Do You Guys Use Green Laser Pointers?

Alright "einstein" or should I say "dr" sniker You show me the moron
that's going to shine a 5mw. GLP point- blank into his eyeball for the
length of time that it is going to take to do any damage and I'll show you
the same idiot that would prop his eyes open with a toothpick and stare
directly into the sun. Who the hell in his right mind would do that? Get
real! ... "well it might happen right"? sheesh!

Were talking about the b.s. that went on over the guy that shined a GLP on
an airplane. In the first place a 5mw. GLP has NO detremental effect at
those distances whatsoever. The power generated demenishes greatly with
distance. The whole story was a bunch of hogwash blown out of proportion!
Now if your talking about a GLP 5mw. then you have an argument. But those
GLP's are not available to the general public so you really don't have much
of an argument do you. Glp's of that power range are reserved for research,
the military and the like.

You sound like the kind of person that reads one article on something and
suddenly thinks he's an expert!


"rcyoung" wrote in message
oups.com...
Sorry to disappoint, but they "can"...note the operative word here
"CAN" be dangerous...just like anything else. Wavelength and length of
exposure (and of course, the wattage rating) are the key to whether
they can cause any discomfort, temporary, or permanent damage.

Dr. Robert Young

Chris L Peterson wrote:
Banning GLPs at star parties because you don't have
responsible attendees is attacking the wrong problem, IMO.

Chris,

How's the weather there in Shangrala ? Must be perfect eh ? Either that
or you simply don't get out much. GLP's *will* be misused at Star
Parties until (and probably even after) they are banned. Because it's
simply human nature. Any pastime such as Amateur Astronomy attracts
geeks. And geeks need to have their little toys. The last Star Party I
was at, Oki-Tex 2003 it was common place for the Astro-Brats to play
green laser tag along the cliffs surrounding the observing area. One of
them got carried away and the beam bounced off a polished Stainless
Steel Airstream Motorhome directly into my left eye leaving it useless
for *hours* afterwards. Oh sure ... I am aware that it was probably
"pumped up" but after getting nailed with one how are you going to find
the culprit in the crowd and rectally implant the thing ?

The fact that you like GLP's has clouded your judgement on this one.


By "aesthetics" I was referring to the appearance of lasers in the sky.
The beams have no impact on visual observers or imagers

This is absolute nonsense. You do understand photography and how it
works don't you ? If you can see it then it can be photographed. And the
mere fact is, irresponsible use of the latest fad toy will not save a
one hour manually guided film image from being hopelessly ruined.
Furthermore the imager is likely to not know it till it gets developed.
Oh I understand that since you use CCD you seem to be blissfully unaware
that many people still use film. And many of them use fast optical
systems and or Widefield lenses. Just the type that would be most
affected by GLP's and other forms of light pollution. And before you
bring up the most used defense to this ........ I have seen actual
images that were ruined and they are not pretty. And they were done as
an experiment by Jason Ware to prove this point. That GLP's are indeed a
form of light pollution and have no value in *any* Star Party
environment. Unless said venue allows Car Headlights too. Then I suppose
it doesn't matter.


, and if you are
in a good site they will be nearly invisible.

Wow .... mag 8.0 skies, no moon, or clouds and zero percent humidity
there in Shangrala eh Chris ? Can I buy the lot next to you and play
with a GLP and see how quickly you change your tune ? laughs

But many star parties are
not held at very good sites, and the appearance of green lines in the
sky may detract from the overall experience for some people. That is a
valid reason to place some limitations on GLP usage.

Finally something that makes some sense. Yes. They need to be banned.
Any Star Party worth a damn will do so because to not do so will hurt
attendance.

And in case you were wondering ? No I don't own one. laughs I can
actually read a star chart and use an 8x50 finder.


Bill

--

William R. Mattil : http://www.celestial-images.com

On Thu, 22 Sep 2005 21:33:09 GMT, "William R. Mattil"
wrote:


How's the weather there in Shangrala ? Must be perfect eh ? Either that
or you simply don't get out much. GLP's *will* be misused at Star
Parties until (and probably even after) they are banned. Because it's
simply human nature.

