Faster than Light Motion?

On Sep 30, 5:24*pm, Double-A wrote:
On Sep 30, 1:47*pm, Painius wrote:





On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06*pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." *Biretta

What gives? *Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed..

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. *Try to find an
explanation for it. *Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. *Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. *So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Double-A- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

On Oct 1, 3:53*am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24*pm, Double-A wrote:









On Sep 30, 1:47*pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06*pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." *Biretta

What gives? *Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds..
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams.. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light..

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. *Try to find an
explanation for it. *Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. *Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. *So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Double-A- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are *the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c *TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth,Brad_Guth,Brad.Guth,BradGuth,BG,Guth Usenet/”Guth Venus”

On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth
wrote:

On Oct 1, 3:53*am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24*pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47*pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06*pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." *Biretta

What gives? *Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. *Try to find an
explanation for it. *Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. *Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. *So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are *the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c *TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @ http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Love almost everything; you can only learn to love by loving."

On Oct 1, 8:07*am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth









wrote:
On Oct 1, 3:53 am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24 pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47 pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06 pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." Biretta

What gives? Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. Try to find an
explanation for it. Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. *The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Love almost everything; you can only learn to love by loving."

Yes, the CBB(continuous big bang) or the GO(great ongoing) as a flow
or godly flatulence of aether (aka dark/clear matter) pushing
everything along, can be discussed or ranted back and forth forever...

However, once our galaxy gets nailed by the Andromeda galaxy (for a
good hundred million year worth of cosmic trauma), we many not have to
ponder the ultimate price of our galaxy entering the GA along with
thousands of other galaxies closing in at 1500 km/sec.

http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth,Brad_Guth,Brad.Guth,BradGuth,BG,Guth Usenet/”Guth Venus”

On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth
wrote:

On Oct 1, 8:07*am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth

wrote:
On Oct 1, 3:53 am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24 pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47 pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06 pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." Biretta

What gives? Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. Try to find an
explanation for it. Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. *The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

Yes, the CBB(continuous big bang) or the GO(great ongoing) as a flow
or godly flatulence of aether (aka dark/clear matter) pushing
everything along, can be discussed or ranted back and forth forever...

However, once our galaxy gets nailed by the Andromeda galaxy (for a
good hundred million year worth of cosmic trauma), we many not have to
ponder the ultimate price of our galaxy entering the GA along with
thousands of other galaxies closing in at 1500 km/sec.

Has there been any news on the lateral velocity of Andromeda, yet? I
haven't seen any. And it was premature of scientists to say
definitively that our galaxy will collide with Andromeda at *any* time
in the future, primarily and ONLY based upon its radial velocity. It's
the dream of a drama queen. Andromeda's lateral speed may very well
be high enough to ensure that there will be no collision, maybe not
even a close flyby of the two galaxies.

Merely a few astronomers trying to justify their research. What a
hoot!

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @ http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Love almost everything; you can only learn to love by loving."

On Oct 1, 2:07*pm, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth





wrote:
On Oct 1, 8:07 am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth

wrote:
On Oct 1, 3:53 am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24 pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47 pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06 pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." Biretta

What gives? Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. Try to find an
explanation for it. Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

Yes, the CBB(continuous big bang) or the GO(great ongoing) as a flow
or godly flatulence of aether (aka dark/clear matter) pushing
everything along, can be discussed or ranted back and forth forever...

However, once our galaxy gets nailed by the Andromeda galaxy (for a
good hundred million year worth of cosmic trauma), we many not have to
ponder the ultimate price of our galaxy entering the GA along with
thousands of other galaxies closing in at 1500 km/sec.

Has there been any news on the lateral velocity of Andromeda, yet? *I
haven't seen any. *And it was premature of scientists to say
definitively that our galaxy will collide with Andromeda at *any* time
in the future, primarily and ONLY based upon its radial velocity. It's
the dream of a drama queen. *Andromeda's lateral speed may very well
be high enough to ensure that there will be no collision, maybe not
even a close flyby of the two galaxies.

