Transporting liquids and gases across the moon

There are reasons why it's advantageous to have a main lunar base at
low latitude, and a water mining base at the poles.

But how could cargo be transported bewteen the two. Would one option
to be use pipes? A pipe laid a few thousand kilometres along the moons
surface might weigh a thousand tons, but could continually tranport
water, at least during the lunar day.

During the lunar night, first hydrogen, and then oxygen, could be
piped back to the pole, where they would be combined to produce
electricity.

Is this feasible? Or does pumping water require too much energy. Is
the moons topogrpahy to varied - the pipe would need to be on almost
level ground.

Are there easier ways of transporting goods across the moons surface?

In article ,
says...
There are reasons why it's advantageous to have a main lunar base at
low latitude, and a water mining base at the poles.

But how could cargo be transported bewteen the two. Would one option
to be use pipes? A pipe laid a few thousand kilometres along the moons
surface might weigh a thousand tons,

Obviously it depends on how wide and thick the pipe is, as well as the
material. One inch diameter, tenth inch thick wall steel pipe weighs
about 1 pound per foot, so that may roughly be a metric ton per
kilometer. I'd imagine that plastic tubing might weigh substantially
less. For water transport one might make due with non-metallic pipes in
any event.


but could continually tranport
water, at least during the lunar day.

During the lunar night, first hydrogen, and then oxygen,

Both hydrogen and oxygen can be highly corrosive and would need specially
coated and designed pipelines.


could be
piped back to the pole, where they would be combined to produce
electricity.

Is this feasible? Or does pumping water require too much energy. Is
the moons topogrpahy to varied - the pipe would need to be on almost
level ground.

Are there easier ways of transporting goods across the moons surface?

How's 'bout a small caravan of tanker trucks that followed a smooth
graded, gravel covered road. If you staged about 5 to 10 of these at
regular intervals each truck could unhitch its cargo tank and hand it off
to the next one.



--
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"Alex Terrell" wrote in message
om...
There are reasons why it's advantageous to have a main lunar base at
low latitude, and a water mining base at the poles.

But how could cargo be transported bewteen the two. Would one option
to be use pipes? A pipe laid a few thousand kilometres along the moons
surface might weigh a thousand tons, but could continually tranport
water, at least during the lunar day.

During the lunar night, first hydrogen, and then oxygen, could be
piped back to the pole, where they would be combined to produce
electricity.

Is this feasible? Or does pumping water require too much energy. Is
the moons topogrpahy to varied - the pipe would need to be on almost
level ground.


If you can identify and mark a ground route between your polar water mine
and your equatorial base, just truck it in solid form.

Have several bare chassis four-wheel trailers delivered to your polar base,
along with a teleoperated tractor (powered by something.) Melt the water,
cast it into a block of ice incorporating the trailer. Wrap each block in a
kapton insulating blanket (if traveling by lunar day), hitch up your wagons
and head for the equator.

Jonathan Wilson

(Alex Terrell) wrote in message . com...

Are there easier ways of transporting goods across the moons surface?

For small quantities, what about teleoperated/robotic trucks? Find a
safe route, then have the trucks trundle back and forth between mine
and base.

Mike Miller, MatE

"Alex Terrell" wrote in message
om...
There are reasons why it's advantageous to have a main lunar base at
low latitude, and a water mining base at the poles.

But how could cargo be transported bewteen the two.

I wrote a short SF story where I had a mass-driver and an "anti-mass-driver"
tossing filled and empty buckets of ice back and forth between a polar mine
and an equatorial station.

http://members.aol.com/howiecombs/tnbttbt.htm

The advantage of such a system would be the lack of need for infrastructure
between the two points.

A few years later, someone at the Space Studies Institute was discussing
just such an "anti-mass-driver".

--


Regards,
Mike Combs
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We should ask, critically and with appeal to the numbers, whether the
best site for a growing advancing industrial society is Earth, the
Moon, Mars, some other planet, or somewhere else entirely.
Surprisingly, the answer will be inescapable - the best site is
"somewhere else entirely."

Gerard O'Neill - "The High Frontier"

(Mike Miller) wrote in message
For small quantities, what about teleoperated/robotic trucks? Find a
safe route, then have the trucks trundle back and forth between mine
and base.

This is currently done in large open cast bauxite (Al ore) mines.
Large trucks (ie 200+Tons ) drive roboticaly about 20-90 miles. At the
mine its remotly operated.

but first thing is first. We don't know if we need to cart anything
anywhere on the moon yet.

Greg

Greg wrote:

(Mike Miller) wrote in message
For small quantities, what about teleoperated/robotic trucks? Find a
safe route, then have the trucks trundle back and forth between mine
and base.

This is currently done in large open cast bauxite (Al ore) mines.
Large trucks (ie 200+Tons ) drive roboticaly about 20-90 miles. At the
mine its remotly operated.

but first thing is first. We don't know if we need to cart anything
anywhere on the moon yet.

Greg


And if we really need to move that much, that frequently over the
same route, some sort of rails would seem to be in order....


--

You know what to remove, to reply....

"Mike Combs" wrote in message ...
"Alex Terrell" wrote in message
om...
There are reasons why it's advantageous to have a main lunar base at
low latitude, and a water mining base at the poles.

But how could cargo be transported bewteen the two.

I wrote a short SF story where I had a mass-driver and an "anti-mass-driver"
tossing filled and empty buckets of ice back and forth between a polar mine
and an equatorial station.

An excellent story it is. I also pointed out a few months ago that you
could actually use this system to transfer energy.

However, I'm a little worried about the accuracy requirement. If a
cargo hits the side of an L1 catcher, it explodes at about 20m/s,
doing little damage. But these ones will come in at about a km/s. I
wouldn't like to underwrite the receiving infrastructure.

http://members.aol.com/howiecombs/tnbttbt.htm

The advantage of such a system would be the lack of need for infrastructure
between the two points.

A few years later, someone at the Space Studies Institute was discussing
just such an "anti-mass-driver".

--


Regards,
Mike Combs
----------------------------------------------------------------------
We should ask, critically and with appeal to the numbers, whether the
best site for a growing advancing industrial society is Earth, the
Moon, Mars, some other planet, or somewhere else entirely.
Surprisingly, the answer will be inescapable - the best site is
"somewhere else entirely."

Gerard O'Neill - "The High Frontier"

(Alex Terrell) wrote in message . com...
Are there easier ways of transporting goods across the moons surface?

How about a sort of four legged kangaroo transport truck, that jump up
and down on the moon surface?

A can imagine now, a truck with four pogo sticks. Perharps also with a
little bit assistances with retro rockets.

Jumping up and down has been a proved method on traveling on the moon.
LOL!

I don't know about buggying though. While I do believe Apollo 11
landed on the moon, I don't know if Apollo 14 really landed though.



As for piping.

Well... If the distance is short enough, is worth it. But if it's a
long distance, it's better to just transport it using containers.

Imagine oil tankers on earth, there are reasons on why it was
delivered by oil tankers and not by pipe.

Besides, piping require the transported goods in 'liquid' form.

(EAC) wrote in message om...

As for piping.

Well... If the distance is short enough, is worth it. But if it's a
long distance, it's better to just transport it using containers.

Imagine oil tankers on earth, there are reasons on why it was
delivered by oil tankers and not by pipe.

And there are reasons why it was transported to the harbour by pipe,
and not by train or truck.

Besides, piping require the transported goods in 'liquid' form.

Or gas

Pipe advantages:
Low marginal cost
Continuous flow

Pipe disadvantages:
Can't carry a variety of goods
Fixed infrastructure