|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#21
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On Jul 9, 3:39*pm, Sam Wormley wrote:
On 7/9/10 3:36 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote: if there are more neutrinos roaming than even photons and they oscillate their mass dont you think that is significant enough to account for the dark matter when it comes to particles alone? * *The observed clumping of dark matter doesn't fit the observed * *properties of neutrinos. so this cannot be explained with BH dynamics? do we need to discover a cold dark matter particle? |
#22
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/9/10 3:42 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote:
On Jul 9, 3:39 pm, Sam wrote: On 7/9/10 3:36 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote: if there are more neutrinos roaming than even photons and they oscillate their mass dont you think that is significant enough to account for the dark matter when it comes to particles alone? The observed clumping of dark matter doesn't fit the observed properties of neutrinos. so this cannot be explained with BH dynamics? do we need to discover a cold dark matter particle? Most likely. |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On Jul 9, 2:47*pm, Sam Wormley wrote:
On 7/9/10 3:42 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote: On Jul 9, 3:39 pm, Sam *wrote: On 7/9/10 3:36 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote: if there are more neutrinos roaming than even photons and they oscillate their mass dont you think that is significant enough to account for the dark matter when it comes to particles alone? * * The observed clumping of dark matter doesn't fit the observed * * properties of neutrinos. so this cannot be explained with BH dynamics? do we need to discover a cold dark matter particle? * *Most likely. why the lhc has not produce this wimps? more and more you see diferent explanations to fit observation. BH have shown to be a very ordinary thing. they can expain dark matter or the origins and structure of any objects in spacetime. r.y |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/9/10 6:27 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote:
why the lhc has not produce this wimps? How do you know the LHC has not produced or detected WIMPS? more and more you see diferent explanations to fit observation. Can you provide and example of different explanation to fit an observation you are referring to? BH have shown to be a very ordinary thing. they can expain dark matter or the origins and structure of any objects in spacetime. Dark Matter does not appear to interact with the electromagnetic force, whereas black holes do (in spades). |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/9/2010 11:35 PM, Charles D. Bohne wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jul 2010 22:17:40 +0600, Yousuf wrote: One of the latest theories postulates that space is nothing more than a bunch of qubits in a quantum computer. Yousuf Khan Any names? Links? Thanks in advance! C. [gr-qc/0304032] Spacetime at the Planck Scale: The Quantum Computer View http://arxiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0304032 Yousuf Khan |
#26
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/10/2010 12:12 AM, Raymond Yohros wrote:
On Jul 9, 1:21 am, Yousuf wrote: On 7/9/2010 3:19 AM, Raymond Yohros wrote: please see my point. i don't mean that there are more neutrinos that photons. what i mean is that there should be more neutrinos TRAVELING. nuclear reactions create proportional (neutrino,photonic) outputs. photons interact alot more with matter so they stay behind. neutrinos keep ridding and ridding. they can be in this planet now and in some other a few minutes later. they are not easy to stop. photons arriving here are used and reused by baryonic matter in all types of processes. Well, I'm not going to belabour the point, but I definitely did not read it that way. Your language is a little confusing sometimes. Sometimes it's better to just use point form. i misspell the word ride. sorry for that! No, no, I got that, but the paragraph itself creates misunderstandings about what you're trying to say. These particular neutrinos are not like the neutrinos we see today These ones would be billions of times less massive than today's neutrinos. And today's neutrinos are already some of the least massive particles in the universe. what neutrinos are you talking about? The neutrinos in the original article I posted, the ones that are supposed to be 10 billion light years across by themselves. Oh, BTW, a neutrino with a wavefunction that's 10 billion light years can be anywhere within that wavefunction at any instant. That means it can pop up anywhere within the 10 billion light years instantly. That means it's way faster than light. this does not make any sense! wimps are suppose to be a lot more massive that neutrinos and they do not exist. this are just artifacts to try to coup with observation because of incomplete neutrino understandings. Welcome to the weird world of quantum mechanics. The speed of light is inconsequential to it, since that speed is governed by the laws of Special Relativity. When scientists say that we have two different laws of physics, a quantum one and a relativistic one, they really mean it: they are both laws and they are incompatible with each other. It's like states laws vs. federal laws in the United States. But unlike the US laws, there isn't a hierarchy where one law takes precedence over another, here there's no Supreme Court to adjudicate. quantum cosmology is like the supreme court and the idea is to unify this two theories with elegant explanations that make sense in both the macro and micro realms. Right now, we got two district courts, and no supreme court. If the district courts interpret the laws