A Space & astronomy forum. SpaceBanter.com

Go Back   Home » SpaceBanter.com forum » Astronomy and Astrophysics » Research
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

GravityShieldingUpdates1.1



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old March 14th 05, 04:01 PM
Stan Byers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default GravityShieldingUpdates1.1

Gentlemen of physical science.

This article is posted with a request for reviews prior to activating it on
the website.
All comments, corrections and alternate views are welcome. Reviews may be
posted
on this group or emailed. Reviews will not be posted on the web site or news
groups without the
reviewing author's prior permission. The links for the graphs are listed
below and the
graphs are currently available on the website.

Io's period change graphs via Excel spreadsheet.

Earth retreating from Jupiter
http://home.netcom.com/~sbyers11/IoAppro.gif

Earth approaching Jupiter
http://home.netcom.com/~sbyers11/IoEcipChange4.gif

This entire article is available on the website, but it is not yet
interconnected
with the other web pages. Newsgroup readers may review the complete article
at the link http://home.netcom.com/~sbyers11/litespd_vs_sr.htm

Shortly after the reviews have been received this content will be
incorporated
with the other pages on the site.

Thanks in advance, Cheers

Stan Byers

Fremont, California

email


Abstract

This paper reviews the available speed of light (C) measurements that
demonstrate speed variations of inter-planetary light as measured relative
to the motion:...of planets, satellites, the solar system, and the Milky Way
galaxy.
The idea that light from a remote source maintains a constant speed (C)
relative to all observers regardless of their differing speeds and
directions, as proposed by the theory of Special Relativity, is shown to be
incompatible with the characteristics of light's speed demonstrated by the
data, analysis and charts of Io's eclipse timing. This paper is an
extension of the work available at the web page "Radiant Pressure Model of
Remote Force" . A review of the section titled "The Variable Speed of Light"
may aid in perusing this article.

Table of Contents Light Speed

Light Speed vs Special Relativity
Abstract
Light's Variable Speed
Special Relativity Advocates
Io's Eclipse Delays
Roemer's 1003 Second Delay
Delay versus Transverse Motion
Charts of Io's Delays
Light's Moving Medium via Prime Force Radiation
Summary of Light's Characteristics


Light's Variable Speed Relative to Observers in Motion

In our experience with the speed of sound in air and the Doppler effect we
have found that the speed of sound through the air is independent of the
relative speed between source and receiver. The speed of sound is constant
only in relation to the homogenous medium, through which it is traveling.
Sound travels as a longitudinal resonance within the physical properties of
it's medium.
Circa 1676 Olaf Roemer's Io eclipse timing measurements demonstrated that
the speed of light is not infinite. Prior to this discovery it was a popular
belief that light's speed was infinite. Using the eclipse period timing of
Jupiter's moon Io, Roemer found that light took approximately 1000 seconds
to cross the 300 million kilometer diameter of the earth's orbit, indicating
a speed of about 300,000 Km/sec.

Thereafter it was assumed that interplanetary light traveled at C through a
medium of infinitesimal material particles and this all pervading medium was
called the Aether (ether). The speed of light was assumed to be constant in
relation to this material Aether of space, in the same manner that sound
speed is constant relative to it's medium. This material Aether was
visualized as pervading all planets and objects and space. Therefore it was
assumed that due to the orbital speed of the Earth, that light from space
would show a measurable change in speed depending on the direction of the
Earth's motion through this presumed stationary material "Aether". It also
seemed reasonable that the light speed perpendicular to the direction of the
Earth's motion would always remain at C, ( 300,000 Km/sec ).

In ~1887 Michelson and Morley performed a famous experiment comparing the
speed of local light in the direction of Earth's velocity to the speed of
light transverse to the Earth's motion. They found that the motion of the
Earth had no effect on the velocity of local light,...relative to the Earth
and within its cloak of atmosphere and secondary radiation. The surprising
results of this local experiment were generally extrapolated to believe
that all of light, including light from non local sources in space, also
traveled at the constant C, "relative to the observing location". In
parallel with this development the theory of Special Relativity was
published circa 1905 with main tenets that included the concept that not
only local light, but that all of light in space,... traveled at C,..." in
relation to the observer",...regardless of the observers velocity.



