Are we sure that black holes contain singularities?

On Aug 4, 1:49 pm, "
wrote:
On 4 Sie, 11:45, " wrote:

... not just highly compressed matter still occupying some significant
volume due to rotation and Pauli exclusion principle?

Sorry for this question. I should have read wikipedia first.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolman-...-Volkoff_limit


I don't know how rotation and Pauli exclusion principle should
be taken into account in this case, but I think that those
quarks are those which prevent the full collapse.

Those quarks are PIECES of "neutrino star" (="8/8-diamond")
as I have many times tried to explain in these sci-groups when
I have recalled again about those old H-M's drawings
and my old writings about them.

Hannu

Copy of your above mentioned wikipedia article:

" [From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff (TOV) limit is an upper bound to the
mass of stars composed of neutron-degenerate matter (neutron stars).
It is analogous to the Chandrasekhar limit for white dwarf stars.
The limit was computed by Julius Robert Oppenheimer and George Michael
Volkoff in 1939, using work of Richard Chace Tolman. Oppenheimer and
Volkoff assumed that the neutrons in a neutron star formed a cold,
degenerate Fermi gas. This leads to a limiting mass of approximately
0.7 solar masses.[1],[2] Modern estimates range from approximately 1.5
to 3.0 solar masses.[3] The uncertainty in the value reflects the fact
that the equations of state for extremely dense matter are not well-
known.
In an neutron star lighter than the limit, the weight of the star is
supported by short-range repulsive neutron-neutron interactions
mediated by the strong force and also the quantum degeneracy pressure
of neutrons. If a neutron star is heavier than the limit, it will
collapse to some denser form. It could form a black hole, or change
composition and be supported in some other way (for example, by quark
degeneracy pressure if it becomes a quark star).
Because the properties of hypothetical more exotic forms of degenerate
matter are even more poorly known than those of neutron-degenerate
matter, most astrophysicists assume, in the absence of evidence to the
contrary, that a neutron star above the limit collapses directly into
a black hole.
Black holes formed by the collapse of individual stars have masses
ranging from 1.5-3.0 (TOV limit) to 10 solar masses.
References
1. ^ Static Solutions of Einstein's Field Equations for Spheres of
Fluid, Richard C. Tolman, Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15,
1939), pp. 364-373.
2. ^ On Massive Neutron Cores, J. R. Oppenheimer and G. M. Volkoff,
Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15, 1939), pp. 374-381.
3. ^ Bombaci, I. (1996). "The maximum mass of a neutron star".
Astronomy and Astrophysics 305: 871-877.
See also
· Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff equation ]"

On Aug 4, 10:19 pm, Hannu Poropudas wrote:
On Aug 4, 1:49 pm, "
wrote:

On 4 Sie, 11:45, " wrote:

... not just highly compressed matter still occupying some significant
volume due to rotation and Pauli exclusion principle?

Sorry for this question. I should have read wikipedia first.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolman-...-Volkoff_limit

I don't know how rotation and Pauli exclusion principle should
be taken into account in this case, but I think that those
quarks are those which prevent the full collapse.

Those quarks are PIECES of "neutrino star" (="8/8-diamond")
as I have many times tried to explain in these sci-groups when
I have recalled again about those old H-M's drawings
and my old writings about them.

Hannu


If those quarks have also that "color electricity flame" around
them as "neutrino star" has then I would expect that huge
explosion would happen.

If quarks do not have that "color electricity flame" around
them then I would expect that "neutrino star" forms.

This is a matter which I don't know at the moment how it is
but I suspect that the first case would be right.

Hannu

Copy of your above mentioned wikipedia article:

" [From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff (TOV) limit is an upper bound to the
mass of stars composed of neutron-degenerate matter (neutron stars).
It is analogous to the Chandrasekhar limit for white dwarf stars.
The limit was computed by Julius Robert Oppenheimer and George Michael
Volkoff in 1939, using work of Richard Chace Tolman. Oppenheimer and
Volkoff assumed that the neutrons in a neutron star formed a cold,
degenerate Fermi gas. This leads to a limiting mass of approximately
0.7 solar masses.[1],[2] Modern estimates range from approximately 1.5
to 3.0 solar masses.[3] The uncertainty in the value reflects the fact
that the equations of state for extremely dense matter are not well-
known.
In an neutron star lighter than the limit, the weight of the star is
supported by short-range repulsive neutron-neutron interactions
mediated by the strong force and also the quantum degeneracy pressure
of neutrons. If a neutron star is heavier than the limit, it will
collapse to some denser form. It could form a black hole, or change
composition and be supported in some other way (for example, by quark
degeneracy pressure if it becomes a quark star).
Because the properties of hypothetical more exotic forms of degenerate
matter are even more poorly known than those of neutron-degenerate
matter, most astrophysicists assume, in the absence of evidence to the
contrary, that a neutron star above the limit collapses directly into
a black hole.
Black holes formed by the collapse of individual stars have masses
ranging from 1.5-3.0 (TOV limit) to 10 solar masses.
References
1. ^ Static Solutions of Einstein's Field Equations for Spheres of
Fluid, Richard C. Tolman, Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15,
1939), pp. 364-373.
2. ^ On Massive Neutron Cores, J. R. Oppenheimer and G. M. Volkoff,
Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15, 1939), pp. 374-381.
3. ^ Bombaci, I. (1996). "The maximum mass of a neutron star".
Astronomy and Astrophysics 305: 871-877.
See also
· Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff equation ]"