Sorry, I disagree. I don't see any evidence that GLPs are being
routinely abused, any more than flashlights. A well run star party
should be able to enforce its rules- and those rules can include the way
GLPs are used. If the organizers can't enforce usage, how can they
enforce a ban?

By "aesthetics" I was referring to the appearance of lasers in the sky.
The beams have no impact on visual observers or imagers

This is absolute nonsense. You do understand photography and how it
works don't you ? If you can see it then it can be photographed.

I say this because I have experimented. And yes, I do understand how
photography and imaging work. They work by integrating light, and GLP
beams aren't much brighter than bright DSOs. A beam passing across an
imaging field will not affect the image.

I found that in order for a GLP to have any effect (as measured by a
reduced S/N) it needs to be located within around 50 feet of the imaging
scope, and maintained on the same target for more than a minute. The
only way this could happen would be for someone to be using a GLP as a
telescope finder- something that I do think should not be allowed at
most star parties.

And before you
bring up the most used defense to this ........ I have seen actual
images that were ruined and they are not pretty. And they were done as
an experiment by Jason Ware to prove this point.

I'll believe it when I see it, along with details of the experiment.
Film is so pathetically low sensitivity I find it hard to believe it
could be affected if CCD images aren't.

Wow .... mag 8.0 skies, no moon, or clouds and zero percent humidity
there in Shangrala eh Chris ? Can I buy the lot next to you and play
with a GLP and see how quickly you change your tune ? laughs

Sure, you are more than welcome. I can tell you that most of the time, I
can't see my GLP from more than 20 feet away (and mine is 12mW, which I
need for classes since you can't see a 5mW beam at all from 10 feet).


But many star parties are
not held at very good sites, and the appearance of green lines in the
sky may detract from the overall experience for some people. That is a
valid reason to place some limitations on GLP usage.

Finally something that makes some sense. Yes. They need to be banned.
Any Star Party worth a damn will do so because to not do so will hurt
attendance.

I didn't say banned. I said they need to have limitations. That means
rules. Things like where on the field they can be used, and when.

And in case you were wondering ? No I don't own one. laughs I can
actually read a star chart and use an 8x50 finder.

Which has nothing to do with the most reasonable use of a GLP- teaching.
There is nothing that comes close to a GLP for that purpose. And IMO,
education is (and should be) a primary function of most star parties.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Wow, trying to be sarcastic and you just sound unbelievably arrogant.


And in case you were wondering ? No I don't own one. laughs I can
actually read a star chart and use an 8x50 finder.


Bill

--

William R. Mattil : http://www.celestial-images.com

For a really blatant use of two green laser pointers, check out this
image:

http://www.ocastronomers.org/astroim...%20Photographs

But I usually only use mine at astronomy outreaches, not at star
parties

Matthew Ota

I feekl so much secure now!


Esmail Bonakdarian wrote:

Sam Wormley wrote:

I use green laser pointer with my community college students most
class nights we are out.

I think they are great tools for showing novices the constellations
and the night sky (different from use for a finder).

None of hand-waving, and "see just there by the tree,above the
power line" type descriptions for pointing out objects.

Should be handled properly, and there should be no worry.

Matthew Ota wrote:
For a really blatant use of two green laser pointers, check out this
image:

http://www.ocastronomers.org/astroim...%20Photographs

But I usually only use mine at astronomy outreaches, not at star
parties

Very illustrative image - thanks. So you had someone "paint" you
first with a laser, and then you pointed at Mars right?

This is correct....

Yermiah wrote:


Sam Wormley wrote:

I use green laser pointer with my community college students most
class nights we are out.

I think they are great tools for showing novices the constellations
and the night sky (different from use for a finder).

None of hand-waving, and "see just there by the tree,above the
power line" type descriptions for pointing out objects.

Should be handled properly, and there should be no worry.

I feekl so much secure now!

It's spelled *fecal*, and what the hell are you talking about?
;-)

Shawn

Where's Del Johnson when you need him?


Jim Wayda wrote:
Do you guys still use green laser pointers? I have been paranoid ever since
some idiot got arrested several years ago for pointing a laser pointer at a
plane...