much as there's water in the medium, they have it...so
far, barring one blown valve in a 18 mega-ohm water purifier,
I've not had any problems with running water...touch wood.

Which is not to say I don't get my fix of plumbing issues
at home, but my usual response is to tell Himself that
there's water pouring out from under the sink cabinet
and then scoot off to work. :-)

grin Work is always a safe refuge.

Safer than being in the same room as a husband and a mal-
function water line by far...although I have to admit, such
repairs always add to by vocabulary. :-)

No wonder my daughter
opted for Molecular instead of Micro. :-))
Good for her. Did, or do, you have a lab at home?

No...the capital costs are prohibitive, to say nothing of the
safety concerns.

so your fridge isn't growing critters for the purpose of study...

It better not be growing critters, full stop. :-)

My bugs aren't pathogens, but just saying
"Microbial culture" can frighten some people...they've only
heard about the nasties like Anthrax or MRSA (the antibio-
tic resistant Staph aureus) and frequently don't make the
distinction between my pets and their anti-social relatives.

Yea. and they demand flu shots and eat lots of yogurt and cheese
and expect vegetables to taste good. Plus have no digestive
problems.

Not to mention that most people don't care to think about the
fact that they're a mobile, heated buffet for herds of epidermal
critters, who thank you for the meal by giving you BO.

I do the wet lab bench work on site and the reading, writing
and research from my office at home. I just came off a
spate of lab work and am now in the process of a week of
literature reading...it's the best of both worlds, in truth.

sounds like it. If I may ask another personal question..

Do you like writing?

Depends on the sort of writing...I'm not overfond of longhand
on paper any longer and anything remotely calligraphic I leave
to my daughter. If you mean creatively, I lack the imagination
to write anything fictional...I can record facts and reality well
enough and don't dislike doing so, but I'm not a hardcore diarist.

Note that I'm not ignoring your other posts; they simply
require thinking for a while.

Even if you were, there are worse things than being ignored.

Deirdre

: On Feb 24, 12:53 pm, wrote:

::: Payback?


::You betcha


: I think you need to define "payback". Your "you bet
: reminds me that Palin has made such a name for her
: and everyone knows her, espcially ****ed off Alask
: who now know to whom to direct their anger for their
: problems. But THAT is the topic of another post.

O.K, I'll define payback (without yet also defining
what the spectre for a group of industry-wide trans-
ferrable skill sets might mean to some independent
governing authority):

Asteroid mining can become both a federally funded
vate enterprise venture. This is where the current
cing effect of earthbound private-industry-to-gover
spending ratios will need to retain their integrati
that familiar lines of communication regarding sens
technology are not lost to isolationism. Some will
ally differ on this subject.

: There is zero interest in asteroid mining by anyone
: right now.

Ha Ha, Not true if many are buying gold right now,
but who is to say that even their gold will be
worthless in justm a short period of time, so
why not at least force the issue on asteroid mining
by providing as much information as possible to those
who may have it in their power to accomplish kind of
innovation? You make it sound like

Right now, the interest in asteroid mining is widespread.
Just take a look at all of the scientific investigators
listed in the International Astronomical Union Symposium
#229 in Rio De Janeiro, Brazil from August 7-12, 2005,
and you will find hundreds of speakers and participants
from all over the world that are interested in the study
of asteroids and comets. In addition to these people,
there's a growing number of professional websites that
are dedicated to exploring the asteroids, using all kinds
of exotically propelled spacecraft. Which one is the
most feasible (?) one might ask. It is my belief that we
have to look at earth-to-orbit technology first, and see
where it should go, rather than where it is
presently going.

There is a single spacecraft on route to the asteriods
right now (the Dawn mission). That mission is for scince
and not manufacturing. Maybe something more than scince
will come out of the science will come out of the Dawn
mission, but not until we get there and get the science.

::: You obviously are a very practical man but are no
::: scientist. You MUST take risks in order to get gain.