Special Relativity Advocates

A quote from Matthew Chalmers' article in Physics World January 2005, "Five
Papers That Shook The World" , provides another view of this Special
Relativity theory.

Quote: True to style, Einstein swept away the concept of the ether (which
in any case had not been detected experimentally) in one audacious step. He
postulated that no matter how fast you are moving, light will always appear
to travel at the same velocity:-- the speed of light is a fundamental
constant of nature that cannot be exceeded.
Combined with the requirement that the laws of physics are identical in
all "inertial" (i.e. non-accelerating) frames, Einstein built a completely
new theory of motion that revealed Newtonian mechanics to be an
approximation that only holds at low, everyday speeds. The theory later
became known as the special theory of relativity, - special because it
applies only to non-accelerating frames - and led to the realization that
space and time are intimately linked to one another. Unquote

The following quote from Steven Hawking's famous book "A Brief History of
Time", page 20, provides another description of the concepts contained in
Einstein's Special Theory of Relativity.

Quote: The fundamental postulate of the theory of relativity, as it was
called, was that the laws of science should be the same for all freely
moving observers, no matter what their speed. This was true for Newton's
laws of motion, but now the idea was extended to include Maxwell's theory
and the speed of light:...all observers should measure the same speed of
light, no matter how fast they are moving. Unquote

Britannica's web site provides the following quote about Special Relativity

Quote Since he (Einstein) believed in (and experiment confirmed) the
(extended) principle of relativity, which meant that one cannot, by any
means, including the use of light waves, distinguish between two inertial
frames in uniform relative motion, Einstein chose to give up the Galilean
transformations and replaced them with the Lorentz Transformations. Unquote

The article containing this above quote may still be available at this URL
link.
www.britannica.com/eb/article?tocId=9048966

The Physics FAQ found on the web provides another view listed as "Special
Relativity"

Quote It is a basic postulate of the theory of relativity that the speed
of light is constant. This can be broken down into two parts:

The speed of light is independent of the motion of the observer.
The speed of light does not vary with time or place.

To state that the speed of light is independent of the velocity of the
observer is very counterintuitive. Some people even refuse to accept this
as a logically consistent possibility, but in 1905 Einstein was able to show
that it is perfectly consistent if you are prepared to give up assumptions
about the absolute nature of space and time. Unquote
The link for this above quote is http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/

The Stanford Linear Accelerator Center's web site
http://www.slac.stanford.edu
provides an educational page
http://www2.slac.stanford.edu/vvc/th...elativity.html
giving the following opinions regarding Special Relativity.

Quote Theoretical Basis for Special Relativity
Einstein's theory of special relativity results from two statements -- the
two basic postulates of special relativity:
The speed of light is the same for all observers, no matter what their
relative speeds.
The laws of physics are the same in any inertial (that is,
non-accelerated) frame of reference. This means that the laws of physics
observed by a hypothetical observer traveling with a relativistic particle
must be the same as those observed by an observer who is stationary in the
laboratory.
Given these two statements, Einstein showed how definitions of momentum
and energy must be refined and how quantities such as length and time must
change from one observer to another in order to get consistent results for
physical quantities such as particle half-life. To decide whether his
postulates are a correct theory of nature, physicists test whether the
predictions of Einstein's theory match observations. Indeed many such tests
have been made -- and the answers Einstein gave are right every time!
Unquote

The book, Princeton Guide to Advanced Physics, publishes another view as:
The Postulates of Special Relativity, pg 169.

Quote All observers, even when in uniform relative motion, will find
the same value c for the speed of light in empty space. Unquote

The level of detail used in this review may seem excessive to readers
familiar with this issue, but the list of quotes included above is just a
small sample demonstrating the popularity of the Special Relativity theory.
Notice of the existence of Universities or Government Science institutions
that propose concepts refuting the above interpretations of Special
Relativity will be appreciated. It is intended here to provide enough
detail, data and transparency to allow those with opposing opinions to
easily use this same material from the Earth/Jupiter/Io scenario to
demonstrate with specificity the logic of :

~ Einstein's SR postulate,...Quote "There exists a coordinate system with
respect to which every light ray propagates in vacuum with the velocity C".
Unquote,.....from Einstein's 1912 SR manuscript.

