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Climate change will change thing, not for the better



 
 
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  #51  
Old May 5th 14, 07:52 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Mon, 5 May 2014 11:42:44 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

And where will the govt get the money to pay for all of these new cars?


Where any government gets its revenue: taxes.


Then would it not make more sense to let each individual taxpayer decide for himself whether or not to buy a new car every year?


Almost certainly. But that doesn't change the fact that a society has
to be allowed to make these kinds of decisions. I'm not advocating for
a government supplied car in every garage, only for the right of
voters to make that choice.

I'm a fiscal conservative.


No, you are not.


I am.

Realistically, it would probably be a foolish decision for a society
to decide everybody should receive a car.


So let's not tax people to pay for that!


I didn't suggest we should.

But voters can and do make
foolish decisions, and I wouldn't care much for any system that
prevented them from doing so.


However, you said:

"I believe it is the job of any government to provide what the people ask it to provide."

So should the govt provide new cars to everyone every year if that's what "the people" (or it is "voters" now) decide?


Yes. I would not choose to live in a totalitarian regime that limited
what sort of society people could choose.
  #52  
Old May 5th 14, 08:10 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

peterson wrote:

Realistically, it would probably be a foolish decision for a society
to decide everybody should receive a car.


wsnell01 wrote:

So let's not tax people to pay for that!


peterson wrote:

I didn't suggest we should.


You did.

You said:

"I believe it is the job of any government to provide what the people ask it to provide."

Then when asked where the govt would get the money to provide new cars for all each year you said:

"Where any government gets its revenue: taxes."
  #53  
Old May 5th 14, 08:13 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

peterson had written:wrote:

"I believe it is the job of any government to provide what the people ask it to provide."

wsnell01 wrote:

So should the govt provide new cars to everyone every year if that's what "the people" (or it is "voters" now) decide?


peterson wrote:

Yes. I would not choose to live in a totalitarian regime that limited
what sort of society people could choose.


And if the "sort of society" people chose was a totalitarian regime, then what would you choose to do?
  #55  
Old May 5th 14, 08:13 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Chris L Peterson
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Mon, 5 May 2014 11:47:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

You didn't answer the questions... maybe you answered some other question, that wasn't asked.


Asked and answered.
  #56  
Old May 5th 14, 08:20 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Monday, May 5, 2014 2:52:14 PM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Mon, 5 May 2014 11:42:44 -0700 (PDT), wsnell01 wrote:


And where will the govt get the money to pay for all of these new cars?


Where any government gets its revenue: taxes.


Then would it not make more sense to let each individual taxpayer decide for himself whether or not to buy a new car every year?


Almost certainly.


Then if it makes sense for the individual taxpayer to decide whether or not to buy himself a new car each year, why would it not make sense for the individual taxpayer to decide how much and what kind of health insurance to buy from a private insurer, free of government interference and taxation?
  #57  
Old May 5th 14, 08:22 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Monday, May 5, 2014 3:13:53 PM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Mon, 5 May 2014 11:47:03 -0700 (PDT), wsnell01 wrote:


You didn't answer the questions... maybe you answered some other question, that wasn't asked.


Asked and answered.


You never answered this:

What meaning of "consensus" are you using here?

  #58  
Old May 5th 14, 08:25 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Monday, May 5, 2014 3:13:25 PM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Mon, 5 May 2014 12:10:30 -0700 (PDT), wsnell01 wrote:


peterson wrote:


Realistically, it would probably be a foolish decision for a society
to decide everybody should receive a car.


wsnell01 wrote:


So let's not tax people to pay for that!


peterson wrote:


I didn't suggest we should.


You did.


You said:


"I believe it is the job of any government to provide what the people ask it to provide."


Then when asked where the govt would get the money to provide new cars for all each year you said:


"Where any government gets its revenue: taxes."


Holy cow, you are stupid!


peterson, you painted yourself into a corner, and you're calling someone else stupid???!!! You should be ashamed.


  #59  
Old May 5th 14, 08:47 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Quadibloc
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Monday, May 5, 2014 8:17:45 AM UTC-6, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Mon, 5 May 2014 05:16:44 -0700 (PDT), wrote:


You are calling for mob rule, pure and simple.


No, I'm calling for a government that reflects the consensus view of
its citizens. That is quite different from mob rule.


Any government that allows the rabble to vote to tax the rich and give the money to the poor is clearly mob rule! How can you possibly not see that?

John Savard
  #60  
Old May 5th 14, 08:51 PM posted to sci.astro.amateur
Quadibloc
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Default Climate change will change thing, not for the better

On Monday, May 5, 2014 10:00:07 AM UTC-6, Chris L Peterson wrote:

But voters can and do make
foolish decisions, and I wouldn't care much for any system that
prevented them from doing so.


It depends on what kind of decision you're talking about. A system that prevented voters from bringing in laws that discriminated against minority groups seems sensible. One would just have to write equality into the Constitution, and then have something called a "Supreme Court" that can invalidate legislation which is in violation of the authority granted to the branch of government involved by the Constitution.

Having a Constitution that bans taxing the rich for social welfare purposes, allowing taxes only for national defense, and things that benefit everyone but no-one in particular, like lighthouses... is not an impossibility. FDR had some trouble getting his legislative program through the Supreme Court for just that reason.

But most people don't think the United States descended into mob rule in 1934, notwithstanding.

John Savard
 




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