Cake and eat it

The British were involved in the two systems that represent the links between astronomy and timekeeping but unfortunately adopted a cake-and-eat-it approach just as their political system is in shambles with incompatible convictions. The difference is that the so-called brexit is a minor issue compared to the astronomical equivalent.

The British have set up an untenable competition between the RA/Dec and Lat/Long systems in tandem with the calendar system and the 24 hour clock system for what constitutes the basic fact for one rotation with cause and effect being the casualty in the mess.

The Lat/Long system itself is an outrigger of the calendar framework but retains the latitudinal speeds in tandem with the 24 hour system while RA/Dec has no such correlation between planetary geometry nor rotation.

If the brexit situation has taught people anything, it is the virulent defense of untenable ideas that foster division and confusion in a society but due to severely limited reasoning. A more expansive approach would permit more reasonable voices to surface but with the academic version so ingrained after centuries of following a careless mistake, few can ascend to the higher reasoning needed to deal with this urgent matter.

The British here and their hapless colonists are lost to old world politics in order to preserve their identities that astronomers are first and foremost mathematical theorists but this is an accident of the twists and turns of European history.

On Wednesday, January 9, 2019 at 11:48:55 AM UTC-7, Gerald Kelleher wrote:
cause and effect being the casualty in the mess.

Here you are getting this exactly wrong.

Empiricism and reducing the motions of the Solar System to the same physical laws
that would apply to a game of billiards... is precisely how to keep cause and
effect very well sorted out indeed.

John Savard

It is heartening to see a certain group in Britain realise that they have to act outside party affiliations and the worthless slogans to get their country out of the wishful thinking that absorbed the energies of that nation and perhaps fundamentally change the way their social politics is done in future. Most here are harmless/hapless and just wrap themselves in the empirical flag and hold the equivalent of placards - something that is fine in an open society and I haven't anything to say about it.

The astronomical equivalent is many,many times greater or worse, depending on individual position, than any political wishful thinking as the currency here is cause and effect with terrestrial sciences suffering worse. It is possible to reduce the issue to a clear technical matter and therein people can take their positions, at least if they are doing so.

The apparent motion of the stars due to the orbital motion of the Earth takes precedence over stellar circumpolar motion -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VVCiPp67vI&t=201s

It projects the actual motions of Mercury and Venus in their back and forth motion around the Sun and inclusive of the Earth's orbital motion which is largely determined by the line-of-sight change in the position of the stars from left to right of the Sun. Not just proof of the Earth's orbital motion but proof of the faster moving planets and their smaller orbital circuits are found in the symphony of motions in that time lapse above.

It restores the primacy of the 24 hour and Lat/Long systems within the calendar framework and allows for celestial sphere identification and observing without destroying the use of astronomical observations for modeling cause and effect.

Most contributors to this forum here show too much damage although the few who have already realised how proof of the Earth's orbital motion is wrapped up in the transition of the stars from left to right of the Sun are like those cowards who slink away when the spot the damage rather than deal with the opportunities.

On Wednesday, January 9, 2019 at 9:17:54 PM UTC-8, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

Most contributors to this forum here show too much damage...

Gee, I hope I'm not one of them, Gerald... I don't know if I could live with this burden...

On Thursday, January 10, 2019 at 5:46:48 AM UTC, palsing wrote:
On Wednesday, January 9, 2019 at 9:17:54 PM UTC-8, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

Most contributors to this forum here show too much damage...

Gee, I hope I'm not one of them, Gerald... I don't know if I could live with this burden...

Celestial sphere enthusiasts don't carry burdens as the damage is so extensive and perceptually limiting that even when the celestial bubble is smashed into pieces, they can't breath the fresh air of astronomy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VVCiPp67vI&t=207s


You could have your beloved RA/Dec system for identification so long as the observations are not used to discern the actual motions of the planets nor the structure of the solar system unlike the older framework of Ptolemy where the Sun didn't wander but the planets did -

http://community.dur.ac.uk/john.luce...n_ecliptic.gif

The cake-and-eat-it mob want the Sun to wander too thereby undoing what the original Sun did in respect to the slower moving planets but now when the Sun can be seen at the centre of the motions of Mercury and Venus -

http://community.dur.ac.uk/john.luce...solar_year.gif


I never carried a burden on behalf of the technical and historical details of astronomy nor is it meant to draw attention to anything other than what contemporary imaging does by condensing observations and allowing perspectives we couldn't have before. I do, however, carry dismay that people haven't discovered what exists beyond a limiting celestial sphere astronomy.

On Thursday, January 10, 2019 at 5:46:48 AM UTC, palsing wrote:
On Wednesday, January 9, 2019 at 9:17:54 PM UTC-8, Gerald Kelleher wrote:

Most contributors to this forum here show too much damage...

Gee, I hope I'm not one of them, Gerald... I don't know if I could live with this burden...

Celestial sphere enthusiasts don't carry burdens as the damage is so extensive and perceptually limiting that even when the celestial bubble is smashed into pieces, they can't breath the fresh air of astronomy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VVCiPp67vI&t=207s


You could have your beloved RA/Dec system for identification so long as the observations are not used to discern the actual motions of the planets nor the structure of the solar system unlike the older framework of Ptolemy where the Sun didn't wander but the planets did -

http://community.dur.ac.uk/john.luce...n_ecliptic.gif

The cake-and-eat-it mob want the Sun to wander too thereby undoing what the original Sun-centred astronomers did in respect to the slower moving planets but more importantly now when the Sun can be seen at the centre of the back and forth or direct/retrograde motions of Mercury and Venus -

http://community.dur.ac.uk/john.luce...solar_year.gif


I never carried a burden on behalf of the technical and historical details of astronomy nor is it meant to draw attention to anything other than what contemporary imaging does by condensing observations and allowing perspectives we couldn't have before. I do, however, carry dismay that people haven't discovered what exists beyond a limiting celestial sphere astronomy.