~ Their reconciliation of the SR postulate with the opposite conclusions
indicated by this data.

~ The changes necessary in this accounting that will bring this data into
agreement with SR.

In the vast world wide web and publications there may be articles that
interpret Einstein's Special Relative theory in a manner that provides
agreement with Roemer's data. Limited searches by this author have not
revealed such information. A notice of links to such information will be
appreciated.



Io's Eclipse Delays

An analysis of light's speed in relation to the motion of Earth is given
here by reviewing Roemer's discovery and charting Io's eclipse data
available from Astronomy On Line's web site. Olaf Roemer's measurements of
1676 AD demonstrated a finite value for the speed of light through
interplanetary space. Roemer noticed that the eclipse event timing for
Jupiter's moon Io was delayed approximately 1000 seconds when the Earth was
at it's farthest point from Jupiter in comparison to the event timing
measured at the closest point in Earth's orbit. With the current knowledge
of the diameter of Earth's orbit at approximately 300 million Km, Roemer's
delay of 1003 sec. indicates that light travels through space in relation
to Jupiter at a speed of 299,103 Km per second (C).

During Earth's orbital trip from the point nearest to Jupiter (opposition),
to the farthest point (conjunction), the moon Io completes 113 eclipse
cycles as timed at the near point. If this is an exact calculation then the
last eclipse event image, number 113 is crossing the near point when the
Earth is at the mathematical far point. This last event will not be observed
in the vicinity of the far point (conjunction) for another 1003 seconds
(16.7 minutes). Many books and reviewers of this phenomenon list the time
for Earth's journey from the near point to the far point as 200 days and
equate this to 113 Io eclipse event periods as observed at the near point.

NASA's JPL Labs provides data listing a mathematical time period of
152,853.5 seconds (~1.77 days) for Io's sidereal revolution. Io's eclipse
revolution time is 152,915.9 seconds , which is 62.4 seconds longer than the
sidereal revolution time, due to the relative motion of the Sun line.


Roemer's 1003 Second Delay

In order to clarify the issues of this argument we will linearize the
arithmetic by assuming to take a spacecraft trip from Earth at the near
point, following the diameter to the future far point. This constant
longitudinal speed will be set to equal the Earth's average longitudinal
speed when retreating in relation to Jupiter. In this scenario the
spacecraft will rendezvous with the Earth at the far point after 113
periods elapse (~200 days) plus the 1003 second delay. The 113th event and
the spacecraft will arrive at the far point with Roemer's famous 1003 second
delay. The longitudinal distance traveled relative to Jupiter is the
diameter of the Earth's orbit, ...~300 million Km. Therefore Earth's
retreating longitudinal trip of 300 million Km in 113 orbit periods (~200
days), requires an average speed of 17.36 Km per second in relation to
Jupiter. The Earth only moves in it's orbit approximately one hundredth of
a degree during the 1003 second delay. Therefore assuming that the far point
and the intercept point for the 113 eclipse event are the same does not
introduce any significant error.

Since the diameter distance of 300 million Km is evenly divided by the
constant speed of the spacecraft , the distance from the start ( near point)
to the point for the first observed eclipse event will be the total
distance, divided by the number of Io eclipse periods, 113. This places the
point of observation, for the first eclipse observed by the spacecraft in
motion,...at 2.6549 million Km from the near point.

The time accounting tells us that if there are 113 Io eclipse orbits during
this trip, and the last eclipse event is observed and measured to be 1003
seconds later than predicted,...therefore at the half way point in distance
for the linear trip the delay must have been about 501.5 seconds. Continuing
with this accounting, the first observed eclipse after leaving the near
point on the linear trip, must have exhibited a delay of 8.876 seconds. This
is obtained by dividing the total delay of 1003 seconds by the total 113
eclipse observations.