On Aug 5, 5:40 pm, mathematician wrote:
On Aug 4, 10:19 pm, Hannu Poropudas wrote:



On Aug 4, 1:49 pm, "
wrote:

On 4 Sie, 11:45, " wrote:

... not just highly compressed matter still occupying some significant
volume due to rotation and Pauli exclusion principle?

Sorry for this question. I should have read wikipedia first.http://en..wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolman...-Volkoff_limit

I don't know how rotation and Pauli exclusion principle should
be taken into account in this case, but I think that those
quarks are those which prevent the full collapse.

Those quarks are PIECES of "neutrino star" (="8/8-diamond")
as I have many times tried to explain in these sci-groups when
I have recalled again about those old H-M's drawings
and my old writings about them.

Hannu

If those quarks have also that "color electricity flame" around
them as "neutrino star" has then I would expect that huge
explosion would happen.

If quarks do not have that "color electricity flame" around
them then I would expect that "neutrino star" forms.


Oh no, it cannot be "neutrino star" in this case
due "neutrino star" is formed from one "radiation periphery".

I remember that in those old H-M's drawings
no "color electricity flame" was drawn around those quarks.
Quarks were drawn two ways: first was those 8-sided regular
polygons ("color electricity" colored and those two types of
"color electricity" scratches in two of them) and
second way was such that quarks have "light periphery" and
"color electricity spot" in center of that
(This last was in drawing of structure of proton and neutron,
I think that quark resembled "black-hole" in this last way).

I must admit that I don't really know what happens here,
but I know that those quarks have born in so extreme
conditions if I recall my old writings about H-M's old
drawings that in this case they cannot, I think, be compressed
to zero dimensions.

Sorry about my confusions. Try to figure out this from those
old H-M's drawings and my remarks on them due they are reliable.

Hannu

This is a matter which I don't know at the moment how it is
but I suspect that the first case would be right.

Hannu

Copy of your above mentioned wikipedia article:

" [From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff (TOV) limit is an upper bound to the
mass of stars composed of neutron-degenerate matter (neutron stars).
It is analogous to the Chandrasekhar limit for white dwarf stars.
The limit was computed by Julius Robert Oppenheimer and George Michael
Volkoff in 1939, using work of Richard Chace Tolman. Oppenheimer and
Volkoff assumed that the neutrons in a neutron star formed a cold,
degenerate Fermi gas. This leads to a limiting mass of approximately
0.7 solar masses.[1],[2] Modern estimates range from approximately 1.5
to 3.0 solar masses.[3] The uncertainty in the value reflects the fact
that the equations of state for extremely dense matter are not well-
known.
In an neutron star lighter than the limit, the weight of the star is
supported by short-range repulsive neutron-neutron interactions
mediated by the strong force and also the quantum degeneracy pressure
of neutrons. If a neutron star is heavier than the limit, it will
collapse to some denser form. It could form a black hole, or change
composition and be supported in some other way (for example, by quark
degeneracy pressure if it becomes a quark star).
Because the properties of hypothetical more exotic forms of degenerate
matter are even more poorly known than those of neutron-degenerate
matter, most astrophysicists assume, in the absence of evidence to the
contrary, that a neutron star above the limit collapses directly into
a black hole.
Black holes formed by the collapse of individual stars have masses
ranging from 1.5-3.0 (TOV limit) to 10 solar masses.
References
1. ^ Static Solutions of Einstein's Field Equations for Spheres of
Fluid, Richard C. Tolman, Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15,
1939), pp. 364-373.
2. ^ On Massive Neutron Cores, J. R. Oppenheimer and G. M. Volkoff,
Physical Review 55, #374 (February 15, 1939), pp. 374-381.
3. ^ Bombaci, I. (1996). "The maximum mass of a neutron star".
Astronomy and Astrophysics 305: 871-877.
See also
· Tolman-Oppenheimer-Volkoff equation ]"