Progress ISS launch fails!

Based on the number of almost lost vehicle and crew events before the
coumbia disaster I believed management had go fever schedule before
safety. and posted many times we would have another accident........

sadly I was right

In article 1b96e070-3b38-4733-bf4e-b74f7e2e4068
@v7g2000vbk.googlegroups.com, says...


I just wish that we still had Shuttle for a few more flights.
-Mike

exactly, it was pure miss mangement on the part of nasa and congress
to end shuttle before a replacement was flying

You're such a two faced liar Bob. You were the one calling for the
immediate end of shuttle flights due to "safety" problems. You got your
wish, now you're saying you were wrong? What kind of two faced argument
are you trying to pull this time?

Jeff
--
" Ares 1 is a prime example of the fact that NASA just can't get it
up anymore... and when they can, it doesn't stay up long. "
- tinker

On 25/08/2011 4:07 AM, Pat Flannery wrote:
Today's launch of a Progress cargo ship to the ISS has failed:
http://spaceflightnow.com/station/exp28/110824prog44p/
The upper stage malfunctioned and the cargo ship reentered the atmosphere.
You know, if SpaceX can get that Dragon launch sped up, it would be pure
gold as far as positive publicity for them.

Pat

Even if the third stage (bloc) did fail during it's part of the launch,
the crew would still (probably) be OK, but re-enter on a sub-orbital course.

On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 14:03:59 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

this recession is a worldwide one, and the worst since the great
depression.

"Worst since Great Depression" does not equal "As bad as the Great
Depression". "Recession" does not equal "Depression".

Recessions usually are global. Nothing new there.

this is not a normal cyclical recession and by all reports our nation
will be cutting social security, ending medicare as we knoiw it and
cutting many other budget items. calls to baance the budget now will
only make things worse according to the OMB who is calling for more
stimuls.

The economy is technically growing, which means we aren't even in a
Recession. The problem is that the economists were forecasting 4%
growth this year, and we're only seeing about 2%. But growth is
growth. "Recession" by definition is a decline in GDP.

Hence all the talk about a "Double Dip Recession", where we enter a
second recession before we've completely recovered from the previous
one. However, economists are far from unanimous that a Double Dip
Recession is imminent (especially since the Congressweasels raised the
debt ceiling.)

we are looking at depression..........

No, we're not. You really need to go to a Library and read a book
about the Depression, its causes and its impact. Our economy, screwed
up as it may be today by incompetent government and out of control
corporate greed, is orders of magnitude healthier than it was in 1930.

OMB tried stimulus in 2009. A honkin' big stimulus. It didn't work.
Lesson learned.

You do realize there was no such thing as Social Security before 1935
or Medicare before 1965 and we got along just fine for a century or
two without them, right? You do understand that balancing the budget
and paying off the debt will actually make our economy much stronger
in the long run, right?

For someone who proclaims he predicted the housing market crash, you
sure seem extremely poorly educated in economics.

Brian

In sci.space.history Pat Flannery wrote:
On 8/28/2011 7:06 AM, Brian Thorn wrote:

What I do wonder about, is, "would NASA have allowed SpaceX to launch
a Dragon with seats, but unmanned, to go to ISS and bring home the
stranded STS-135 crew?" That should be possible if push came to shove.

Knowing Musk, he could have probably had that ready around a month from
the word "go".
(Cut to astronauts looking at a Naugahyde couch super-glued inside of
the Dragon and a pile of scuba tanks and mouthpieces for their air
supply.) ;-)

Nah, a bunch of Shuttle-surplus suits that SpaceX bought via eBay.

Speaking of which, some places are positing that the ISS might be
unmanned by mid November. As Dragon relies on someone being on the
station to effect the docking, an unmanned ISS means at best (?) the
next Dragon mission would end-up going back to what it was originally
planned to be - dress-rehersal without actual docking.

rick jones
--
The glass is neither half-empty nor half-full. The glass has a leak.
The real question is "Can it be patched?"
these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway...
feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH...

On Aug 25, 12:17*pm, Pat Flannery wrote:
On 8/25/2011 1:06 AM, Jochem Huhmann wrote:

This might help though with NASA supporting SpaceX with manned Dragon
missions. ISS hanging off Soyuz for all manned flights is not a state of
affairs one would wish for.

I don't think NASA likes Dragon, as it is a threat to their way of dong
things, and they probably wish it would just go away... so that business
as usual with ULA could go on as before.
NASA sort of got dragged, kicking and screaming, into COTS, to show they
wanted to privatize space services.

