Mars Spectacular

On Thursday, August 14, 2014 4:02:27 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:


So I say again you are just wrong.

Learn to interpret the diagrams. East is between northeast and south so the

sun has to reach east after sunrise and before noon.

No people throughout the magnificent history of the human race ever imagined the Sun moves in a circumpolar path insofar as it is furthest East on the horizon at dawn and furthest West at sunset with the graceful arc of the Sun stretching out towards the observer -

http://images.fineartamerica.com/ima...parviainen.jpg

Lacking any sense or meaning, you celestial sphere cultists imagine otherwise and I would discuss the specific motion of the Sun from horizon to horizon across the Equinoxes at the polar latitudes if I could find someone,anyone who could attribute the apparent annual motion of the Sun to the surface rotation of the Earth with respect to the central Sun as a function of its orbital motion.

There is no love of life here,after all, the joy of a sunrise and sunset in the material of inspiration and always has been with its familiar arc from horizon to horizon reminding us what a gorgeous planet this is -

http://images.fineartamerica.com/ima...parviainen.jpg

As for your unnatural arc as the Sun emerges from the horizon,it says more of your state of spirit and mind and the many here who have a hatred of all life.

On Wed, 13 Aug 2014 18:25:58 -0700 (PDT), Quadibloc wrote:

On Wednesday, August 13, 2014 7:04:39 PM UTC-6, Bill wrote:

Sperm count?!

Whew, I thought I might lose my plica fimbriata to my chronic
destructive cultitis. Good to know I'll only lose some sperm.

Well, I can't give you that kind of guarantee; he said it makes one less than a man in _every_ way. I just noted sperm count as one of the absurd consequences of that, since presumably he was thinking in terms of things like courage and other virtues.

John Savard

I was just enjoying your sense of humor. It just fits the situation
perfectly.


--
Email address is a Spam trap.

The celestial sphere cult and it is a cult has one definite trait which can be isolated technically and could be discouraged in those who can save themselves from that regrettable condition.

Where the reasoning is clear and the mind can adjust to a productive view, all observations are made towards the Earth's Equator as opposed to the North and South poles insofar as the hemispherical views with the stars turning in circumpolar motion beloved of the celestial sphere cult.

The daily arc of the Sun is registered towards the Equator whether in the Northern or Southern hemisphere as are the seasonal variations in arc for any given latitude so that observations are translated into dynamical cause without any recourse to circumpolar motion. The problem of referencing the daily and annual apparent motions of the Sun in a circumpolar framework (even without the hideous unnatural arc) is that it is impossible to reconcile both hemispherical observations simultaneously and subsequently the translation in planetary dynamics,cause and effect and so on.

Anyone who has a feeling that there is something really wrong with putting the Sun in a circumpolar arc seen in these star trails will be taking a step away from that celestial sphere cult with its unthinking behavior and towards the stable and lovely narrative of genuine astronomy -

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap130303.html

oriel36 wrote:
The celestial sphere cult and it is a cult has one definite trait which
can be isolated technically and could be discouraged in those who can
save themselves from that regrettable condition.

Where the reasoning is clear and the mind can adjust to a productive
view, all observations are made towards the Earth's Equator as opposed to
the North and South poles insofar as the hemispherical views with the
stars turning in circumpolar motion beloved of the celestial sphere cult.

The daily arc of the Sun is registered towards the Equator whether in the
Northern or Southern hemisphere as are the seasonal variations in arc for
any given latitude so that observations are translated into dynamical
cause without any recourse to circumpolar motion. The problem of
referencing the daily and annual apparent motions of the Sun in a
circumpolar framework (even without the hideous unnatural arc) is that it
is impossible to reconcile both hemispherical observations simultaneously
and subsequently the translation in planetary dynamics,cause and effect and so on.

Anyone who has a feeling that there is something really wrong with
putting the Sun in a circumpolar arc seen in these star trails will be
taking a step away from that celestial sphere cult with its unthinking
behavior and towards the stable and lovely narrative of genuine astronomy -

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap130303.html

Any star or planet which rises and sets will have a similar arc to the sun.
Those stars which are closest to the ecliptic will have the most similar
arcs.
But everything except satellites will seem to move around the poles as the
Earth turns.
This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness.

You just have to live with it!

Mike Collins:
...
This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness.
You just have to live with it!