When a light beam is interrupted by a toothed wheel, it is never assumed
that the dark sections do not travel at the same speed as the light. In fact
many light speed experiments use this obvious physical phenomenon to measure
the speed of light. With the same reasoning it appears obvious that images
transported by a light beam have to travel at the same speed as the light
beam. Movie projectors provide examples of the application of this physical
phenomenon. When this reasoning is applied to the images of Io's eclipse
events, it does not seem possible to question the fact that the event images
travel at the same speed as their constituent light. If there is a Doppler
effect for the frequency of the light, there will also have to be a Doppler
effect for events or digital information, ..and visa versa. It is necessary
that this mutual relationship, between these two Doppler phenomena,...is
clear to the reader for understanding the main argument of this paper.

Now if the spacecraft leaves Earth at the near point and at the observation
of an eclipse event, then the time to the next observed eclipse event will
be 8.876 seconds longer than a stationary period, as calculated above.
The near point and Jupiter have no relative velocity, therefore the train of
light imaging Io's eclipse events is traveling at C in relation to Jupiter,
the near point and the first rendezvous point.

When the next eclipse event passes the near point with the speed of C, it
will continue toward the rendezvous with the spacecraft, and it will take
light 8.876 seconds to cover the 2.6549 million Km to reach the first
rendezvous point. This, of course, is the reason for the delay observed by
the spacecraft in motion.

Since the light speed, C, in relation to Jupiter is 299,103 Km/s , and the
spacecraft speed in relation to Jupiter is 17.361 Km/sec,...this results in
an average reduced relative speed of 299,085.6 Km/sec. between the eclipse
event image motion and the spacecraft motion.

If the speed of the train of light and events from Jupiter was not reduced
in relation to the retreating Earth, succeeding observations of eclipse
events would remain in synchronism with the observations of the near point.
How could a station 2.6549 million miles further from Jupiter observe an
eclipse event at the same time that it is observed at the near point?

The only way there could exist an absence of an observed delay during
motion,...would be if the light speed was infinite. There would be no delays
during the 200 day retreating movement, and the accumulation of 113
individual delays to equal the total 1003 second delay would not occur.

Therefore there would not be a 1003 second delay to be manifested at the far
point.

Since Roemer's 1003 second delay of 1676 AD exists,... and is still
measurable today,... it is demonstrating that light from Jupiter exhibits a
reduced speed in relation to the retreating motion of Earth. On Earth's
return trip a proportionately higher relative light speed will be exhibited
as Earth approaches Jupiter. Upon returning to the near point,... Io's
observed events will again be in phase synchronism with the previous eclipse
events at the near point.

With the light and the space craft racing to the same point at their
different speeds,...how is it possible to subscribe to the concept of
Special Relativity (SR) that states that the relative light speed does not
decrease with changing motion. Furthermore, on Earth's return trip the
relative speed will be greater than the upper limit and the constant speed
of light as postulated by SR.



Delay versus Transverse Motion.

There exists an argument that attributes the period changes which occur
during Earth's orbit to the changing line of sight angle for viewing the
eclipse events. If this argument were true the maximum changes in the length
of the observed period would occur during the orbital positions when the
Earth's motion is transverse to the line of sight to Jupiter. The following
graphs plot the changing delay time from actual eclipse data recorded for a
retreating and approaching orbital trip. It is seen from the following
graphs that the maximum changes in the length of the observed period occur
during the orbital positions that provide the highest relative longitudinal
velocity between the two planets.

When the Earth is nearest to Jupiter during Earth's orbital trip,... Earth's
motion is transverse to the line of sight to Jupiter. At this point of
Earth's orbital travel, it is observed that the orbital period of Jupiter's
moon Io is essentially the same as the JPL's published eclipse revolution
period of 152,915.9758 seconds. Since there is no relative longitudinal
motion between the two planets at this near point in Earth's orbit, the
speed of the eclipse light train periods is taken to be 300,000 Km/sec, C,
in relation to both planets. If the Earth could remain at this nearest point
for a few orbits of Io it would be found that each succeeding eclipse event
would occur with the same predictable period.