If NASA wanted so desperately to kill COTS, they'd have gone long ago
with USA's proposal to fly the Space Shuttle commercially. There's
nothing any of the COTS participants have that can even remotely
compete with a Shuttle orbiter's capabilities.
-Mike

On Aug 29, 6:16*am, Jeff Findley wrote:
In article 1b96e070-3b38-4733-bf4e-b74f7e2e4068
@v7g2000vbk.googlegroups.com, says...



I just wish that we still had Shuttle for a few more flights.
-Mike

exactly, it was pure miss mangement on the part of nasa and congress
to end shuttle before a replacement was flying

You're such a two faced liar Bob. *You were the one calling for the
immediate end of shuttle flights due to "safety" problems. *You got your
wish, now you're saying you were wrong? *What kind of two faced argument
are you trying to pull this time?

Jeff, Haller is mentally ill. You should know that by now. Imagine a
crazed lunatic at an airport screaming that a plane will crash. Well,
statistically speaking, given enough time and enough flights, that'll
happen, and the nutjob will scream "I told you so!". Same thing with
Haller.

You are just wasting time trying to reason with this guy.
-Mike

Brian Thorn wrote:

On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 14:03:59 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

The economy is technically growing, which means we aren't even in a
Recession. The problem is that the economists were forecasting 4%
growth this year, and we're only seeing about 2%. But growth is
growth. "Recession" by definition is a decline in GDP.

Hence all the talk about a "Double Dip Recession", where we enter a
second recession before we've completely recovered from the previous
one.

There are economic cycles about once per decade. I remember several.
Most of the cycles the peak of the boom year is higher than the peak of
the boom of the previous cycle. Most of the cycles the put at the
bottom is higher than the pit at the bottom of the previous cycle. This
time the bottom was lower than the bottoms of several previous cycles
and it does not look like the peak will be anywhere near the one before
the most recent crash.

we are looking at depression..........

No, we're not.

In technical terms, agreed. But in terms of reading the chart it makes
sense to call it that. The previous time where the bottom was worse and
the following top did not catch up was the Great Depression. It's a
description based on curve matching.

On Aug 29, 9:16*am, Jeff Findley wrote:
In article 1b96e070-3b38-4733-bf4e-b74f7e2e4068
@v7g2000vbk.googlegroups.com, says...



I just wish that we still had Shuttle for a few more flights.
-Mike

exactly, it was pure miss mangement on the part of nasa and congress
to end shuttle before a replacement was flying

You're such a two faced liar Bob. *You were the one calling for the
immediate end of shuttle flights due to "safety" problems. *You got your
wish, now you're saying you were wrong? *What kind of two faced argument
are you trying to pull this time?

Jeff
--
" Ares 1 is a prime example of the fact that NASA just can't get it
* up anymore... and when they can, it doesn't stay up long. "
* *- tinker

I NEVER anticipated the end of shuttle with no near term
replacement.......

Although the manned shuttle needed to end before we lost another
vehicle and crew. NASA stated publically another loss was expected.

I did believe the shuttle could continue flying at a low rate either
unmanned or with a maximum crew of 2 or a pd ejeection system, or
better a shuttle C variant keeping the existing shuttle available for
special needs.

nasa had lots of choices and made the absolute worst choice ares, too
big too costly that no one wanted

On Aug 29, 3:12*pm, Doug Freyburger wrote:
Brian Thorn wrote:
On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 14:03:59 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

The economy is technically growing, which means we aren't even in a
Recession. The problem is that the economists were forecasting 4%
growth this year, and we're only seeing about 2%. But growth is
growth. "Recession" by definition is a decline in GDP.

Hence all the talk about a "Double Dip Recession", where we enter a
second recession before we've completely recovered from the previous
one.

There are economic cycles about once per decade. *I remember several.
Most of the cycles the peak of the boom year is higher than the peak of
the boom of the previous cycle. *Most of the cycles the put at the
bottom is higher than the pit at the bottom of the previous cycle. *This
time the bottom was lower than the bottoms of several previous cycles
and it does not look like the peak will be anywhere near the one before
the most recent crash.

we are looking at depression..........

No, we're not.

In technical terms, agreed. *But in terms of reading the chart it makes
sense to call it that. *The previous time where the bottom was worse and
the following top did not catch up was the Great Depression. *It's a
description based on curve matching.

one thing for sure. insist on cuttinmg social security medicare etc.

voters will demand the space budget is zeroed out.

theres no way entitlements will be cut and space operations
survive..........

no how no way ..............