"NASA Watch" gets really ****ed off.

On May 17, 12:01 am, Dale Carlson wrote:
On Fri, 16 May 2008 17:22:53 -0700 (PDT), kT
wrote:



On May 16, 7:18 pm, "Jorge R. Frank" wrote:
wrote:
On May 16, 12:34 am, Pat Flannery wrote:

Which brings up a interesting question... when the ISS is decommissioned, what exactly happens to it?
Does it do a Mir-style dive into the South Pacific?
That would be some fireworks show.
When the time comes, I suppose the competent authorities of the day
could consider taking ISS apart module by module, launch a deorbit
package for each. But dumping the whole thing at one time seems
easier.

And cheaper, and more likely to work. If the authorities of the day
choose the former, then by definition they aren't competent.

If the authorities of the day choose to deorbit it at all, by
definition they aren't competent.

What would you suggest- boosting it up to orbit forever, while being
inaccessible in any practical sense?

It's already in orbit. It has to be boosted only so that it remains in
orbit, a mere fraction of it's orbital velocity, depending on its
drag. It took hundreds of billions of dollars to design, build, launch
and construct, including shuttle and Soyuz development and operational
costs. Keeping it in orbit only requires only a small fraction of
those costs.

But this is the new America, where retiring the SSMEs is thought to be
a good thing, and we're new replacing our space shuttles with an idiot
rocket design (Ares I - the Stick), while we have two other
functioning rockets sitting on the launch pads, ready to go, bought
and paid for. We're not talking about the brightest bulbs on the
planet anymore.

My understanding is that the plan is to scrap it in India, at a
dockyard with few environmental or workplace safety standards

Your understanding is very weak, let's call it non-existent for
brevity.

What is the ISS useful for?

Nothing.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.

On May 17, 2:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:

What is the ISS useful for?

Existing.

Nothing.

On the contrary, it exists.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

That may be true, but it exists, nevertheless.

Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.

You can't fail unless you try.

On May 17, 12:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:
What is the ISS useful for?

Nothing.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.

As opposed to our having a robust Moon L1 platform/outpost of mostly
robotic instruments, or that of a cool POOF City at Venus L2 would be
absolutely terrific.
.. - Brad Guth

On May 17, 2:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:

What is the ISS useful for?


"kT" wrote
Existing.

Why pretend to be doing something other than keeping the AmeriKKKan
failure in orbit?


Nothing.


"kT" wrote
On the contrary, it exists.

Your claimed use is simple existance?

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.


Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote
That may be true, but it exists, nevertheless.

Other than existing what initial mission goals has it accomplished?


Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.


"kT" wrote
You can't fail unless you try.

The AmeriKKKan pattern is clear. Lofty rhetoric and goals, followed by a
pattern of repeated budget cuts and a continuing redefinition of mission
goals along with re-engineering to match the funding, until the program is
essentially a worthless boondoggle. At which point funding dries up and the
program is dropped like a hot potato.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"BradGuth" wrote
As opposed to our having a robust Moon L1 platform/outpost of mostly
robotic instruments

Doing what? the Space Interferrometry Mission is cancelled due to lack of
Funding.

On May 18, 12:55 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:
On May 17, 2:01 am, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:

What is the ISS useful for?

"kT" wrote

Existing.

Why pretend to be doing something other than keeping the AmeriKKKan
failure in orbit?

Nothing.

"kT" wrote

On the contrary, it exists.

Your claimed use is simple existance?

Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.

It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,
but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

In particular, America, of course.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

"kT" wrote

That may be true, but it exists, nevertheless.

Other than existing what initial mission goals has it accomplished?

Another Failure of AmeriKKKa in space.

"kT" wrote

You can't fail unless you try.

The AmeriKKKan pattern is clear. Lofty rhetoric and goals, followed by a
pattern of repeated budget cuts and a continuing redefinition of mission
goals along with re-engineering to match the funding, until the program is
essentially a worthless boondoggle. At which point funding dries up and the
program is dropped like a hot potato.

Thus, the salvage operations.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

Your claimed use is simple existance?


"kT" wrote
Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

So far it's primary use has been to suck funding from robotic planetary
exploration.

It's an expensive rock.


According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.


"kT" wrote
It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,

Now it's mission is strictly to exist apparently.


"kT" wrote
but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

Just think of what it could do for Afghan opium production.


Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote
I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

It can be salvaged of course, and can still do useful work. All that
needs be done is to get AmeriKKKa out of the picutre.


This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

"kT" wrote
It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

I blame AmeriKKKan RepubliKKKans for the perpetual stream of U.S. white
elephants in manned space flight.


The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"kT" wrote
I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

I see little value in manned space flight to these orbiting piles of
rubble.