differently then it's the supreme court's job to resolve the differences. Anyways, in QM, particles don't travel through space. They exist in space inside a wavefunction, and they just pop up anywhere within the confines of the wavefunction without moving through the spaces in between. Since they're not "moving" through space, but simply appearing and disappearing from space, they don't have to worry about the speed limit. yes, a square motion goes from one value to another without going through the space in between. a ramp or triangle its continuos. I don't quite understand what you're referring to here. These are among the many rules that scientists already know about that can bypass the speed of light. Wormholes and the Casimir Effect are other things that can do it. Cosmic Inflation which happened just after the Big Bang also expanded the Universe faster than the speed of light. like the analogy of the folded page. if you move through a shorter spacetime you can get faster than going all the way around even at c. That's a wormhole. but that does not mean that things can move faster that light. If you're bypassing spacetime, then the concept of speed (i.e. traveling from one point in space to another point in a certain amount of time) is rendered meaningless because you're not using time to move over that distance, you're using some other dimension. Yousuf Khan |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/10/2010 12:20 AM, Sam Wormley wrote:
On 7/9/10 11:17 AM, Yousuf Khan wrote: One of the latest theories postulates that space is nothing more than a bunch of qubits in a quantum computer. Yousuf Khan What is the source of this "postulate", Yousuf? See the link I posted for Charles. Yousuf Khan |
#28
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On Jul 10, 7:02*am, Yousuf Khan wrote:
On 7/10/2010 12:12 AM, Raymond Yohros wrote: On Jul 9, 1:21 am, Yousuf *wrote: On 7/9/2010 3:19 AM, Raymond Yohros wrote: please see my point. i don't mean that there are more neutrinos that photons. what i mean is that there should be more neutrinos TRAVELING.. nuclear reactions create proportional (neutrino,photonic) outputs. photons interact alot more with matter so they stay behind. neutrinos keep ridding and ridding. they can be in this planet now and in some other a few minutes later. they are not easy to stop. photons arriving here are used and reused by baryonic matter in all types of processes. Well, I'm not going to belabour the point, but I definitely did not read it that way. Your language is a little confusing sometimes. Sometimes it's better to just use point form. i misspell the word ride. sorry for that! No, no, I got that, but the paragraph itself creates misunderstandings about what you're trying to say. yes, i guess i use to many words. there could be more photons than neutrinos in the universe. but there should be more neutrinos than photons traveling because they are not easy to stop. they interact a lot less (weakly) so as you point out, they can be 10 billion years old and still be riding! These particular neutrinos are not like the neutrinos we see today These ones would be billions of times less massive than today's neutrinos. And today's neutrinos are already some of the least massive particles in the universe. what neutrinos are you talking about? The neutrinos in the original article I posted, the ones that are supposed to be 10 billion light years across by themselves. yes, i got it now. but why "billions" of times liter than younger neutrinos? photons are the second riders because they stop and wonder around a lot more. even when they keep bouncing, their travel distances can be affected by baryonic matter. Oh, BTW, a neutrino with a wavefunction that's 10 billion light years can be anywhere within that wavefunction at any instant. That means it can pop up anywhere within the 10 billion light years instantly. That means it's way faster than light. this does not make any sense! wimps are suppose to be a lot more massive that neutrinos and they do not exist. this are just artifacts to try to coup with observation because of incomplete neutrino understandings. Welcome to the weird world of quantum mechanics. The speed of light is inconsequential to it, since that speed is governed by the laws of Special Relativity. When scientists say that we have two different laws of physics, a quantum one and a relativistic one, they really mean it: they are both laws and they are incompatible with each other. It's like states laws vs. federal laws in the United States. But unlike the US laws, there isn't a hierarchy where one law takes precedence over another, here there's no Supreme Court to adjudicate. quantum cosmology is like the supreme court and the idea is to unify this two theories with elegant explanations that make sense in both the macro and micro realms. Right now, we got two district courts, and no supreme court. If the district courts interpret the laws differently then it's the supreme court's job to resolve the differences. i don't understand politics. isn't the job of quantum cosmology to find common ground between the two schools of thoath? i know it has not happen jet. Anyways, in QM, particles don't travel through space. They exist in space inside a wavefunction, and they just pop up anywhere within the confines of the wavefunction without moving through the spaces in between. Since they're not "moving" through space, but simply appearing and disappearing from space, they don't have to worry about the speed limit. yes, a square motion goes from one value to another without going through the space in between. a ramp or triangle its continuos. I don't quite understand what you're referring to here. in a synth you have the following wave functions: saw or ramp, triangle, square, and sin wave(circular) you can mix functions and you can change frequency and amplitude