:: Agreed, however, that would depend on how many
:: scientists are involved with the project. (I'm
:: guessing that there are, perhaps a few hundred
:: thousand educated people out there with the in-
:: telligence to pursue a project of this magnitude.

:: Of course, that would also mean that these people
:: have the ability to organize into intelligent
:: groups under varied disciplines.

: Worked during Apollo days.

What worked then works now, too, if done the right way.

: There is no proof the the X-generation has the
: "Right Stuff".

Out of context. You're talking about young investors fit-
ting some sleek mold of Wall street, and you couldn't be
more wrong. "Generation-X'ers" were supposed to be the
standard IBM, Nike, The Gap, Proctor and Gamble types
who occasionally wandered off into things like specula-
tion and social conflict - with things like zine pub-
lishing, punk rock, etc., which represent the same
thing that the counter-culture of the sixties repre-
sented - ego rot to the max.

On the other side, radical engineering and radical systems
design has always worked to revolutionize the current rot
of those being dragged down by their own blind obedience
to power structures - living in a box, most of these people
are fearful of anything that challenges their faith in
remarkable or advanced technology. One key point to be
made here is that advanced technology doesn't have to
be expensive to be "advanced", just a little more
"intelligence" going into the design.

::: That aside the sheer aspect of finding something
::: in the core even if it wasn't water would have
::: scientific benefit. But if it was water, then the
::: payback would be being able to have your own water
::: while you were on Mars which could become the same
::: economically as discovering the next New World as
::: Columbus often gets creditted for. Not next year
::: or even next decade. Century? Yes!

:: Mars is too deep a gravity well for exploration.

: Earth's is bigger and we explore it all the time.

By "we", I'm assuming that the entire world has
access to a single gold deposit? That, IMO, prefers
material wealth over scientific intuition - intuition's
much richer than that.

:: You can accomplish much more without having to
:: contend with powerlaunches by investigating the
:: delta-V's of various asteroids - in proximity to
:: water-bearing moons (like Enceladus or Europa).

: Enceladus is at Saturn at roughy 10 AUs, Europa is
: at Jupiter at roughly 5 AUs, Mars is at 1.5 AUs.
: Now what were you saying about delta-Vs? I know
: these numbers from memory. You go look them up now!
: Then come back to me when you want to play more at
: Solar System astronomy. If there is water on Mars,
: then we should use it!

:: A voyage to Mars, although a romanticist's dream,
:: doesn't do much in the realm of space-based
:: utilitarianism. The environment won't support
:: life for extended periods without constant life-
:: support.

: We would be able to do more with Mars since it has
: much better solar radiation than does the asteriods
: and potential water-bearing moons that orbit gas
: giants, simply because Mars is closer. If the moon
: had an atmosphere, which is doesn't, and had known
: water, which it doesn't, then IT would be the better
: choice because it is closer to us and to the Sun.

Your assuming that, "much better solar radiation"
is more of an answer to generating a global wide
rush into orbit than asteroid mining would be?

: Mining asteroids has less utility than being able to
: convert ice to water on Mars once we get past 1.5 AUs.

Another false statement.

Asteroids themselves contain H2O - clay in carbonaceous
asteroids that can be removed by heating to around 275 C.
1.125 tons of H2O can be condensed from 5 tons of asteroid,
in producing 1 ton of oxygen, and uses 1/10th the energy
of extracting it from titanium ore, FeO + TiO2.

Think about it: A small solar furnace is enough to provide
the energy for extracting the H2O, and the only other
expenses would be for the mining operation itself - a moot
issue if the operation's in the business of mining metal
ores anyway.

: Bringing metal back from the atsreriods may NEVER have
: actual human benefit, whereas mining astriods to go to
: Jupiter and beyond might have benefit.

Please learn to spell "asteroid". Leaders have been support-
ing the idea to mine the asteroids for a while now:

"Someday we will be able to bring an asteroid containing
billions of dollars worth of critically needed metals
close to Earth to provide a vast source of mineral wealth
for our factories."

- Lyndon Baines Johnson

Technology has vastly accelerated since LBJ made that state-
ment. We now have the ability to scan and map an asteroid
before going in for the "drill".

