Manned Soyuz Missions from Kourou -- Top problems?

As I recall, the primary challenges for launching a human Soyuz spacecraft
aboard a Soyuz booster from the facilities at Kourou are twofold: downrange
communications and launch abort and recovery. Does anyone recall any
formal discussions of these, or other, issues by Russian space officials?
Thanks!

This is from Arianespace:

http://www.arianespace.com/site/news...re_3_5_04.html

Russia's Soyuz vehicle - the world's most frequently used launcher - is a
well-proven cargo option for servicing of the International Space Station.
It currently is launched from Russia's Baikonur Cosmodrome, where commercial
Soyuz flights are performed through a European/Russian joint venture that
includes Arianespace.

Soyuz will begin operations from the Guiana Space Center in 2006 under
Arianespace responsibility, providing additional mission flexibility and
performance for this proven vehicle. While the current plan for Soyuz in
French Guiana does not include human space flight, this remains a
possibility as the Russian launcher is man-rated and routinely launches
crews to the International Space Station.

"In fact, there is an ongoing ESA study to ensure that the new facilities
[being built at the Guiana Space Center for Soyuz] will be designed such
that human space flight could be added in the future," Berterottière said.
"Upgrading these facilities for human space flight could be an alternative
for filling the gap between shuttle and the activation of the Crew
Exploration Vehicle (CEV) in servicing the ISS. "


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Jacques :-)

www.spacepatches.info

"Jim Oberg" schreef in bericht
...
As I recall, the primary challenges for launching a human Soyuz spacecraft
aboard a Soyuz booster from the facilities at Kourou are twofold:
downrange
communications and launch abort and recovery. Does anyone recall any
formal discussions of these, or other, issues by Russian space officials?
Thanks!

"Jim Oberg" wrote in
:

As I recall, the primary challenges for launching a human Soyuz
spacecraft aboard a Soyuz booster from the facilities at Kourou are
twofold: downrange communications and launch abort and recovery. Does
anyone recall any formal discussions of these, or other, issues by
Russian space officials? Thanks!



Has *any* Soyuz-class capsule been recovered from water? I can't remember
ever hearing about it being tested that way, although I'm sure it has, but
it looks a bit top-heavy to be a comfortable boat (as opposed to Gemini &
Apollo, which seemed fairly stable).

--
Reed

"Reed Snellenberger"
Has *any* Soyuz-class capsule been recovered from water? I can't remember
ever hearing about it being tested that way, although I'm sure it has, but
it looks a bit top-heavy to be a comfortable boat (as opposed to Gemini &
Apollo, which seemed fairly stable).

Yes, one manned mission -- Soyuz-23 in 1974, from memory -- and
several unmanned Soyuzes, plus at least two Zonds in the Indian Ocean.

Soyuzes tend to sink in water pretty quickly. I seem to remember that
the Russian Space Agency ruled out Soyuz launch from Kourou due to
this problem.
I also think that the infrastructure to launch Soyuz capsules out of
Kourou would cost a lot. Perhaps the benefit of being able to launch
the Soyuzes out of a third site isn't worth the additional costs.



"Jim Oberg" wrote in message ...
"Reed Snellenberger"
Has *any* Soyuz-class capsule been recovered from water? I can't remember
ever hearing about it being tested that way, although I'm sure it has, but
it looks a bit top-heavy to be a comfortable boat (as opposed to Gemini &
Apollo, which seemed fairly stable).

Yes, one manned mission -- Soyuz-23 in 1974, from memory -- and
several unmanned Soyuzes, plus at least two Zonds in the Indian Ocean.

http://www.spacetoday.net/Summary/2201

"The high costs of equipping the launch facility with safety features
needed for human spaceflight was one reason for not using Kourou for
human launches. Another reason is that the flight path for Kourou
launches goes over open ocean, which would make crew rescue in the
event of an abort "problematic", according to Koptev. "

(Explorer8939) wrote:

Soyuzes tend to sink in water pretty quickly. I seem to remember that
the Russian Space Agency ruled out Soyuz launch from Kourou due to
this problem.

Cite?

D.
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Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

"Derek Lyons" wrote in message
...
(Explorer8939) wrote:

Soyuzes tend to sink in water pretty quickly. I seem to remember that
the Russian Space Agency ruled out Soyuz launch from Kourou due to
this problem.

Cite?

I'd like to see that as well.

Here's something:

http://www.videocosmos.com/soyuz23.shtm
Water landing on frozen lake Tengiz.
The Cosmonauts were acting according to standard procedure - and did
not jettison the parachute after the landing. BUT - the situation they
were in was not standard (and not foreseen in the landing manual or
training for an all water landing). They landed on a frozen lake and
broke through the ice! The parachute got wet and its weight pulled the
capsule upside down! As a result - not was the only evacuation hatch
under water, but a special valve for connection to the outside a
tmosphere to get breathing air, was now also under water! The valve
was already open which was standard procedure at the altitude of 5
kilometers. When the capsule turned upside down - water started to go
through the valve - the capsule was sinking so the cosmonauts closed
it with something. Sealed in the capsule, half underwater and upside
down, they were now breathing regenerated air. Time was passing, and
the danger of suffocation increased because the regeneration system
was losing its power quickly - as it was not designed for 12 hours
of work.

I wonder what changes to Soyuz have been made due to this incident.

Jeff
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Remove icky phrase from email address to get a valid address.

Jeff Findley wrote:

[...]
The Cosmonauts were acting according to standard procedure - and did
not jettison the parachute after the landing. BUT - the situation they
were in was not standard (and not foreseen in the landing manual or
training for an all water landing). They landed on a frozen lake and
broke through the ice!
[...]

I wonder what changes to Soyuz have been made due to this incident.


Change sheet 14-x to 14-x2, "When the landing is accompanied by the a
'crack' or 'splash' sound, jettison the parachute, and grab the 'vent cork
assortment' bag."

/dps

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Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/

Reed Snellenberger writes:

Has *any* Soyuz-class capsule been recovered from water? I can't remember
ever hearing about it being tested that way, although I'm sure it has, but
it looks a bit top-heavy to be a comfortable boat (as opposed to Gemini &
Apollo, which seemed fairly stable).

AFAIK a water landing is a part of standard crew training. A soyuz will
sink within 40 seconds when the hatch starts to draw water (and this
seems to happen fairly easy), so this is not exactly a safe procedure.

Here is an article and a few photos of Foale on Black Sea training:
http://spaceflight.nasa.gov/history/...e-blacksea.htm


Jochem

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