Ayn Rand's Utopia

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 3:18:35 PM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2015 11:05:29 -0700 (PDT), wsnell01 wrote:

Currently, small businesses have no "burden" to provide health care benefits and large businesses shouldn't have such burdens either.

Indeed, no business should even be allowed to provide health care
benefits. Or more accurately, every benefit provided by an employer
should be taxed as income.

Income (and benefits) should NOT be taxed. It is an inherently unfair tax, criminal in fact.

The worker who has to work more hours to get the same amount of pay as another is having his TIME stolen from him, for example.

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 3:42:41 PM UTC-4, Uncarollo2 wrote:
On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 2:18:35 PM UTC-5, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2015 11:05:29 -0700 (PDT), wsnell01 wrote:

Currently, small businesses have no "burden" to provide health care benefits and large businesses shouldn't have such burdens either.

Indeed, no business should even be allowed to provide health care
benefits. Or more accurately, every benefit provided by an employer
should be taxed as income.

Having a healthy citizenry is a benefit to all of us, having the person next to you on the Metro not suffering from TB is in your interest,
having a server not ill works for me, having school children benefit from accessible health care is of benefit to your children and the teachers. Civilization just works better with healthy citizens. Why does anyone have such a hard time understanding this ?

Those are matters of public health, not health insurance.

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 4:01:50 PM UTC-4, Uncarollo2 wrote:
On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 12:54:26 PM UTC-5, wsne... wrote:
On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 1:36:47 PM UTC-4, Quadibloc wrote:

The left (properly) cares about the median person, not the average person.

Conservatives do so as well. Do not arrogate the virtue of compassion for yourself, leftie. Some of you actually fall quite short in regard to compassion.

Ah yes, compassion, a very conservative thing. I actually believe that to be true.

Liberals tend to show their "compassion" with other people's money, not with their own money.

The takers never stop once you let them into the trough of money and entitlements.

Yes, we see that every time liberal voters vote for liberal politicians who promise them free stuff.

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 4:16:53 PM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:

I don't know.

That is obvious.

Most of the developed world understands this just fine,
of course. The U.S. is nearly the only exception.

Our system of the government subsidizing some people's health through
untaxed employer benefits

The government isn't DOING that.

is one of the major things standing in the
way of improving our health care system.

This is a benefit that
everybody should receive directly, independent of employment.

And who will pay for that?

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 5:30:32 PM UTC-4, Lord Vath wrote:

Preventive medicine is much cheaper and easier. You don't have to
force people to pay more taxes for health care.

Preventable causes of health problems include smoking, drinking, drug use, poor eating habits, risky behaviors, etc. These account for a sizable portion of health care costs in the US, and those who engage in the above habits are not paying their share of the increasingly collectivized costs which they disproportionately cause.

Let every one decide how much health insurance they want to buy for themselves and decide which unhealthy vices they are willing to forgo in order to be less of a burden and more of a help to the "system."

Simple.

On Thursday, June 25, 2015 at 6:16:15 PM UTC-4, Uncarollo2 wrote:

before the ACA anyone could go to the emergency room on the taxpayer's dime. Now they are required to have insurance. Personal responsibility.

No, it isn't. Personal responsibility would be reducing one's burden on other's by having adopting a healthy lifestyle and/or paying according to the risks they cause by not adopting said lifestyle.

On Sunday, June 28, 2015 at 10:29:00 AM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:

One huge advantage of a rich society is the ability to define richer,
more complex, and more far reaching rights, that expand the
opportunities of everyone. One huge advantage of a democratic society
is for those rights to be broadly defined by the people, by majority
or by consensus, not by just a few.

The most successful free and rich societies also have the broadest and
most levelly defined and applied rights. And that's no coincidence.

That's a load of bs.

On Saturday, June 27, 2015 at 3:59:03 AM UTC-4, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Fri, 26 Jun 2015 19:15:51 -0700 (PDT), RichA
wrote:

F-O you stupid socialist. Your morons don't understand the concept of individual achievement.

You say to a very successful entrepreneur who created one of the most
respected astronomical instrument companies around.

What is a "respected astronomical instrument company?" Do they only make "respected" astronomical instruments? Are they the only ones to do so? Is not a 60mm refractor a "respected" astronomical instrument?

Your individual
achievements are less apparent.

Ugharoller only understands the concept of his own "achievements" in a narrow area, as do you. You both consider most others' achievements to be inconsequential or to be taken for granted and then ignored.

On Tue, 30 Jun 2015 09:00:35 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Our system of the government subsidizing some people's health through
untaxed employer benefits

The government isn't DOING that.

Of course it is. Businesses write off this benefit, reducing their
taxes. The employees who receive the benefit pay no taxes on it. It's
just an alternate form of income, which is untaxed. Self-employed
people don't have an equivalent ability to write off their insurance.
It comes out of after-tax income.

The entire system of employer provided health insurance was created as
a way to boost effective worker income.

This is a benefit that
everybody should receive directly, independent of employment.

And who will pay for that?

The same people who pay for all public goods: the public. Through
taxes.

On Tue, 30 Jun 2015 08:53:47 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

Having a healthy citizenry is a benefit to all of us, having the person next to you on the Metro not suffering from TB is in your interest,
having a server not ill works for me, having school children benefit from accessible health care is of benefit to your children and the teachers. Civilization just works better with healthy citizens. Why does anyone have such a hard time understanding this ?

Those are matters of public health, not health insurance.

The two are closely related.