It's quite onerous to assume support from those who
think that their golden calves can "buy" them
their freedom from an economic system tending towards
earth-bound globalism, when it is that very kind of
globalism that hamstrings free market economies into
colonial fiefdoms.

Mars is too dead of a planet to provide much of a
future in this solar system - IMO either the Spitzer
Space Telescope, the James Webb Telescope, Chandra,
etc. will discover an earth-size, earth-like planet
much sooner than anyone should be interested in
exploring the Mars for posterity's sake.

: Discover an Earth-sized planet where? Not in our Solar
: System! And if you think we'll get to another star before
: we can terraform and colonize Mars, then I suggest you get
: back to looking up those astronomy numbers I've telling
: you about and check on stellar distances from our Sun.

You really don't get it do you? Are you really that unaware
or are you purposefully trying to pretend that people like
T. Townsend Brown, Nicola Tesla, and Victor Schauberger
never existed? You honestly believe that our "intelligensia"
would prefer to keep all inquiring minds back in the dark
ages, or are they waiting until a "discovery" becomes
"universally marketable"?

IMO we don't need psychics or market analysts to tell us
there are already engineered devices that are waiting to be
released to a mass of technological believers - believers
who are just aching with birth pangs to leave this God-
forsaken planet for a new earth - but first there will be
a score to settle with the "dominionists".

:: Sure, once a base has become established,
:: all kinds of studies can be made while in planetary
:: isolation, but what does this really accomplish?

: The roots of colonization. Growing food, etc.

Already been there, done that. (See hydroponics,
the original 13 colonies, job responsibilities, etc.)

: I'm talking about growing plants to eat while on Mars!

That won't send metals back to earth orbit, now will it?
Still, you can do the same thing on a water-bearing moon -
lets say, Europa - Jupiter's moon - a base of operations
could be set up by initiating a flyby to SAR map Europa
for possible sites of silica/ice formations that are
within range of orbit parameters using aerogel from
bisilicate (HSiO3-), made from the silica in regolith, for
protection against heat, sound, and ultraviolet radiation,
and to provide a fully UV "tuned" greenhouse.

Silica Aerogel is catalyzed, meaning that catalysts are
used in the refining process in order to speed up the
reaction time. Strong base anion exchange resins can
remove virtually all reactive silica from frozen ice
after melting. Higher silica water can be removed
through ultra-filtration. A processing plant for both
H2O production and transparent aerogel would be well
suited for processing the materials required for the
construction of a Re-Nitrogenating Facility for regolith
excavated from a "dryer" surface of Europa.

Would bees be introduced to pollinate some of the plants
in a European greenhouse? If so, then the UV light would
have to be tuned to the frequency where the bees can
spot and pollinate some plants.

Silica Aerogel is catalyzed, meaning that catalysts are
used in the refining process in order to speed up the
reaction time. Strong base anion exchange resins can
remove virtually all reactive silica from frozen
ice after melting. Higher silica water can be removed
through ultra-filtration. A processing plant for both
H2O production and transparent aerogel would be well
suited for processing the materials required for the con-
struction of a Re-Nitrogenating Facility for regolith
excavated from a "dryer" surface of Europa.

What ever happened to the Europa Ice Clipper, the proposed
Discovery mission that was supposed to be eventually en-
dorsed by either/or NASA and JPL? There was an article in
6 January 1997: "Scientists Eager to Break the Ice on
Europa" Space News, and it was supposed to have launched
in December of 2001 and arrive at Europa in June of
this year? This is yet another indication that scientists
are serious about finding H2O in low-gravity environments.*

:: O'neill colonies achieve the same thing without
:: getting caught in the gravity wells of planets,
:: and also permit more earthly orbital type infra-
:: structures to become established for some actual
:: space industry for a space-faring civilization
:: to propogate throughout the solar system.

: No natural water. Mars has water as found by
: several landers. Not standing liquid water but
: in the permafrost. We need to create liquid
: water from the permafrost in a lander's lab the
: next time we send one.