with operators and controllers and/or modulate properties. xample. if you have a source value of 1 and a target value of 1024, in a square function the synth will go from 1 to 1024 without going through the values in between. you can choose the rate in wish this happens. on a triangle function, it will go from 1 to 1024 going through all the values in between and then back to 1. a sin fuction its analog for a sin wave motion. These are among the many rules that scientists already know about that can bypass the speed of light. Wormholes and the Casimir Effect are other things that can do it. Cosmic Inflation which happened just after the Big Bang also expanded the Universe faster than the speed of light.. like the analogy of the folded page. if you move through a shorter spacetime you can get faster than going all the way around even at c. That's a wormhole. but that does not mean that things can move faster that light. If you're bypassing spacetime, then the concept of speed (i.e. traveling from one point in space to another point in a certain amount of time) is rendered meaningless because you're not using time to move over that distance, you're using some other dimension. * * * * Yousuf Khan it will be like a square type of motion. regards r.y |
#29
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On 7/12/2010 11:16 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote:
On Jul 10, 7:02 am, Yousuf wrote: These particular neutrinos are not like the neutrinos we see today These ones would be billions of times less massive than today's neutrinos. And today's neutrinos are already some of the least massive particles in the universe. what neutrinos are you talking about? The neutrinos in the original article I posted, the ones that are supposed to be 10 billion light years across by themselves. yes, i got it now. but why "billions" of times liter than younger neutrinos? Well simply because these neutrinos have been "stretched" by spacetime during the Cosmic Inflation period. Cosmic Inflation is the period immediately after the Big Bang occurred, where the universe went from something smaller than an atom to something about 80% as big as it is now, all within less than a second! Inflation (cosmology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_inflation If a neutrino was created just before Inflation, right after Inflation, that neutrino's wavefunction will have been stretched immensely. to about 10 billion light years. A normal neutrino would have a sub-microscopic wavefunction. These ancient neutrinos started out as normal neutrinos, but got stretched to high-heaven, therefore they have less mass since they have more parts of space to exist in. And you'll notice that for the universe to expand so quickly, it had to do it *faster* than the speed of light. Another example of how to bypass the speed of light. photons are the second riders because they stop and wonder around a lot more. even when they keep bouncing, their travel distances can be affected by baryonic matter. Well, not all photons are stopping and moseying around. Some are coming directly at us from the furthest parts of the universe, without going anywhere else in between. So those photons can be over 13 billion years old themselves. quantum cosmology is like the supreme court and the idea is to unify this two theories with elegant explanations that make sense in both the macro and micro realms. Right now, we got two district courts, and no supreme court. If the district courts interpret the laws differently then it's the supreme court's job to resolve the differences. i don't understand politics. isn't the job of quantum cosmology to find common ground between the two schools of thoath? i know it has not happen jet. Right now, there is no quantum gravity laws yet. There are just a bunch of proposals for some. You may have heard of some of them, Superstring theory, M-Theory, Loop Quantum Gravity, etc. Once we know which one is the right one (if any of them), then we'll know how things work in all scales of the universe, and even if they transition from one level to another. Anyways, in QM, particles don't travel through space. They exist in space inside a wavefunction, and they just pop up anywhere within the confines of the wavefunction without moving through the spaces in between. Since they're not "moving" through space, but simply appearing and disappearing from space, they don't have to worry about the speed limit. yes, a square motion goes from one value to another without going through the space in between. a ramp or triangle its continuos. I don't quite understand what you're referring to here. in a synth you have the following wave functions: saw or ramp, triangle, square, and sin wave(circular) Well, actually, you'll find that a square wave is really a very steep trapezoid. It's not as instant as you think, however it is useful to think of it as instant and ignore the small ramp time. squa _ _| |_ trapezoid: _ _/ \_ If you're bypassing spacetime, then the concept of speed (i.e. traveling from one point in space to another point in a certain amount of time) is rendered meaningless because you're not using time to move over that distance, you're using some other dimension. Yousuf Khan it will be like a square type of motion. regards r.y Yes, you can think of it that way, even though a synth's square function is not really that square. However, in QM, it really is instantly from one place to another without going through the stuff in between. In fact, in QM, you can even have the same particle existing in two or more places simultaneously. In reality, this particle is probably traveling through another dimension and bypassing time, and we just see it as instantly being one place or another, or even in two places at the same time. Yousuf Khan |
#30
|
|||
|
|||
Particles Larger Than Galaxies Fill the Universe?
