Antarctica Ice Gaining Mass

On Jul 18, 11:34 pm, wrote:

"0.5°C in the last 50 yr" is well within standard deviation. In
Greenland, for example, it was lush with plant and insects just 500,000
years ago:

First, Nature doesn't care about standard deviation, and seond the
issue is Antarctica today, not Greenland 500k years ago.

"Living in the trees and on the forest floor was a wide variety of
insect life including beetles, flies, spiders, butterflies and moths."

Why didn't you start this with "Once upon a time ..."?

"They found the temperature varied widely, by as much as 15 C (27 F)
over the 800,000 years"

One of the most common errors in the AGW issue is compression Any
attempt to claim a 15dC rise or fall over 800k years is anything
other than stability ... is guilty. If you want to refer to those
swings in narrower timespans, please do so.

See http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/news.php?extend.18

So no I don't think there is any problem at all.

Whatever that site is, if that's your homebase, we just found problem
#1 - you're not doing real homework.

On Aug 10, 4:42 am, owl wrote:
On Jul 18, 11:34 pm, wrote:

"0.5°C in the last 50 yr" is well within standard deviation. In
Greenland, for example, it was lush with plant and insects just 500,000
years ago:

First, Nature doesn't care about standard deviation, and seond the
issue is Antarctica today, not Greenland 500k years ago.

Second, standard deviation was only developed
for math and computers, rather than cranks like physicists.
Which is the only reason that Antartica is not the
Moon.




"Living in the trees and on the forest floor was a wide variety of
insect life including beetles, flies, spiders, butterflies and moths."

Why didn't you start this with "Once upon a time ..."?

"They found the temperature varied widely, by as much as 15 C (27 F)
over the 800,000 years"

One of the most common errors in the AGW issue is compression Any
attempt to claim a 15dC rise or fall over 800k years is anything
other than stability ... is guilty. If you want to refer to those
swings in narrower timespans, please do so.

Seehttp://www.globalwarminghoax.com/news.php?extend.18

So no I don't think there is any problem at all.

Whatever that site is, if that's your homebase, we just found problem
#1 - you're not doing real homework.

On Wed, 18 Jul 2007 10:45:32 -0500, "Server 13"
wrote:

wrote in message
. ..

From World Climate Report
http://www.worldclimatereport.com/in...lobal-warming-
debate-upside-down-antarctic-update/

----Is Antarctica warming and melting away? If you consult the latest
report of the United Nations=3F Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
(IPCC), you would find statements on the subject in the summary
including =3FAntarctic sea ice extent continues to show inter-annual
variability and localized changes but no statistically significant
average trends, consistent with the lack of warming reflected in
atmospheric temperatures averaged across the region=3F and =3FCurrent
global
model studies project that the Antarctic ice sheet will remain too cold
for widespread surface melting and is expected to gain in mass due to
increased snowfall.=3F Amazing =3F one would never suspect such
conclusions
given a cover story in National Geographic titled =3FTHE BIG THAW.=3F ----

You omitted the following. Why?

"Significant climate changes observed in the Antarctic include the increase
in surface air temperature (SAT). SAT over the Antarctic as a whole has
increased by 0.5°C in the last 50 yr, which appears to be part of a global
SAT warming trend in recent years."

There's a trick to this ...

Antarctica is BIG. It has a lot of inland area. While
the overall SAT may increase, causing a loss of ice
around the edges, the inland areas will STILL remain
extremely cold. A few degrees change in the global SAT
won't make the interior warm enough to cause ice melting.
If anything, the water vapor increase at the coast may
simply fuel thicker deposits inland, once the air moves
in and cools.

This is similar to what's been seen in Greenland - some
melting at the edges but slight thickening further inland.
Expect antarctica to eventually look similar to Greenland,
with a thin ice-free belt along the entire seacoast, maybe
even proper vegetation, with a HUGE lump of ice beyond.

The arctic OCEAN ice, floating as it is, is much more
vulnerable to increases in the SAT and ocean temperature.
"Warmer" water will infiltrate below, "warmer" winds
play above. Ice disappears.

If the GW hypothesis is even half right, expect the
majority of summertime arctic sea ice to totally
vanish within 25-50 years, barring some unforseen
climatic event. Of course this "warm" sea will put
more water vapor into the air - some of which will
find its way to still-frigid inland Greenland where
it will thicken the glacier.