As the Earth continues in it's orbit and leaves this point nearest to
Jupiter there arises an increasing longitudinal velocity between the two
planets.
As the light train speed is reduced relative to the retreating Earth, and
remains at C in relation to Jupiter, there will be a measurable increasing
delay in the events as observed from Earth. The following graphs display the
changes in event timing (changing period) in relation to the changing
longitudinal velocity as the Earth retreats from and approaches toward
Jupiter.

When the Earth retreats from Jupiter the relative longitudinal speed
increases to it's maximum which is approximately the orbital speed of Earth
(29.79 Km/sec). This maximum occurs when Earth has traveled through
approximately one quarter of it's orbit. Since this velocity is nearly one
hundredth of one percent (1 X 10^-4) of the speed light,...the light train
traveling past the moving Earth will appear slower by this same percentage.
Since the relative light speed is slower it follows that the apparent time
period between eclipse events will necessarily be longer by the same
percentage. Taking one hundredth of one percent of the eclipse period of
152,916 seconds gives the period a maximum elongation of 15.29 seconds. The
charts of eclipse period elongations and reductions are given below.

These charts were derived from the eclipse event observation records
provided on the web by Astronomy On-Line at the URL
http://www.eso.org/outreach/spec-pro...skills302.html

When this Earth/Jupiter/Io scenario is analyzed with the concept of Special
Relativity in mind, it is obvious that the light train leaving Jupiter does
not arrive at a retreating Earth with a constant speed of C in relation to
Earth. However once a light beam from Jupiter enters the Earth's cloak of
atmosphere and secondary radiation,... it's locally measured speed between
two points becomes C in relation to Earth. This has no influence on the
Doppler frequency changes and the Doppler period changes which are caused by
the relative speed changes due to Earth's orbital velocity referenced to
Jupiter and the eclipse light train. If our atmosphere exhibited a light
speed radically different then C, Roemer's delay would still be evident.



Io's period change graphs via Excel spreadsheet.

Earth retreating from Jupiter
http://home.netcom.com/~sbyers11/IoAppro.gif

Earth approaching Jupiter
http://home.netcom.com/~sbyers11/IoEcipChange4.gif


When reviewing these charts it must be recognized that only the shape of the
curve is needed to demonstrate the main point:...the maximum timing change
occurs during Earths maximum longitudinal speed in relation to Jupiter.

These charts are generated by producing a moving average of an incomplete
set of eclipse events. A complete record of a set of 113 eclipse events is
not available. The moving average is obtained with the trend line
sub-program available in the MS Excel spreadsheet program. The chart lines
would not be offset and would intercept the zero second delay line at the
near and far points, except for the absence of data points and the averaging
characteristic of the sub-program. The absolute values shown on the changing
delay chart should not be used for precise representations of the actual
delays corresponding to Earth's actual orbital positions. The data points
were not recorded to the second, so this necessitated the use of a moving
average plot to obtain the actual trend. The data sets used from Astronomy
On Line were checked against the scattered data points available from the
Galilean Satellite Eclipse Timing Data. The citation for this data is
"Galilean Satellite Eclipse Timing Data by A. Mallama, P. Nelson, J. Park,
D. Collins, and B. Krobusek, 2003,
http://www.amsmeteors.org/mallama/galilean/timings.html
No discrepancies were found between the two data sources.

Citations and links to the supporting data sources have been included in
order to encourage and aid other researchers to replicate this article. If
any researchers wish to obtain the Excel files containing the data and
charts used to produce this article, please email a request to
. . All reviews, alternate views, and comments are
welcome.

Approximately 100 years have passed since the theory of Special Relativity
(SR) appeared in 1905. The SR postulate that the velocity of light is
constant in all inertial systems implied the necessity to revise the ideas
of length, time and simultaneity. The data provided here indicates that this
postulate is not compatible with the actual characteristics of light. This
empirical data demonstrates that the speed of emitted light is isotropic and
at C in relation to the source, and the observed light speed will be
modified depending on the relative motion of the observer and the source.
Newton's, Faraday's and Maxwell's concepts of physical systems, length,
time, simultaneity, radiation and energy remain unchanged when the system of
light (EM) transportation is recognized to function as the above data
demonstrates.