Due to the spectre of new-found earth-like planetary
systems on the horizon, in addition to Mars being
such a gravity trap, we have the possibility of
Mars getting percieved as an entrenched prison
planet, in total dependence upon whatever outside
resources get to provide the escape route via some
'new earth' (post discovery). A prison riot on a
prison planet seems the greater likelihood. Who
WOULD these people be subservient to?

: You DO understand that Mars has a weaker gravity
: than does the Earth, right? Mars is on the order of
: 40% Earth's gravity. Also, we are NOT going to
: find an Earth-like planet in less than 4.4 light
: years away.

Doesn't matter - we've ALREADY GOT the technology to
go there - it's just being suppressed right now until
it's time to use it.

::: You don't think that far ahead, do you? Are you
::: like those GM types that have a 10-day forecast,
::: to which the Japanese found firghtening?

:: You making fun of GM?

: No! I am making fun of GM execs that thought no
: further ahead than the next 10 days!

And the price of gas didn't rise nearly $3/gallon
in the space of 3 months? Are you nuts?

:: Take a look at how the Arabs
:: control the oil, and you'll get an idea of how
:: the auto industry must follow suit.

: It seems that the Japanese and Europeans, that still
: have healthy auto industries, have managed to find
: a way to deal with the Arabs. Stop sounding like a
: victim and especially the Arabs, it doesn't suit you
: or your name.

Since you're describing only "European nations as
the only ones who can "deal with" the Arabs, let
me suggest that it wasn't "Europeans" who created
the engine of prosperity as it exists in it's
present form in the west: it wasn't "Europeans"
that America should emulate by example, esp.
if that technological mindset exists, already
and practically to undermine the useful idiocy
of Hollywood, the America-haters of the Communists,
the anti-religious bigots with their "religious-
free" zones (who position Christianity as a white
man's religion), the tort activists, and the
media whores who're in the business of creating
institutions out of monopoly and nepotism.

: You forgot to mention the Japanese in your diatribe.

Yeah, I know, but Europe's closer to the U.S., and
is supposed to have a much greater cultural significance.

So now you're telling me that the effect of rising
competition against a settlement on Mars will
be this media's acoutrement to professionally
reported news, esp. as they have become opposed
to these kinds of planetary monopolies?

: I never said such a thing!

Yet these are the things that MUST be inferred when
it comes to public perception.

Shame on you.

: For what, your perceived ills of mine which don't
: exist?

Not mine, ANYYONE that can read, know, and understand
that these things are actually happening today in this
country, as it is already happening in places like
Greece and the U.K.

When America's economic and security
interests become so entangled with the rest of
the world's, America's news media will separate
itself from the harloted economy - and that
means TOTAL economic separation - both domestically
and internationally, as it applies against the NWO
scheme of things.

: I wouldn't know how to validate your claim and I
: wonder if you could.

There happens to be hundreds of "Tea Parties" being
formed all over the country as of late... What's up
with that, HUH?

:: We're sick and
:: tired of high oil prices, but the rest of the
:: world wants to sanction the U.S. as a trading
:: partner, because most of this propoganda being
:: spewed by the ignorant don't know that there is
:: actually an infinite supply - they think in terms
:: their cups being half full, when they're actually
:: half emptied by greedy Arabs and greedy bureaucrats.

: We have had cheap oil for years and the rest of the
: world paid through the nose. I know, I lived in Europe.
: The rest of the world is getting even. That is all.
: It won't last forever.

By "getting even" shouldn't we insinuate that a common
misperception of America is that Americans use mechani-
zation to hit the head of Europeans?

: Winning two wars there did that. Even for those that
: were our allies, in case you haven't noticed! Are allies
: during WWI and WWII hate us more now than does those
: that were are enemies. And the latter isn't crazy
: about us!

