A Space & astronomy forum. SpaceBanter.com

Go Back   Home » SpaceBanter.com forum » Others » UK Astronomy
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old June 24th 11, 02:29 PM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
Weatherlawyer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 20
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

On Jun 23, 2:40*pm, Alan LeHun wrote:
In article 6193e963-0e32-401c-80a8-
,
says...

It is assumed the gasses methane and similar make up the atmosphere if
I remember correctly but water is a lot lighter than methane is it
not?


Water H20 2+16=18
Methane CH4 12+4=16

Methane is a little lighter than water.


What counts more than atomic weights is, as with solar systems, the
spaces in between.

The vast majority of the atmosphere is, apparently, hydrogen and helium.


I rather think that much of our understanding about the top layers of
all the gas planets is based on supposition built out over hypotheses.

My chemistry teacher in the good old daze told me that water is
lighter than air. It's about all I remember from the bad old good
olds. I wonder what he said about methane.

Too late to go and ask him now.
Too late to go and ask him.

Am I right in thinking that Jupiter is the only planet that emits more
heat than it accepts?

In which case the physics of heat leaves a lot to be desired;
especially in the time frames usurped by monkeys. Not that
creationists can give a time frame for the life of Jupiter nor its
heat history, anything past human history.

And it still couldn't chill out like that.





  #12  
Old June 24th 11, 02:34 PM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
Weatherlawyer[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 20
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

On Jun 23, 2:40*pm, Alan LeHun wrote:
In article 6193e963-0e32-401c-80a8-
,
says...

It is assumed the gasses methane and similar make up the atmosphere if
I remember correctly but water is a lot lighter than methane is it
not?


Water H20 2+16=18
Methane CH4 12+4=16

Methane is a little lighter than water.

The vast majority of the atmosphere is, apparently, hydrogen and helium.


When in doubt ask about
From the Wikipedia:

Hot Air is frequently used in recreational ballooning. Hot air is
lighter than air at ambient temperature.

Neon is lighter than air and will lift a balloon. However, it is
relatively rare on the Earth, expensive, and is among the heavier of
the lifting gases.

The gaseous state of water is lighter than air, and has successfully
been used as a lifting gas. It is generally impractical due to high
boiling point and condensation.

Ammonia has sometimes been used to fill weather balloons. Due to its
relatively high boiling point (compared to helium and hydrogen),
ammonia could potentially be refrigerated and liquified aboard an
airship to reduce lift and add ballast (and returned to a gas to add
lift and reduce ballast).

Methane is sometimes used as a lift gas when hydrogen and helium are
not available. It has the advantage of not leaking through balloon
walls as rapidly as the small-moleculed hydrogen and helium. (Many
lighter-than-air balloons are made of aluminized plastic that limits
such leakage; hydrogen and helium leak rapidly through latex
balloons.)

Hydrogen and helium are the most commonly used lift gases. Although
helium is twice as heavy as (diatomic) hydrogen, they are both so much
lighter than air that this difference is inconsequential. Hydrogen has
about 8% more buoyancy than helium.

In a practical dirigible design the difference is significant making a
50% difference in the fuel carrying capacity of the dirigible and
hence increasing its range significantly.
  #13  
Old June 28th 11, 01:56 AM
neilzero neilzero is offline
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by SpaceBanter: May 2011
Posts: 22
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weatherlawyer[_2_] View Post
On Jun 23, 2:40*pm, Alan LeHun wrote:
In article 6193e963-0e32-401c-80a8-
,
says...

It is assumed the gasses methane and similar make up the atmosphere if
I remember correctly but water is a lot lighter than methane is it
not?


Water H20 2+16=18
Methane CH4 12+4=16

Methane is a little lighter than water.


What counts more than atomic weights is, as with solar systems, the
spaces in between.

The vast majority of the atmosphere is, apparently, hydrogen and helium.


I rather think that much of our understanding about the top layers of
all the gas planets is based on supposition built out over hypotheses.

My chemistry teacher in the good old daze told me that water is
lighter than air. It's about all I remember from the bad old good
olds. I wonder what he said about methane.

Too late to go and ask him now.
Too late to go and ask him.

Am I right in thinking that Jupiter is the only planet that emits more
heat than it accepts?

In which case the physics of heat leaves a lot to be desired;
especially in the time frames usurped by monkeys. Not that
creationists can give a time frame for the life of Jupiter nor its
heat history, anything past human history.

And it still couldn't chill out like that.
Methane is slightly less dense than water vapor which is about half as dense as nitrogen which is slightly less dense than oxygen. All the planets emit slightly more heat than they receive, over the long term, but Jupiter emits about 25% more. Neil
  #14  
Old June 29th 11, 09:00 AM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
N_Cook
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 86
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

Except for a couple of days this jetstream loop has been/ will be present
for about 3 weeks.
http://virga.sfsu.edu/gif/jetstream_atl_h120_00.gif
Just oscillating back and forth over a small section of the N Atlantic


  #15  
Old July 2nd 11, 07:33 AM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
N_Cook
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 86
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

So its only me intrigued as to why/how the jetstream has taken up this
apparently stable loop form for getting on for a month, now out to 07 July
http://virga.sfsu.edu/gif/jetstream_atl_h120_00.gif


  #16  
Old July 2nd 11, 10:14 AM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
Togless
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

"N_Cook" wrote:

So its only me intrigued as to why/how the jetstream has taken up this
apparently stable loop form for getting on for a month, now out to 07
July
http://virga.sfsu.edu/gif/jetstream_atl_h120_00.gif


I'm not very good at interpreting that graph. Is the loop centred just
slightly to the west of Ireland? What are the irregular shapes marked out
with dotted lines?

Cheers,
John.


  #17  
Old July 2nd 11, 12:28 PM posted to uk.sci.weather,uk.sci.astronomy
N_Cook
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 86
Default Is this how a "Great Red Spot" could start?

Togless wrote in message
...
"N_Cook" wrote:

So its only me intrigued as to why/how the jetstream has taken up this
apparently stable loop form for getting on for a month, now out to 07
July
http://virga.sfsu.edu/gif/jetstream_atl_h120_00.gif


I'm not very good at interpreting that graph. Is the loop centred just
slightly to the west of Ireland?

yes
What are the irregular shapes marked out
with dotted lines?


They are isotachs differentiating 50/70/90.... knot winds
If you use free Irfanview and load the numbers at the end of this post as a
..pal file then import in View option , it will colour up the bands.
Unfortunately I only created it for stronger jet speeds instead of grey
scale


Cheers,
John.




JASC-PAL
0100
256
255 255 255
0 0 0
76 76 76
0 0 179
158 158 158
163 163 163
174 174 174
179 179 179
184 184 184
255 76 76
255 255 0
128 255 0
0 255 255
0 128 192
128 0 255
255 128 0
215 215 215
255 76 76
255 255 0
128 255 0
0 255 255
0 128 192
128 0 255
255 128 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0
0 0 0



 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What made "2001" a "great" SF film? [email protected] Policy 2 February 26th 07 08:41 PM
What made "2001" a "great" SF film? Rand Simberg Policy 0 February 7th 07 04:58 PM
"Great Warholian wonder" in heaven... Star of the East, oh "Ma Rock, Ma RIP"... Warhol Misc 32 June 6th 06 01:14 AM
HUBBLE SNAPS BABY PICTURES OF JUPITER'S "RED SPOT JR." (STScI-PRC06-19) INBOX ASTRONOMY: NEWS ALERT Hubble 0 May 4th 06 07:23 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 SpaceBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.