Merely a few astronomers trying to justify their research. *What a
hoot!

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Love almost everything; you can only learn to love by loving."- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Painius Milky Way might end up like the nCartwheel galaxy It would a
big diffeence how they hit. Galaxies become elliptical after a
collision. That means spirals came first. TeBet

On Oct 1, 11:07*am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth









wrote:
On Oct 1, 8:07 am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth

wrote:
On Oct 1, 3:53 am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24 pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47 pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06 pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." Biretta

What gives? Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. Try to find an
explanation for it. Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

Yes, the CBB(continuous big bang) or the GO(great ongoing) as a flow
or godly flatulence of aether (aka dark/clear matter) pushing
everything along, can be discussed or ranted back and forth forever...

However, once our galaxy gets nailed by the Andromeda galaxy (for a
good hundred million year worth of cosmic trauma), we many not have to
ponder the ultimate price of our galaxy entering the GA along with
thousands of other galaxies closing in at 1500 km/sec.

Has there been any news on the lateral velocity of Andromeda, yet? *I
haven't seen any. *And it was premature of scientists to say
definitively that our galaxy will collide with Andromeda at *any* time
in the future, primarily and ONLY based upon its radial velocity. It's
the dream of a drama queen. *Andromeda's lateral speed may very well
be high enough to ensure that there will be no collision, maybe not
even a close flyby of the two galaxies.

Merely a few astronomers trying to justify their research. *What a
hoot!

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Love almost everything; you can only learn to love by loving."

Galaxies only need to get within 2r of one another in order to do
serious gravitational morphing damage. Obviously anything under 1r is
going to become downright spectacular.

http://www.caltech.edu/article/12703
"Andromeda Galaxy Three Times Bigger in Diameter Than Previously
Thought"

Most likely by now its diameter is estimated as 4 times larger than
previously thought, and you can bet our own galactic diameter estimate
has at least doubled, not to mention each bubble of extremely hot gas
that goes way the hell further out. So, perhaps we'd have to miss by
at least 6r if we're stuck with using those old mainstream status-quo
size estimates.

http://groups.google.com/groups/search
http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth,Brad_Guth,Brad.Guth,BradGuth,BG,Guth Usenet/”Guth Venus”

JEBUS IS A TOTAL JOKE!

LIVE WITH IT!

FTL REMAINS TOTAL BULL****!

Saul Levy


On Tue, 2 Oct 2012 07:23:17 -0700 (PDT), nartrof seven
wrote:

What's so "green" about using non-free energy, when our species
attains the kind of wisdom that can only avert total annhiliation of
itself in less than 100 years? There's absolutely NOTHING USEFUL OR
UNIQUE about limiting non-free energy, especially if non-free energy
is used to destroy life through things like the kind of warfare being
used today, and in order to "herd" all of the nations on the earth
into depopulation centers, under the lordship of some ruthless money-
men.

The right kind of wisdom being referred to here is defined as the
inherent ability to use knowledge and technology with the least damage
to ones surroundings, or one's infrastructure. American scientists
like Tesla already knew this, at the turn of the *last* century.
Orwellian-style, technotronic technocracy's "National Cyber Security
Awareness Month's" "Business Summit" and "Releases of Online Survey"
are just another false flag rollout of crony capitalism, as government
maliciously intends again to pose as SAVIOR, tracking and licensing
online behavior at the inevitable increase of cost to the consumer,
and all this following a conveniently timed, Chinese traced HACK on
the White House. Mega corporations like Google, Microsoft, Cisco, and
Oracle are now part of the conspiracy to oppress informed,
Constitutionalized citizenry.

Reinventing electronic/internet communication at the expense of the
present international banking system, will have to incur a DISCONNECT
from our present technology, to a new technology that liberates free
speech on a much wider scale - a scale that has ever been accomplished
in the history of the human civilization.