Look at it from a scientific standpoint and you'll
understand that the COLD WAR was in fact a war of tech-
nological supremacy with what we were supposed to be
protecting - OUR LEAD AS A CAPITALIST SOCIETY with
the ability to market the systems that we were
trying to put into production - NOT JUST WAR FOR
WAR'S SAKE.

No, no, the
REAL America was hedging their bets against foreign
imperialist economic aggression, based upon the
enemies of free will within intelligent design.

: Are you saying that we are a favored nation by
: intelligent design?

Who is YOUR leader? Is it REALLY the president,
Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, or, is it the private
potential, along with time and chance that allowed
these people to achieve great things? IMO these were
things that were GIVEN to them, when the right kind
of intentional intelligent imprinting became avail-
able to them - is this not the same as intelligent
design? IMO yes it most certainly is...

The economic war continues, as the mis-perception
from initiator of progress to observer of progress,
without the least bit of understanding of how and
why that progress was, and is, becoming perceived.

: There is a relationship between the time/value of money.
: Right now value is lagging, money is being printed and
: the only healing point will be time. How long, who knows?

And ideas are still the solution to many of our problems,
regardless of the climate that the doomsday prophets
will suggest is on the horizon.

: I remember when the German Mark was worth a quarter.
: Now the euro is worth more than the dollar. You want
: progress? Let's work on reaching parity with the
: euro and then passing them!

The NWO is too entrenched with the financial systems
of the world to create the right kind of "parity"
between "observers" and "initiators". As such, those
in control, or more exactly, the Antichrist, will
cause all, both rich and poor, bond and free...)
which comes from the book of Revelation 13: 16-18,
so IO'm not so sure about you're system of "parity".

: I am not talking parity by definition, but I'll bet
: prayer won't solve our economic crisis either. We have
: to work harder than the Europeans, at least for awhile.
: Or, come up with something like digital electronics,
: the computer, the Internet, etc. Something else.
: We are at a technological standstill.

Liberalism is a state of mind, a psychosis. What liberals
really want is control, and the ability to feel good about
themselves. A nation saddled with debt is the ability to
destroy other people's lives, in order to "share" their
misery with those who can't have the ability to depend
upon a higher power, or a higher authority, and in vali-
dating their intentions with negative law.

::: Look at GM now. We had BETTER learn to think
::: five years ahead if we plan on being here then!
::: The same goes for 100!

:: The economy of orbital and transorbital technologi
:: an asteroid mining technology venture would depend
:: a massive political and cultural drive in order to
:: erate the market incentive for propogating the tech
:: in order to establish an eternally accessible, earth
:: orbit market - competing directly with the earth-ba
:: mining infrastructure, specifically legislated by an
:: independent authority to decrease the monopolies tha
:: have become entrenched by the interlocking corporate
:: directorships of the New World Order.

: There is no supply and demand problem with metal
: today that warrants the cost of spaceflight to the
: asteroids to bring back metal to earth.

Aside of the exploitation of mineral resources, that if
there was more of a need for macroeconomic ripples,

"You are allowed to disagree if you believe that the
Federal Reserve sets the rates for platinum, which it
would not if the privateers are the ones who set the
price in the first place. Just because there is "policing"
or "fear" that greed will run amok on earth is no reason
to believe that the privateers are a bunch of pirates,
either. You can arbitrarily set the price of platinum
as low as you want, so the resource for platinum will
then just "dry up" without replenishment." All this
means is that outside of earth orbit, there are advan-
tages to being closer to where the mining takes place."

: When metal meteorites hit the Earth are they
: ever platinum?

On the earth, primary metals like platinum are recovered
as byproducts of primary metals gold, silver, iron, nickel,
and cobalt. With nickel platinum comes as a sulphide ore,
while palladium is mixed as flakes, grains, and nodules
in black sands. Platinum alloys are found as grayish
grains within these sands.

One of the eight major classes of Chondrite metal in as-
teroids are very low-iron containing Chondrites, or about
2.2% containing 50 ppm of platinum ore, usually w/ Nickel
and/or Cobalt that may also contain non-metals Gallium,
Germanium, and Arsenic.

