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Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 3rd 07, 11:35 PM posted to sci.space.history,sc.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archi.../03/26062.aspx
http://public.blueorigin.com/index.html
They've got the busiest insignia you ever laid eyes on Galapagos
tortoises, winged hour glasses, an alchemist's sun, and something
cylindrical I don't understand, but it might be the solar system in a
coffee can.
Rocket looks like a huge Corona film dump capsule crossed with a DC-X
You half expect them to slide it into Verne's moon cannon, but it's
flown successfully, and there's film of the flight on the website.

Pat
  #2  
Old January 4th 07, 12:19 AM posted to sci.space.history,sc.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!



Pat Flannery wrote:

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archi.../03/26062.aspx
http://public.blueorigin.com/index.html
They've got the busiest insignia you ever laid eyes on Galapagos
tortoises, winged hour glasses, an alchemist's sun, and something
cylindrical I don't understand, but it might be the solar system in a
coffee can.
Rocket looks like a huge Corona film dump capsule crossed with a DC-X
You half expect them to slide it into Verne's moon cannon, but it's
flown successfully, and there's film of the flight on the website.



Looking at the film of the flight, the engines appear extremely
clean-burning, with no visible exhaust.
It apparently uses H2O2 and kerosene for propellants....Black Arrow's
Revenge!
What's also interesting is unlike the DC-X, this thing landed on
concrete without frying its tail structure.
It looked pristine at the end of the flight.
If they can get something as simple as a straight-up, straight down
flight profile to work, they have a major advantage over Virgin Galactic
and their two-component aircraft design as far as ease of operations are
concerned.
The very wide base looks suspiciously like heatshield, and as they
stated they are eventually shooting for orbital flight with more
advanced derivatives, maybe this is the first step toward a SSTO
vehicle, or something that will be the second stage of a two-stage
orbital vehicle with a reusable first stage.
Here's the straight poop on the hydrogen peroxide/ kerosene fuel combo:
http://www.astronautix.com/props/h2oosene.htm

Pat


  #3  
Old January 4th 07, 01:20 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Fox2
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Posts: 36
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

In article , wrote:
http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archi.../03/26062.aspx
http://public.blueorigin.com/index.html
They've got the busiest insignia you ever laid eyes on Galapagos
tortoises, winged hour glasses, an alchemist's sun, and something
cylindrical I don't understand, but it might be the solar system in a
coffee can.


Shucks, didn't you know that the sky is being held up by tortoises?
The blue & yellow thingy looks like a graphic of atmospheric levels, or ...
maybe a giant firecracker with the fuse lit?
Is that a dueling epee or a rocket on the right side? And what's with the
giant candy cane across the bottom? (Of course that may be the 'Do Not
Cross' barrier at the edge of the world)

Rocket looks like a huge Corona film dump capsule crossed with a DC-X
You half expect them to slide it into Verne's moon cannon, but it's
flown successfully, and there's film of the flight on the website.


I noticed that the flight videos make it look like there is frost on
the launch area, maybe they are using LOX & alcohol for fuel.

(Mmmm. Smoked salmon & whiskey for fuel.) :?P


Pat


Fox2
  #4  
Old January 4th 07, 02:01 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!



Fox2 wrote:

In article , wrote:


http://public.blueorigin.com/index.html



Go to this address, not the MSNBC one, it may have a virus of some sort
in it, as it screws up Netscape, and makes it crash.
I canceled the messages with that address in them.
According to Wikipedia, they said it was H2O2 and kerosene:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Origin_New_Shepard
They can up the ISP a bit by chilling the H2O2, or maybe the weather was
just cold that morning.

Pat
  #5  
Old January 4th 07, 02:03 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Jonathan Goff
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Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

Fox2,

I noticed that the flight videos make it look like there is frost on
the launch area, maybe they are using LOX & alcohol for fuel.