On Jul 13, 7:03 am, Yousuf Khan wrote:
On 7/12/2010 11:16 PM, Raymond Yohros wrote: Well simply because these neutrinos have been "stretched" by spacetime during the Cosmic Inflation period. Cosmic Inflation is the period immediately after the Big Bang occurred, where the universe went from something smaller than an atom to something about 80% as big as it is now, all within less than a second! Inflation (cosmology) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_inflation a second near the big bang is not the same as a second in ordinary spacetime. for us, it goes with the flash of an eye but near the bb, there where so many things going on that it can take more than a lifetime to imagine. If a neutrino was created just before Inflation, right after Inflation, that neutrino's wavefunction will have been stretched immensely. to about 10 billion light years. A normal neutrino would have a sub-microscopic wavefunction. These ancient neutrinos started out as normal neutrinos, but got stretched to high-heaven, therefore they have less mass since they have more parts of space to exist in. relik neutrinos d bb was the biggest photo-neutrino mass production in history And you'll notice that for the universe to expand so quickly, it had to do it *faster* than the speed of light. Another example of how to bypass the speed of light. this was inversely related to what was going on before spacetime was of the size of an atom. photons are the second riders because they stop and wonder around a lot more. even when they keep bouncing, their travel distances can be affected by baryonic matter. Well, not all photons are stopping and moseying around. Some are coming directly at us from the furthest parts of the universe, without going anywhere else in between. So those photons can be over 13 billion years old themselves. quantum cosmology is like the supreme court and the idea is to unify this two theories with elegant explanations that make sense in both the macro and micro realms. Right now, we got two district courts, and no supreme court. If the district courts interpret the laws differently then it's the supreme court's job to resolve the differences. i don't understand politics. isn't the job of quantum cosmology to find common ground between the two schools of thoath? i know it has not happen jet. Right now, there is no quantum gravity laws yet. There are just a bunch of proposals for some. You may have heard of some of them, Superstring theory, M-Theory, Loop Quantum Gravity, etc. Once we know which one is the right one (if any of them), then we'll know how things work in all scales of the universe, and even if they transition from one level to another. the best approach will be to enforce observations with the most simple elegant explanations. there is no need for the word "super" for strings that are really closer to simple 3d strands that can define wave-particle structure. r.y in a synth you have the following wave functions: saw or ramp, triangle, square, and sin wave(circular) Well, actually, you'll find that a square wave is really a very steep trapezoid. It's not as instant as you think, however it is useful to think of it as instant and ignore the small ramp time. squa _ _| |_ trapezoid: _ _/ \_ If you're bypassing spacetime, then the concept of speed (i.e. traveling from one point in space to another point in a certain amount of time) is rendered meaningless because you're not using time to move over that distance, you're using some other dimension. it will be like a square type of motion. Yes, you can think of it that way, even though a synth's square function is not really that square. However, in QM, it really is instantly from one place to another without going through the stuff in between. In fact, in QM, you can even have the same particle existing in two or more places simultaneously. In reality, this particle is probably traveling through another dimension and bypassing time, and we just see it as instantly being one place or another, or even in two places at the same time. Yousuf Khan |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
More Fill In The Blanks History Of The Universe | nightbat[_1_] | Misc | 0 | June 29th 07 01:39 PM |
Black Holes May Fill the Universe with Seeds of Life (Forwarded) | Andrew Yee | Astronomy Misc | 1 | April 26th 07 08:36 PM |
Black Holes May Fill the Universe with Seeds of Life (Forwarded) | Andrew Yee[_1_] | News | 0 | April 25th 07 05:22 AM |
As the Universe is our Solar System also Getting Larger ??? | G=EMC^2 Glazier[_1_] | Misc | 19 | February 21st 07 01:03 PM |
could the universe be part of a larger fractal? | troll hunter | UK Astronomy | 13 | July 8th 04 09:44 PM |