Here is a schematic of what a gravity-wave transmitter looks like:

http://imageshack.us/a/img23/7461/gtransmit.jpg

...and the gravity wave reciever:

http://imageshack.us/a/img405/6695/greceiver.jpg

There also arises with the attempted control of our communications
grid, an energy conspiracy establishment, preventing effective, free
energy from the public - AS LONG AS CERTAIN HUMANS REMAIN IN PRINCIPLE
POSITIONS OF POWER, OVER THE PLANET, i.e:

"For wee wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against
principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darknes of
this world, against spirituall wickednes in high places." (Ephesians
6:12, 1611 KJV)

CHRIST IS THE POWER, NOT HE WORLD "POWERS":

"Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
according to the prince of the power of the aire, the spirit that now
worketh in the children of disobedience, Among whom also we all had
our conuersation in times past, in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling
the desires of the flesh, and of the minde, and were by nature the
children of wrath, euen as others" (Ephesians 2:2,3, 1611 KJV)

"Euen when wee were dead in sinnes, hath quickned vs together with
Christ, (by grace ye are saued) And hath raised vs vp together, and
made vs sit together in heauenly places in Christ Iesus: That in the
ages to come, hee might shew the exceeding riches of his grace, in his
kindenesse towards vs, through Christ Iesus." (Ephesians 2:5-7, 1611
KJV)

Many of the Political members of the U.S.A. nation, are heavily
invested in the petroleum industry and related fields. Some, it seems,
will stop at nothing to acheive their total domination of the planet -
and some are in more of a hurry to do this than others. Ones at the
top of the corporate ladder are more involved than the ones lower
down. Try Enron times 1000. The entire energy industry is being forced
by fiat (no silver-certificated OIL DOLLARS!), to repeat the past of
their presently invalidating peership - the perpetrators of FIAT
CAPITAL - THE FED.

I believe that the ones who are in a hurry to do this are have become
threatened by better technology than they can presently control, with
antiquated technology they have already mastered to the n'th degree,
so they are being perceived as the evil threat to mankind, when the
problem actually belongs to those who are perpetrating our forced
systems of fiat, worldwide.

The only ingredient that would be usefully forthcoming from free
energy, would be the FTL technology, that would change the nature of
the planet's end game, meaning that if a new earth is discovered, and
begins to become inhabited, then the new earth will undoubtedly become
much more attractive to the brave pioneers who wish to settle there,
rather than having what's left of their old one being left behind, to
wither in its own chaos, pollution, and radiation sickness. Many of
the nation's original inhabitants have already become keenly aware of
what is happening to mother earth, to a large degree:

http://m2bulls.com/images/editoon/env052402w.jpg
http://m2bulls.com/images/editoon/env032505w.jpg

A new race of explorers will bring with them lessons of earth
antiquity, so as to have "...sprang there even of one, and him as good
as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand
which is by the sea shore innumerable." (Hebrews 11:12).

Free, unlimited energy is the key for making FTL possible.

If virtually free energy were made widely available to the public,
petroleum related investors would go bankrupt, hence the 'oily wars'
conspiracy. But entrepreneurs should not have to feel stupid for even
trying to help out humanity. The public should know about these
things, yet the crooks and scum of high finance have made it a
business of being technologically deceptive, and the usual order of
business seems to involve forcing companies into bankruptcy, so that
corporate raiders can take bribes from foreign interest group
lobbyists, all the while Americans are losing their livelihoods.
Global competition has become a scam to sell industries to the lowest
of the high-dollar bidders - the rich - at the expense of middle
classes ALL OVER THE WORLD.

The conspiracy ends up being framed like it was "for the people", but
all in the name of having oily wars, and doing this at the expense of
dumbing down, bankrupting, and forcing into exile any technology (and
persons) that get in the way of making a profit for those who can
continue to loan the fiat currency to their most willing accomplices -
those who have become WELFARE DEPENDENT, and involved with the
RETROGRADE ECONOMIC PARALYSIS, A PARALYSIS that so easily describes a
modern economic superpower, in a vastly vulcanized, malintentioned
state of disrepair.