: Sure I like the Dawn mission, but it isn't going
: to be the next quarry for earth-based manufacturing.
: We'll use the asteroids for space-based manufacturing.

There are near earth asteroids that are supposed to be
metal-rich. Their spectrographic signatures identify
them as enstatite achrondites, consisting of enstatite
or magnesium silicate, containing abundant metal and
silicon. There are also literally hundreds of addi-
tional inner belt asteroids that are of the earth-
crossing type (notice that I did not say near-earth
approaching). The spectrographic signatures of these
asteroids are also effected using advanced
SAR technology.

: But nothing cheaper, of what we know that they are,
: that we can't get out of the ground on Earth.

The primary "sisters" of platinum in refining are palladium
and iridium. Platinum is soluable using cold nitrohydro-
chloric acid (one part nitric acid to three parts hydro-
chloric acid). A salt that goes into solution is platinum
chloride. A silver-platinum alloy containing 25% or less
platinum will go into solution as platinum nitrate, and
renders it as impossible to recover the platinum metal.
At greater than 25% platinum content, nitrohydrochloric
acid will still dissolve some of the platinum metal into
solution as a platinum nitrate compound.

Any free silver or gold that was alloyed with the platinum
will create a grey-white coating of silver chloride over
the undissolved platinum, which can be washed off into
a cast iron vessel in order to brush and/or grind loose
any silver chloride back into solution. (The poured-off
acid wash can be further refined for additional platinum,
gold, and/or silver residues).

I've designed a storage cannister that retreives the raw
spectrographed native metal alloys from the cathode metal
deposit immersed in the electrolyte and loads them into
the carbonyl extractor. In the gaseous carbonyl process,
these native metal alloys from are treated with CO (carbon
monoxide) at a pressure of 1 to 10 atmospheres. The metal
carbonyl gas stream becomes decomposed by heating and
precipitating iron and/or nickel, releasing CO gas for
recycling. The energy required is so small (120 C - 300 C)
that Mok solar panels can provide the energy for heating
if thermoelectric generators are not available.

:: Doesn't anyone recognize that the NWO is an *evil*
:: entity? (Based upon the current economic climate,
:: I'll bet NO)

: The planet is 7,927 miles wide. Always has been always
: will be. We are 6.6 billion and growing. They say by
: 2050 we'll level off. The point is that the more people
: there are means a shrinking earth that must be dealt
: with. You can't undo global communication and tech-
: nological progress like the internet. It is here
: to stay.

Minted Asteroidal gold is a sure driver for industrial-
izing the solar system, and is not so far off as most
dominionists think:

"An easing of constraints on the use of minted coin,
set by the privateers, would allow the economic par
to shift back into the direction of pay-in credit
as well as easing the national debt, as promisory
reinvest towards financial and technological indep

: Again, has any meteorite ever been found to be made
: of gold?

For the soils lab processing system, 0.25% cyanide solution
is combined with coarse charcoal in a high speed centrifuge
while accepting alloy carbonyl from the decomposer tank. The
0.25% quantity is subject to an ore 'test for fitness'
prior to refining the entire tank. Climate controlled
storage tanks for both hot cyanide concentrate and H2O are
pumped simultaneously into a mixing tank for the refining
operation. The mixing tank heats the solution before pumping
it into the centrifuge. The resultant pregnant solution
is pumped from the centrifuge into stock tanks, which are
used as reaction vessels for precipitating the gold and
silver ions from the solution. These stock tanks can
rotate at 40 rpm and contain a retractable siphon.

Kel-f storage tanks containing separated components of
hydrochloric acid and nitric acid, Teflon insulated tanks
containing mossy zinc (removed by an auger valve), gasoline
tanks, industrial air supply tanks, and potassium hydro-
xide tanks are used for supply in the refining operation.