"kT" wrote
By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

Put the Japanese in charge of design and the Russians in charge of
implementation.

Sell NASA to China. AmeriKKKa could use the cash.

On May 18, 10:10 pm, "V-for-Vendicar"
wrote:
Your claimed use is simple existance?

"kT" wrote

Yes, obviously it's existence is crucial to its usefulness.

So far it's primary use has been to suck funding from robotic planetary
exploration.

It's an expensive rock.

I agree entirely, it's a poor design, and I was opposed to building it
at all in that form, and I indeed predicted after Challenger it would
never be built. But they went ahead and built it, and now we're stuck
with it, so with a little creativity it should be much cheaper to
maintain now that it is built. What I am advocating is creativity in
the launch and life support markets, something thus far Americans are
unwilling to do.

According to it's own mission goals, it's a complete failure.

"kT" wrote

It's mission goals are completely wrong and now obsolete, of course,

Now it's mission is strictly to exist apparently.

"kT" wrote

but they could be changed by simple decree. It needs to be an
international space station for life sciences research, closed
ecological life support systems, in other words, astronaut tourists
from hostile nations growing plants. Psychotropic plants, preferably.
That would get hostile nations working together and respecting one
another quickly.

Just think of what it could do for Afghan opium production.

Incomptent AmeriKKKan design, Incompetent AmeriKKKan implementation,
Incompetent AmeriKKKan management.

"kT" wrote

I never claimed otherwise, I'm talking about a salvage operation.

It can be salvaged of course, and can still do useful work. All that
needs be done is to get AmeriKKKa out of the picutre.

I agree entirely, but I would prefer America to become more rational.

This is not trying... It's the sloven history of a sloven nation.

Apollo was trying.

"kT" wrote

It's history. I am truly outrages they are trying to repeat it.
Salvaging the ISS is one method of discouraging further madness in
this direction, and discouraging further madness in launch vehicle
design.

I blame AmeriKKKan RepubliKKKans for the perpetual stream of U.S. white
elephants in manned space flight.

So do I, but there is no time like the present to change that.

The only way an AmeriKKKan will get to Mars is on a IndoEuropean mars
shuttle.

"kT" wrote

I don't want to go to Mars, I want to go to the space station, and use
that as a testbed for long duration spacecraft to go the Phobos,
Deimos, the Asteroids, and that remarkable fifth planet Ceres.

I see little value in manned space flight to these orbiting piles of
rubble.

Except to keep the mammals from fighting among themselves by giving
them something to do. Manned space flight to rubble piles is decades
off, but if we are able to salvage the space station, then we'll have
the skills to try and attempt something else. If we don't fight the
rubble piles over there, they'll come over here ... and ... oh ...
forget it.

"kT" wrote

By doing this we might just have a chance to salvage something from
the Earth. If we can't salvage the space station, we'll never be able
to salvage this planet. Get it? I doubt it.

Put the Japanese in charge of design and the Russians in charge of
implementation.

I agree, but the bottom line is, we need to start flying astronauts to
the ISS from hostile nations. That's the only way this is going to
work.

Sell NASA to China. AmeriKKKa could use the cash.

NASA is a problem, but that's an entirely different salvage operation.

It's an expensive rock.


"kT" wrote
I agree entirely, it's a poor design, and I was opposed to building it
at all in that form, and I indeed predicted after Challenger it would
never be built. But they went ahead and built it, and now we're stuck
with it, so with a little creativity it should be much cheaper to
maintain now that it is built. What I am advocating is creativity in
the launch and life support markets, something thus far Americans are
unwilling to do.

Creativity apparently means going back to Apollo.


It can be salvaged of course, and can still do useful work. All that
needs be done is to get AmeriKKKa out of the picutre.


"kT" wrote
I agree entirely, but I would prefer America to become more rational.

That only has the potential of being realized several decades after the
Collapse of the AmeriKKKan state.

The U.S. population is still too deeply disconnected from the reality of
thier ongoing rapid decline.



I blame AmeriKKKan RepubliKKKans for the perpetual stream of U.S. white
elephants in manned space flight.


"kT" wrote
So do I, but there is no time like the present to change that.

Not possible. There is way too much KKKonservative poison flowing through
AmeriKKKa.


I see little value in manned space flight to these orbiting piles of
rubble.

"kT" wrote
Except to keep the mammals from fighting among themselves by giving
them something to do.

Appolo didn't stop Vietnam.



Sell NASA to China. AmeriKKKa could use the cash.


"kT" wrote
NASA is a problem, but that's an entirely different salvage operation.

I don't see how NASA is a problem. Mission constraints are set by the
budget, it's charter, and congressional mandate.