Scientific revolutions of the kind that made the economy what it is
today, are no use repeating, because they were accomplished in the
spirit of scientific compromise, at the funder's expense. Human
potential became locked out of the APPLICATION part of scientific
practice, and IMO Americans saw mentorship in industry lose its focus
(at the higher levels) to widgets/hour, rather than REVOLUTIONIZING
THE WIDGET. Sure, competition breeds contempt, and this is where
design, efficiency, and usefulness reign supreme, but how much
competition has there ever been for the ability to advertise against
world-wide, monopolistic power?

Free energy will always be the key for obtaining FTL propulsion, on a
large scale. Of course NASA and other mainstream media would REJECT
this... and if they accept it, it will expose the fraud of 'aliens'
being perpetrated planet wide, which would today seem about as
botched, as all of the world's military industrial complexes have
already become, in the sense that masses of humans can be manipulated
in such a way as to serve their masters unwittingly by ultra-
conventional means, while saucer technology remains, for a nation like
Sparta, and according to their vision, for the entire world,
unattainable, ad infinitum.

Many secretly funded projects probably already have known about this
technology since before Roswell, but many or all are strangely lacking
in their own armed saucers for air strikes, or even air-to-air combat.
This is really strange stuff, because any living group of beings that
are willing enough to take up this mantle of progress, better heed the
warnings of some of humankind's progenitors - those humans who escaped
the flood (Noah). Does anyone actually remember that there were wars
between Almighty YHWH and the fallen angels, that used saucer (Vimana)
technology?

The BIBLE even gives us fair warning: "And except those days should be
shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake
those days shall be shortened." (Matthew 24:22 - the words of Christ)

THE ****ING VILLAGE IDIOT HAS SPOKEN YET AGAIN!

IDIOT!

Saul Levy


On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 11:49:20 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth
wrote:

Most likely by now its diameter is estimated as 4 times larger than
previously thought, and you can bet our own galactic diameter estimate
has at least doubled, not to mention each bubble of extremely hot gas
that goes way the hell further out. So, perhaps we'd have to miss by
at least 6r if we're stuck with using those old mainstream status-quo
size estimates.

Brad Guth, YES, I AM A VILLAGE IDIOT!

On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 11:19:52 -0700 (PDT), "G=EMC^2"
wrote:

On Oct 1, 2:07*pm, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 10:13:18 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth

wrote:
On Oct 1, 8:07 am, Painius wrote:
On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 05:55:08 -0700 (PDT), Brad Guth

wrote:
On Oct 1, 3:53 am, "G=EMC^2" wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:24 pm, Double-A wrote:

On Sep 30, 1:47 pm, Painius wrote:

On Sun, 30 Sep 2012 12:58:19 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
On Sep 30, 12:06 pm, Painius wrote:
On Fri, 28 Sep 2012 12:19:22 -0700 (PDT), Double-A

wrote:
Astronomers have been observing faster than light phenomena for a long
time now.

``We see almost a dozen clouds which appear to be moving out from the
galaxy's center at between four and six times the speed of light.
These are all located in a narrow jet of gas streaming out from the
region of the black hole at the galaxy's center," said Dr. John
Biretta
of the Space Telescope Science Institute.

But then they have to always try to explain them away.

``We believe this apparent speed translates into an actual velocity
just slightly below that of light
itself." Biretta

What gives? Are things really moving faster than light?

http://www.stsci.edu/ftp/science/m87/press.txt

No, Double-A, this is just the *appearance* of superluminal speeds.
Only space itself can move (expand, contract) faster than lightspeed.

It's also possible that the jets are the movement of spatial foams. In
that case, it would be possible for them to move faster than light.

Yes, Paine, maybe it's space itself that's going faster than light,
and the matter imbedded in it is along for the ride. Try to find an
explanation for it. Don't just try to explain every FTL observation
away.