Well, that settles it. You have put Oriel straight once and for all
time and it seems unlikely he will post here again, right? I mean, you
must be pretty certain of that, otherwise you wouldn't waste your time
answering him, right?

--
I agree with almost everything that you have said and almost everything that
you will say in your entire life.

usenet *at* davidillig dawt cawm

Davoud wrote:
Mike Collins:
...
This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness.
You just have to live with it!

Well, that settles it. You have put Oriel straight once and for all
time and it seems unlikely he will post here again, right? I mean, you
must be pretty certain of that, otherwise you wouldn't waste your time
answering him, right?


Eventually the horse may learn to sing. But I'm not taking bets.

On Friday, August 15, 2014 4:17:20 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:

But everything except satellites will seem to move around the poles as the

Earth turns.

This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness.



You just have to live with it!

Here is circumpolar motion taken from England -

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...-_2141744i.jpg

Ignorance and madness indeed !, if you can get the Sun to follow that path as the Sun emerges from the horizon then none of you have ever adored a sunrise or a sunset as the Sun moves directly West by virtue of a round and rotating Earth -

http://www.hoydalsvik.net/astrofoto/...t_20101201.jpg

The difference between a genuine astronomer and a celestial sphere cultist like yourself is that the astronomer refers the apparent motion of the Sun to the actual motions and shape of the Earth while a cultist will try to reference the motion of the Sun to a rotating celestial sphere with its opposing arcs for each hemisphere -

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap140620.html

All it shows Collins is that you and your kind lack that love which makes knowledge meaningful insofar as sunrise, sunset and the trajectory of the Sun's arc resonates in a special way with humans in that it draws attention to the central star that makes life possible and the motions of the Earth which bring the Sun into view and make it disappear beyond the horizon.

You can't show me a circumpolar arc at all latitudes as the Sun makes its way from horizon to horizon but again,all that shows are tired middle class phonies calling themselves 'astronomers' by virtue of magnification equipment.

oriel36 wrote:
On Friday, August 15, 2014 4:17:20 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:

But everything except satellites will seem to move around the poles as the

Earth turns.

This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness.



You just have to live with it!

Here is circumpolar motion taken from England -

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...-_2141744i.jpg

Ignorance and madness indeed !, if you can get the Sun to follow that
path as the Sun emerges from the horizon then none of you have ever
adored a sunrise or a sunset as the Sun moves directly West by virtue of
a round and rotating Earth -

Think about this very carefully. This view is to the Northeast, The sun is
below the horizon. As Tacitus pointed out almost 2,000 years ago in the
north of Britain the glow of the sun can be seen all night during the
summer passing below the horizon. When below the horizon the Sun follows
exactly the same arc as the stars behind the body of the Angel Of ther
North.
Here's another set of star trails but facing South. You will see that they
follow the same type of arc as the sun but facing south it's easier to
think of these arcs as centred on the South Pole.



http://www.hoydalsvik.net/astrofoto/...t_20101201.jpg

This photo is magnified and occupies only about 12 degrees.

The difference between a genuine astronomer and a celestial sphere
cultist like yourself is that the astronomer refers the apparent motion
of the Sun to the actual motions and shape of the Earth while a cultist
will try to reference the motion of the Sun to a rotating celestial
sphere with its opposing arcs for each hemisphere -

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap140620.html

All it shows Collins is that you and your kind lack that love which makes
knowledge meaningful insofar as sunrise, sunset and the trajectory of the
Sun's arc resonates in a special way with humans in that it draws
attention to the central star that makes life possible and the motions of
the Earth which bring the Sun into view and make it disappear beyond the horizon.

You can't show me a circumpolar arc at all latitudes as the Sun makes its
way from horizon to horizon but again,all that shows are tired middle
class phonies calling themselves 'astronomers' by virtue of magnification equipment.

I have just shown you these arcs. Remember you have great difficulty
interpreting any photograph. You keep seeing green cats but unlike my late
father you think the cats really are green.
Look again at your chart of the sun in Hammerfest. Look at the shape of the
area below the horizon.
Then, instead of posting again straight away think carefully.
A real man, one with empathy and compassion, will try to put himself in the
place of his opponents and attempt to follow their reasoning. We're trying
to help you!

