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Thank you, anti-SV folks!



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 15th 03, 11:19 PM
Chuck Taylor
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Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

"Darren Hennig" wrote in message
om...
I would like to publicly thank the very few, very vocal, prolific
anti-SV folks out there in SAA-land and beyond. I am a very happy SV
customer of three years running, and owner of two finely-crafted
achromats. I do a lot of observing with both, and enjoy them very
much.

If it were not for you all, Mr. Maris would have not perhaps improved
on his website appearances, wording and layout, and most importantly,
his telescope designs. Certainly, he may have considered doing so
later on, but your efforts have allowed him to investigate new
opportunities to make his offerings even better for the money, sooner.
Good news for his customers and patrons!

Further, there have been many new SV owners who have commented over
many months that if it were not for all the numerous and intense
exchanges of information here and elsewhere, they would have possibly
never known of Stellarvue at all. With all this free advertising, Mr.
Maris can save a lot on his marketing budget and put it into R&D. Good
news for all of his current and future customers! SV could not do any
better than what you have done for them, in getting the name out
there...

Finally, thank you all for educating us all on what constitutes a good
telescope. I have learned a lot - I am pretty certain others have
also.

Regards,

Darren Hennig, M.Sc.


You are welcome.

Regards,

Chuck Taylor, B.A., M.A., D.V.D., Ph.D., B.V.D, M&M (plain and peanut)


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  #4  
Old August 16th 03, 01:59 PM
David
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Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

It "looks" but is NOT new. You exactly described refurbishing. To the west of Kherson,
such goods is sold at discounted price with a sticker "Refurbished".
Potential buyers, beware.

David

ValeryD wrote:

David wrote in message ...
wrote:

Funny how SV generates such dislike, while companies
like AP, TMB, Aries, Questar don't?
-Rich


Rich,

I dislike Aries' bussines practices because VD sells refurbished
Chromacor as new for full price without disclosure to the buyer.
Vic Maris sells blems on ebay.

David


You simply don't know what is what. If we _exchanged_ the cell,
re-coat the surfaces, assembled and tested it again. It looks absolutely
same as new. No reason to sell them for lower price.

V.D.


  #5  
Old August 16th 03, 07:38 PM
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!



Jon Isaacs wrote:

..

Valery did not describe "refurbishing." Refurbishing means that it is repaired
and resold. What Valery described would be better termed "Remanufactured."


Jon,

maybe you missed the fact that it was an used, faulty, returned unit.

David

  #6  
Old August 16th 03, 11:20 PM
Chris.B
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Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

Godzilla wrote in message ...
I would like to publicly thank the very few, very vocal, prolific
anti-SV folks out there in SAA-land and beyond.


I find this a very strange phenomena.
Generally, if someone does not like a company
or its product, they will simply not buy it.
But instead we have a group of self appointed
crusaders who have nothing better to do than
get online and whine whine whine. Hey - have
some cheese with that whine! No one is holding
a gun to your head forcing you to buy SV
products.


You miss the point entirely "Godzilla" Old Chap. The "crusaders" are
protecting the technically uninformed and those unable to understand
the underlying commercial deceits involved here. IMHO. Open debate is
still 'a tool of the trade' on this NG. Highlighting the "sleight of
hand" of manufacturers is a powerful new tool thanks to the internet &
specialist NG's. The manufacturer is free to join the debate (or
modify his own performance). In previous times only 'word of mouth'
protected the consumer from exploding petrol tanks, bursting tyres and
other "non-optional extras". The ability of a manufacturer to sue a
newspaper or magazine was often threat enough to conceal the truth in
the "good old days" of the past. Be grateful for the freedom now
afforded the consumer to discuss these matters with a large and
technically knowledgable human information base. The "empowerment of
the individual" beloved of politician's doublespeak. Has come to
fruition in ways they would never have allowed given the chance to
stop it in time. By all means contribute to the SV debate. Though a
constructive point would be preferable to denying us all freedom of
speech. There are those enough with that particular motive already.
If the "crusaders" should get it wrong then there are an equal number
of "independent experts" on the group to quickly put matters right. I
would remind you that only a complete idiot would crusade against a
particular manufacturer without reason (& backed up with sound
technical knowledge). Or he would be laughed out of the NG or doomed
to eternal trolldom and ignominy.