Double-A

You know that I'm not big on the presently expanding space idea, but I
do think it's not implausible that space *can* expand and contract,
and that space can do so at FTL velocities. Scientists presently
accept that, on the large scale, space expands and the galaxies in it
are along for the ride. So it should not be too much of a stretch to
accept that the smaller-scale jets are spewings of spatial "material"
that go FTL, and that the matter within it is along for the ride.

I think this is expecially lkkely to happen in the vicinity of black
holes.

Motion and gravity two sides to the same coin. Inertia and gravity
are the same. Einstein discribed all in the universe going at c TeBet

? in every which direction at the same time ?

Most of everything within several million light year radius is headed
into the Great Attractor at less than 250 million ly from us, and
that's an ongoing from all directions that'll merge galaxies at
roughly 1400 km/sec. The extremely nearby(2.5e6 ly) Andromeda galaxy
is in a bigger hurry, because it's going to rear-end us at 300+ km/sec
(that's called a blueshift or negative redshift) long before our turn
at entering the GA.

Perhaps the GA is simply a wormhole, or just the ultimate gravity lens
where everything gets recombined into a cosmic black hole as a do-
over.

Again, just a gentle reminder of oc's idea of a Continuous Big Bang
(actually, oc maintained that it was Gordon Wolter's idea - oc was
just posting it for the archives and for posterity)...

http://wolter.painellsworth.net/

Close analysis of those pages may reveal the true nature of the GA.

Yes, the CBB(continuous big bang) or the GO(great ongoing) as a flow
or godly flatulence of aether (aka dark/clear matter) pushing
everything along, can be discussed or ranted back and forth forever...

However, once our galaxy gets nailed by the Andromeda galaxy (for a
good hundred million year worth of cosmic trauma), we many not have to
ponder the ultimate price of our galaxy entering the GA along with
thousands of other galaxies closing in at 1500 km/sec.

Has there been any news on the lateral velocity of Andromeda, yet? *I
haven't seen any. *And it was premature of scientists to say
definitively that our galaxy will collide with Andromeda at *any* time
in the future, primarily and ONLY based upon its radial velocity. It's
the dream of a drama queen. *Andromeda's lateral speed may very well
be high enough to ensure that there will be no collision, maybe not
even a close flyby of the two galaxies.

Merely a few astronomers trying to justify their research. *What a
hoot!

Painius Milky Way might end up like the nCartwheel galaxy It would a
big diffeence how they hit. Galaxies become elliptical after a
collision. That means spirals came first. TeBet

Yes, Bert, the Milky Way just might end up like the Cartwheel...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartwheel_Galaxy

However, the chances are, well, unlikely that we will collide with the
galaxy in Andromeda. Think about it...

For many years, astronomers have stated that Andromeda will collide
with the Milky Way BASED ONLY UPON ANDROMEDA'S RELATIVE RADIAL
VELOCITY!

Andromeda is so far away that we are having a lot of trouble
determining Andromeda's LATERAL (side-to-side) velocity. If Andromeda
has a lateral velocity that is equal to its radial velocity, then
Andromeda is traveling toward us, but at a 45 degree angle relative to
us, and 5 billion years from now it will be very far away when it
passes us. In this case, there will be absolutely no measurable
interaction between the Milky Way and Andromeda.

It is easy to see that if Andromeda's lateral velocity is zero, then
it is heading straight for us, but if the lateral speed is many times
its radial velocity, it could be traveling at almost a 90 degree angle
relative to us. This means that there are a near-infinite number of
paths in a near-infinite number of directions that Andromeda could be
headed. Nothing definitive can be concluded based upon the galaxy's
radial velocity alone.

So Bert, Andromeda's "blue shift", which only means that it is not
headed away from us in any direction, but instead it's headed IN OUR
GENERAL DIRECTION, is not enough for us to conclude that there will be
a collision, or even a near fly-by in 5 billion years. We MUST learn
what Andromeda's LATERAL velocity is before we can make that
determination with any accuracy.

--
Indelibly yours,
Paine @ http://astronomy.painellsworth.net/
"Home is where, when you go there, they have to let you in."