Light's Moving Medium via Prime Force Radiation.
In reviewing the data demonstrating that emitted light is isotropic from a
moving source, it becomes necessary to propose a medium that moves with the
source. This requirement eliminates the possibility of a material medium
consisting of ultra mundane particles. The non EM Prime Force background
radiation (Pf) as described in the article "Radiant Pressure Model of Remote
Force" provides the transport medium for inertia and light. EM radiation,
including light, is propagated as a resonance within the non EM Prime Force
radiation.

Our total Solar system has a motion referenced to sidereal space (star
background) due to the rotation with the Milky Way. Due to the different
Solar system orbits speeds of Earth and Jupiter, there will be times when
Jupiter leads Earth and times when Earth leads Jupiter relative to the
direction of our sidereal motion. In spite of our system's Milky Way
sidereal motion,... the light from Jupiter remains at C in relation to
Jupiter. If this were not so we would measure different speeds for light
depending on the line of sight orientation with the Milky Way motion.
Consequently the light emanating from a non accelerating source object is at
C, and isotropic in relation to the source,...regardless of the speed and
direction of the source in relation to other systems.
A second example of this isotropic velocity phenomenon is the Earth Moon
system. Whether the Moon is leading or trailing the Earth in it's orbit, the
same velocity of Earth shine light will exist arriving at the Moon. This
fact disputes the intuitive and SR concept that light must travel through a
medium and have a constant speed relative to this medium. It appears that
for light to exist as a phenomenon of a background medium, each planet and
Sun must have a medium that moves with it. This appears like an
impossibility for a material medium,... however it is a reasonable concept
for a Prime Force (Pf) radiation medium with a broad frequency spectrum.
Summary of Light's Characteristics

In summary, this review of available data demonstrates that these
characteristics for light exist when it is acknowledged that the Doppler
effect for light cannot be independent of the Doppler effect for the event
images which are propagated with the light.

~ Light speed is isotropic and at C only relative to it's non-accelerating
source.

~ There is no known speed limit for light relative to space or remote
objects.

These characteristics are in direct opposition to the apparent concept from
Einstein's 1912 manuscript for Special Relativity:
Quote "There exists a coordinate system with respect to which every light
ray propagates in vacuum with the velocity C". Unquote.

The use of the universally recognized term "Inertial Space" demonstrates
that we already accept the fact that the medium which supports inertial
force is present, regardless of an objects speed or direction in relation to
sidereal space and Newton's inertial space. A review of this web site's
section on inertia may lead to a better understanding of how this model
demonstrates the unity of matter and Prime Force radiation (Pf), and how it
allows light to exhibit a constant speed in relation to it's source. ***
  #2  
Old March 19th 05, 12:22 PM
John Reed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

There is a simple explanation for the change in the observed eclipse
timings, and overthrowing special relativity isn't needed to do it.

Consider the point in the Earth's orbit where the change in the ellipse
period is maximum. This change is about 15 seconds. Let one ellipse period
at Jupiter start at time 0, the next at time T. The first ellipse will be
observed at Earth at time d/c, where d is the distance to Jupiter and c is
light speed. During time T, the Earth has moved in its orbit a distance vT
away from Jupiter, where v is the Earth's orbital velocity. The next
ellipse will be observed at time T+d/c+vT/c. Plugging in numbers from the
web site, vT/c is equal to 15 seconds. This is the origin of the change in
ellipse period.

John Reed

[Mod. note: entire quoted article deleted -- mjh]
  #3  
Old March 20th 05, 01:30 PM
Stan Byers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hello John,

I agree with all of your math,... but why you conclude that it is different
than the original post is not understood. I believe we are in a situation
where the original post says the answer is six and you are saying,....no the
answer is a half a dozen.