(from:

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.s...f99860c0ebd?hl

: Eric

One often mentions the highly elliptical orbit trajectory
delta-V's required for phasing perigee towards the
asteroid's orbital intercept, and the fuel used in the
round trip. I have uploaded a listing of "Delta-v for
Spacecraft Rendezvous" at:

http://home.comcast.net/~samuel_rans...ndezvous_h.htm

A flyby requires a window that stretches
from a long range, low delta-V to a short range, high
delta-V, and the cargo vessel window of opportunity exists
to a lesser degree within this window. Not all rotational
periods are available for an asteroid.

For this reason, the flyby would be the real determinant of
whether or not to mine the asteroid. However, many of the
larger asteroids ( 1 km.) have low enough rotation periods
that it would not affect the mining operation.

Since we're operating in a very low-g environment, strip
mining would be out of the question. Following up on a
synthetic aperture radar mapping of the asteroid, we
have available data that can be gleaned for specific
metal deposits that are approximately 1mm surface depth.

: The cost of getting to the asteriod, plus the cost of
: extracting the metal, and then sending the ore back to
: earth far outweighs the value of the ore!

Not if there are literally millions of tons that can be
refined and processed in or out of orbit in zero-g using
nuke-pulsed spacecraft with on-site refining. I've already
stated that the H2O is there, the processes are known,
and the market is waiting ...

It is my contention that over a specific number of counts,
let's say a few hundred thousand gamma quanta distribu-
tions, the presence of a larger field of width and/or
depth for exploration may be narrowed down to within
5 or ten meters wide and/or deep. More desirably we
can drill down using huge boring devices rather than
strip mining because of the low-g problem. The mining
area is also under the "umbrella" of the cargo vessel,
which protects it from the harmful radiation if on the
bright side of the asteroid. There are already collec-
tion, scanning, screening, and storage devices that
have been designed for these kinds of operations.

: Sure, Sci-Fi writers live for this sort of thing. Heck,
: I am reading a book, "Cold as Ice", that is discussing
: the conversion of the Europan ocean into a shallow
: ice crust from a thick crust by melting the underside
: of the ice in order to create plants which can carry
: on photosynthesis. I call it aquaforming, probably
: others do as well. But it is Sci-Fi, dude, just like
: mining the asteriods in 2009.

Not sci-fi, Doonebury, FACT. And the sooner you begin
to understand that things happen when they are actually
THOUGHT ABOUT is when you and others like you will
stop looking at the world through rose colored glasses!

: Eric


American

"Whenever a system becomes completely defined, some
fringe experimenter discovers something which either
abolishes the system or expands it beyond recognition."

Deirdre Sholto Douglas wrote:

jmfbahciv wrote:
snip


Do you like writing?

Depends on the sort of writing...I'm not overfond of longhand
on paper any longer and anything remotely calligraphic I leave
to my daughter. If you mean creatively, I lack the imagination
to write anything fictional...I can record facts and reality well
enough and don't dislike doing so, but I'm not a hardcore diarist.

I was thinking about reports and tech papers, etc. The most
difficult thing for me to do was writing specs; I wouldn't have
worked as a writer even if they paid me $1 million/day.

Note that I'm not ignoring your other posts; they simply
require thinking for a while.

Even if you were, there are worse things than being ignored.

grin Understood.

/BAH

jmfbahciv wrote:

Deirdre Sholto Douglas wrote:

jmfbahciv wrote:
snip


Do you like writing?

Depends on the sort of writing...I'm not overfond of longhand
on paper any longer and anything remotely calligraphic I leave
to my daughter. If you mean creatively, I lack the imagination
to write anything fictional...I can record facts and reality well
enough and don't dislike doing so, but I'm not a hardcore diarist.

I was thinking about reports and tech papers, etc. The most
difficult thing for me to do was writing specs; I wouldn't have
worked as a writer even if they paid me $1 million/day.

Writing isn't really too much of a problem, although I confess,
I find writing in "passive voice" to be a bit of a nuisance. I'm
not entirely certain if there's difference is between writing
specs and writing up a "materials and methods" section...both
strike me as dry enough to ignite with a single spark...but I've
never written (to my knowledge) specifications. For a million
dollars a day however, I suspect I could force myself. :-)

Deirdre