On Friday, August 15, 2014 8:08:32 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:
oriel36 wrote:

On Friday, August 15, 2014 4:17:20 PM UTC+1, Mike Collins wrote:



But everything except satellites will seem to move around the poles as the



Earth turns.



This is a simple observable fact. To deny this is ignorance or madness..







You just have to live with it!



Here is circumpolar motion taken from England -



http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...-_2141744i.jpg



Ignorance and madness indeed !, if you can get the Sun to follow that

path as the Sun emerges from the horizon then none of you have ever

adored a sunrise or a sunset as the Sun moves directly West by virtue of

a round and rotating Earth -



Think about this very carefully. This view is to the Northeast, The sun is

below the horizon. As Tacitus pointed out almost 2,000 years ago in the

north of Britain the glow of the sun can be seen all night during the

summer passing below the horizon. When below the horizon the Sun follows

exactly the same arc as the stars behind the body of the Angel Of ther

North.

Here's another set of star trails but facing South. You will see that they

follow the same type of arc as the sun but facing south it's easier to

think of these arcs as centred on the South Pole.







http://www.hoydalsvik.net/astrofoto/...t_20101201.jpg



This photo is magnified and occupies only about 12 degrees.



The difference between a genuine astronomer and a celestial sphere

cultist like yourself is that the astronomer refers the apparent motion

of the Sun to the actual motions and shape of the Earth while a cultist

will try to reference the motion of the Sun to a rotating celestial

sphere with its opposing arcs for each hemisphere -



http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap140620.html



All it shows Collins is that you and your kind lack that love which makes

knowledge meaningful insofar as sunrise, sunset and the trajectory of the

Sun's arc resonates in a special way with humans in that it draws

attention to the central star that makes life possible and the motions of

the Earth which bring the Sun into view and make it disappear beyond the horizon.



You can't show me a circumpolar arc at all latitudes as the Sun makes its

way from horizon to horizon but again,all that shows are tired middle

class phonies calling themselves 'astronomers' by virtue of magnification equipment.



I have just shown you these arcs.

You have shown me an arc within the Arctic circle created by the daily and annual surface rotations of the Earth with the major surface rotation as a function of the Earth's orbital motion causing the Sun to move from horizon to horizon over a space of 6 months. I don't care if you don't have the talent to appreciate that any apparent motion of the Sun must be due to the surface rotation of the planet with the planet's surface rotation as a function of its orbital motion as a cause for 6 months of daylight following 6 months of darkness at the North/South poles.

You can't show me the Sun's arc at mid latitudes in circumpolar motion because the Sun's motion is due West from horizon to horizon and what a beautiful arc it is as it is seen in either hemisphere looking towards the Equator where all motions to the Sun are referenced to -

http://scienceblogs.com/startswithab...ice_pivato.jpg


It is not just that a cultist can't reference the daily arcs of the Sun and the seasonal variations in those arcs to the motions and shape of the Earth ,they can't even accept the apparent motion of the Sun and its arc from horizon to horizon.

Those who lack heart will always find things of beauty and simplicity painful to look at and most certainly here in this topic more than anywhere else.. You could all enjoy your circumpolar motion as I do but the difference in the arcs it traces from horizon to horizon and that of our central Sun.

There is nowhere to go for your cult once it sees an apparent arc of the Sun across all latitudes that is not there hence inspirational and intellectual nadir.

On Friday, August 15, 2014 10:43:24 AM UTC-6, Davoud wrote:

Well, that settles it. You have put Oriel straight once and for all
time and it seems unlikely he will post here again, right?

Oriel is perfectly well aware that the Earth rotates. It's the sub-geocentric
celestial sphere cultists who are trying to deny the great achievement of
Copernicus!

So Oriel does not claim the Earth does not rotate. Nor could he possibly be
claiming that as we are carried along with the Earth's rotation, this affects
how we see the stars, but it does not affect how we see the Sun. Or vice versa.

Thus, I am rather mystified as to what he does actually find objectionable in
imputing the stars and the Sun to share a common apparent daily motion, except
for a difference due to the Earth's annual rotation around the Sun.

Except that he no doubt suspects the reasoning as ultimately leading to the
claim that the Earth rotates once in 23 hours, 56 minutes, and 4 seconds
instead of 24 hours. So he will refuse to set foot on the first step of a
journey to our mathematical insanity!

And, of course, since that means he will refuse to pay attention to anything we
say to him, that supports your point.

John Savard