Best regards
Chris.B
  #7  
Old August 17th 03, 06:36 AM
Leonard
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

Hello Chris ,

Very well said Chris , thank you. Leonard

You miss the point entirely "Godzilla" Old Chap. The "crusaders" are
protecting the technically uninformed and those unable to understand
the underlying commercial deceits involved here. IMHO. Open debate is
still 'a tool of the trade' on this NG. Highlighting the "sleight of
hand" of manufacturers is a powerful new tool thanks to the internet &
specialist NG's. The manufacturer is free to join the debate (or
modify his own performance). In previous times only 'word of mouth'
protected the consumer from exploding petrol tanks, bursting tyres and
other "non-optional extras". The ability of a manufacturer to sue a
newspaper or magazine was often threat enough to conceal the truth in
the "good old days" of the past. Be grateful for the freedom now
afforded the consumer to discuss these matters with a large and
technically knowledgable human information base. The "empowerment of
the individual" beloved of politician's doublespeak. Has come to
fruition in ways they would never have allowed given the chance to
stop it in time. By all means contribute to the SV debate. Though a
constructive point would be preferable to denying us all freedom of
speech. There are those enough with that particular motive already.
If the "crusaders" should get it wrong then there are an equal number
of "independent experts" on the group to quickly put matters right. I
would remind you that only a complete idiot would crusade against a
particular manufacturer without reason (& backed up with sound
technical knowledge). Or he would be laughed out of the NG or doomed
to eternal trolldom and ignominy.

Best regards
Chris.B

  #9  
Old August 17th 03, 12:46 PM
Brian A
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

wrote in message
...
On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 07:59:24 -0500, David
wrote:

It "looks" but is NOT new. You exactly described refurbishing. To the

west of Kherson,
such goods is sold at discounted price with a sticker "Refurbished".
Potential buyers, beware.

David

ValeryD wrote:

David wrote in message

...
wrote:

Funny how SV generates such dislike, while companies
like AP, TMB, Aries, Questar don't?
-Rich

Rich,

I dislike Aries' bussines practices because VD sells refurbished
Chromacor as new for full price without disclosure to the buyer.
Vic Maris sells blems on ebay.

David

You simply don't know what is what. If we _exchanged_ the cell,
re-coat the surfaces, assembled and tested it again. It looks

absolutely
same as new. No reason to sell them for lower price.

V.D.


We aren't taking about car with a rolled back odometer. I hate to
break it to you, but if some company gets back a product
that has zero flaws, or has an element that when replaced renders the
whole new, then why should they have to sell it as used? Eyepieces
and related items do not "wear out" and if they are worn, it is
clearly visible to any buyer.
-Rich


I beleive this refers to federal law but I'm not certain:


3. Reconditioned, Rebuilt, or Refurbished Goods
As with previously used goods, the reconditioned, rebuilt, or refurbished
nature of the goods must be disclosed prior to any sale. A related issue
arises with new products that contain a part or parts that have been
reconditioned or otherwise previously used. Even if the smallest component
has been refurbished, and the product is inspected to insure that it meets
original factory specifications, you are required to disclose the presence
of the restored component. For example, in a recent case, a computer was
manufacturer was sued for selling computers that contained a reconditioned
computer chip. As should be readily apparent, establishing and maintaining
an inventory control system that tracks and reflects the disposition of
product orders and returned merchandise is essential to avoid violating the
law. This system will enable you to ensure that products are sent to
customers in a timely manner and that returned merchandise is not
automatically restored to inventory without a proper inspection and, where
appropriate, a new label. Aside from complying with the law, you will better
insure that customers are not disappointed with the quality of your product
and that your good reputation remains intact.


It's my understanding that to sell anything that has required even the
slightest repair as new, is illegal in the US.

Brian A


  #10  
Old August 17th 03, 06:29 PM
Darren Hennig
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Thank you, anti-SV folks!

So Jon:

Big picture? So it is okay for Valery to sell a Chromacorr as new at a new
price, even though it has been reconditioned, which it has, by the addition
of new parts and possible adjustment/replacement of others. This IS
reconditioning. Even a radio, with a new RF mixer board, with
otherwise-original parts, is sold as refurbished. There is NO difference,
period.

Just because the Chromacorr works for owners of the scope you described does
not alter this fact. This is JUST like you folks bantering SV for certain
"issues" as you see them, even though they may or may not even be current or
valid.

Sol Robbin's success with his 6" scope and his Chromacorr II is a testament
to Valery's wonderful concept and design ability. No one necessarily feels
that Val does not know what he's doing. It's just the WAY he does it -
trolling, bending the truth to serve his needs, and the blatant, assenine
treatment of those who do not agree with him. It seems okay for a fellow
like Val to do what he wants, because you think he's wonderful and justified
at whatever he does. Sound's like the beginnings of an "Aries Camp" to me!

While you are looking up "re-furbished" in your dictionary, try also
"hypocrite" - that goes for the rest of your cynnical, trolling friends,
too.

D.



 




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