Your term vT which is the Earth's velocity times one period T indicates that
Earth has a velocity away from Jupiter during the time period T. During
that same period T the second eclipse event image and it's light train is
racing away from Jupiter in the same direction as Earth. Now when two things
have a differing velocities in the same direction at the same time period,
they have a relative velocity. If they are both at the same speed the
relative velocity is zero. For the rabbit and the turtle race between light
and Earth the definition of relative velocity is still valid. The velocity
of Earth is algebracially combined with the velocity of the light and that
is the relative velocity. If the velocity of Earth was one quarter C,...the
relative velocity between the eclipse image and Earth would be three
quarters C. Using your symbols the relative velocity between light and Earth
is C minus v, at the highest relative velocity of the Earth's orbit.
Special Relativity still does not compare to Roemer's data. If the postulate
describing a constant light speed C for all observers was true,...there
would not be a 1003 second delay in Roemer's data and light speed through
space would have to be infinite

Cheers, Stan Byers

//////////////////////////////////////.

"John Reed" wrote in message
...
There is a simple explanation for the change in the observed eclipse
timings, and overthrowing special relativity isn't needed to do it.

Consider the point in the Earth's orbit where the change in the ellipse
period is maximum. This change is about 15 seconds. Let one ellipse
period
at Jupiter start at time 0, the next at time T. The first ellipse will be
observed at Earth at time d/c, where d is the distance to Jupiter and c is
light speed. During time T, the Earth has moved in its orbit a distance
vT
away from Jupiter, where v is the Earth's orbital velocity. The next
ellipse will be observed at time T+d/c+vT/c. Plugging in numbers from the
web site, vT/c is equal to 15 seconds. This is the origin of the change
in
ellipse period.

John Reed

[Mod. note: entire quoted article deleted -- mjh]

  #4  
Old March 23rd 05, 01:28 PM
Oriel36
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Stan Byers" wrote in message ...
Your term vT which is the Earth's velocity times one period T indicates that
Earth has a velocity away from Jupiter during the time period T. During
that same period T the second eclipse event image and it's light train is
racing away from Jupiter in the same direction as Earth. Now when two things
have a differing velocities in the same direction at the same time period,
they have a relative velocity. If they are both at the same speed the
relative velocity is zero. For the rabbit and the turtle race between light
and Earth the definition of relative velocity is still valid. The velocity
of Earth is algebracially combined with the velocity of the light and that
is the relative velocity. If the velocity of Earth was one quarter C,...the
relative velocity between the eclipse image and Earth would be three
quarters C. Using your symbols the relative velocity between light and Earth
is C minus v, at the highest relative velocity of the Earth's orbit.
Special Relativity still does not compare to Roemer's data. If the postulate
describing a constant light speed C for all observers was true,...there
would not be a 1003 second delay in Roemer's data and light speed through
space would have to be infinite


Non astronomers have great difficulty with the Mora Luminis of Ole
Roemer due to the way Newton scrambled the insight on finite light
distance with Keplerian motion.Under Newtonian conceptions, the
slightly exaggerated slowing towards the aphelion and slight increase
towards to perihelion is bound together with Keplerian motion .

PHENOMENON V.
Then the primary planets, by radii drawn to the earth, describe areas
no wise proportional to the times; but that the areas which they
describe by radii drawn to the sun are proportional to the times of
description.

For to the earth they appear sometimes direct, sometimes stationary,
nay, and sometimes retrograde. But from the sun they are always seen
direct, and to proceed with a motion nearly uniform, that is to say, a
little swifter in the perihelion and a little slower in the aphelion
distances, so as to maintain an equality in the description of the
areas. This a noted proposition among astronomers, and particularly
demonstrable in Jupiter, from the eclipses of his satellites; by the
help of which eclipses, as we have said, the heliocentric longitudes
of that planet, and its distances from the sun, are determined.

http://members.tripod.com/~gravitee/phaenomena.htm

In a remarkable series of maneuvers,Newton adopted Flamsteed's
sidereal background which is tied directly to terrestial/celestial
longitudes but this left the insight on finite light distance hanging
(among other things).

With all due respect to the theorists,the mathematical choreography
which constitutes a descent from Roemer to Kepler to Copernicus to
Newtonian quasi-geocentricity is extremely dissapointing even if it is
hugely intriguing and intricate to work out.

[Mod. note: quoted text trimmed -- please do this yourself -- mjh]
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 SpaceBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.