Nope, I'm pretty sure it's just pure peroxide. Of the three companies
I know doing LOX/Alcohol lately (Armadillo, XCOR, and us here at
Masten Space Systems), none of our plumes have looked anything
like that. But all the guys I know who've done peroxide (John Carmack,
my boss Dave, some of the ERPS guys, etc) say it looks just like a
peroxide engine. Maybe that was steam, not frost?

But overall, pretty darned cool.

~Jon Goff

  #6  
Old January 4th 07, 02:17 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!



Jonathan Goff wrote:

But all the guys I know who've done peroxide (John Carmack,
my boss Dave, some of the ERPS guys, etc) say it looks just like a
peroxide engine. Maybe that was steam, not frost?

But overall, pretty darned cool.


Black Arrow had the same H2O2/RP-1 combo propellents, and its exhaust
was almost invisible:
http://www.astronautix.com/graphics/p/prospero.jpg

Pat
  #7  
Old January 4th 07, 02:38 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Fox2
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Posts: 36
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

In article , wrote:


Fox2 wrote:

In article ,
wrote:


http://public.blueorigin.com/index.html



Go to this address, not the MSNBC one, it may have a virus of some sort
in it, as it screws up Netscape, and makes it crash.
I canceled the messages with that address in them.
According to Wikipedia, they said it was H2O2 and kerosene:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Origin_New_Shepard
They can up the ISP a bit by chilling the H2O2, or maybe the weather was
just cold that morning.

Pat


Yup. I went back and looked at the bleacher pic & everyone is wearing coats.
Must have been the temp.

The vid from the under camera also showed lateral control because they
moved the craft back over the landing circle.

I'm impressed! If the Govt will keep their fingers out of the project,
they just might get this thing into LEO.

Fox2
  #8  
Old January 4th 07, 02:44 AM posted to sci.space.history,sc.space.policy
Henry Spencer
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Posts: 2,170
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

In article ,
Pat Flannery wrote:
Looking at the film of the flight, the engines appear extremely
clean-burning, with no visible exhaust.
It apparently uses H2O2 and kerosene for propellants....Black Arrow's
Revenge!


It's apparently definitely known that this initial demonstrator is using
monopropellant peroxide, in fact. They presumably plan to add fuel
injection into the monopropellant exhaust stream later; that's the simple
and historically-successful way to do a peroxide-based bipropellant system.

What's also interesting is unlike the DC-X, this thing landed on
concrete without frying its tail structure.


No great surprise -- much cooler exhaust. It'll be interesting to see
whether they can do that with a biprop.
--
spsystems.net is temporarily off the air; | Henry Spencer
mail to henry at zoo.utoronto.ca instead. |
  #9  
Old January 4th 07, 02:59 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Damon Hill[_2_]
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Posts: 55
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!

"Jonathan Goff" wrote in news:1167872622.531215.282180@
11g2000cwr.googlegroups.com:

Nope, I'm pretty sure it's just pure peroxide. Of the three companies
I know doing LOX/Alcohol lately (Armadillo, XCOR, and us here at
Masten Space Systems), none of our plumes have looked anything
like that. But all the guys I know who've done peroxide (John Carmack,
my boss Dave, some of the ERPS guys, etc) say it looks just like a
peroxide engine. Maybe that was steam, not frost?


I'm inclined to agree; it's a simple way to test the general
vehicle concept without getting into the cost and expense of
a bipropellant engine. Otherwise they're either running oxidizer
rich or have excellent mixture control and burning; I'd expect
to see some yellow (carbon) in the exhaust otherwise.

But overall, pretty darned cool.


Yes, indeed. Best thing since DC-X. Imagine if that program
had continued to be funded.

--Damon
  #10  
Old January 4th 07, 03:59 AM posted to sci.space.history,sci.space.policy
Pat Flannery
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Posts: 18,465
Default Bezos' Blue Origin revealed!



Fox2 wrote:

The vid from the under camera also showed lateral control because they
moved the craft back over the landing circle.



Yes, the landing looked very precise.
I'd be a little concerned about a hard landing with H2O2 on board, as
Me-163 Komets used to explode if they made too rough of a landing and
any remaining hydrogen peroxide got shaken up.

Pat
 




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