The loss of the thermal buffering provided by arctic
sea ice and the increased water vapor in the area is
bound to have exotic effects on north american climate.
What they will be, exactly, seems beyond the trustworthy
reach of modeling programs. It's the "butterfly effect",
but with a huge swarm of butterflies involved. About
all we can say is that SOMETHING will happen - so maybe
the farmers should be prepared to pick up stakes and
move on comparatively short notice.

There's a trick to this ...

Antarctica is BIG. It has a lot of inland area. While
the overall SAT may increase, causing a loss of ice
around the edges, the inland areas will STILL remain
extremely cold. A few degrees change in the global SAT
won't make the interior warm enough to cause ice melting.
If anything, the water vapor increase at the coast may
simply fuel thicker deposits inland, once the air moves
in and cools.

This is similar to what's been seen in Greenland - some
melting at the edges but slight thickening further inland.
Expect antarctica to eventually look similar to Greenland,
with a thin ice-free belt along the entire seacoast, maybe
even proper vegetation, with a HUGE lump of ice beyond.

The arctic OCEAN ice, floating as it is, is much more
vulnerable to increases in the SAT and ocean temperature.
"Warmer" water will infiltrate below, "warmer" winds
play above. Ice disappears.

If the GW hypothesis is even half right, expect the
majority of summertime arctic sea ice to totally
vanish within 25-50 years, barring some unforseen
climatic event. Of course this "warm" sea will put
more water vapor into the air - some of which will
find its way to still-frigid inland Greenland where
it will thicken the glacier.

The loss of the thermal buffering provided by arctic
sea ice and the increased water vapor in the area is
bound to have exotic effects on north american climate.
What they will be, exactly, seems beyond the trustworthy
reach of modeling programs. It's the "butterfly effect",
but with a huge swarm of butterflies involved. About
all we can say is that SOMETHING will happen - so maybe
the farmers should be prepared to pick up stakes and
move on comparatively short notice.

Very well stated. Thank you.

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.g...g/topics?hl=en

Server 13 wrote:

"Significant climate changes observed in the Antarctic include the increase
in surface air temperature (SAT). SAT over the Antarctic as a whole has
increased by 0.5°C in the last 50 yr

So ?

Precipitation tends to follow that trend which results in more ice.

Graham

On Jul 18, 8:45 am, "Server 13" wrote:
"Significant climate changes observed in the Antarctic include the increase
in surface air temperature (SAT). SAT over the Antarctic as a whole has
increased by 0.5°C in the last 50 yr, which appears to be part of a global
SAT warming trend in recent years."

This is a lie. Check the antarctic station temperature charts. Few
located on antarctic peninsula, and few on the coast show some
warming. None of the located in the antarctic interior indicate any
warming at all.

On Jul 18, 11:45 am, "Server 13" wrote:
wrote in message

.. .







From World Climate Report
http://www.worldclimatereport.com/in...lobal-warming-
debate-upside-down-antarctic-update/

----Is Antarctica warming and melting away? If you consult the latest
report of the United Nations=3F Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change
(IPCC), you would find statements on the subject in the summary
including =3FAntarctic seaiceextent continues to show inter-annual
variability and localized changes but no statistically significant
average trends, consistent with the lack of warming reflected in
atmospheric temperatures averaged across the region=3F and =3FCurrent
global
model studies project that the Antarcticicesheet will remain too cold
for widespread surface melting and is expected to gain in mass due to
increased snowfall.=3F Amazing =3F one would never suspect such
conclusions
given a cover story in National Geographic titled =3FTHE BIG THAW.=3F ----

You omitted the following. Why?

"Significant climate changes observed in the Antarctic include the increase
in surface air temperature (SAT). SAT over the Antarctic as a whole has
increased by 0.5°C in the last 50 yr, which appears to be part of a global
SAT warming trend in recent years." Further, we learn that "Except for some
areas of the Atlantic and Indian sectors where SAT has decreased, a
significant increase in SAT has occurred in most of the Southern Ocean
according to the reanalysis data. Since 1979 the increase in SAT is 0.027°C
yr-1 over theice-covered areas of the Southern Ocean. In conjunction with
an increase in SAT is an increase in the NCEP-NCAR reanalysis surface
downward longwave radiation (SDLR) and precipitation." According to the data
analyzed by Zhang, Antarctica has warmed, precipitation has increased, and
the downward longwave (infrared) energy has increased ."



Amazing considering considering climatehotmap.org/antarctica.html
continues to state that Antarctica is melting away "Warming 5 times
global average" and that the "LarsenAiceshelfdisintegrated"!! What a
joke. If they can't even figure out what is happening under their noses
how can they predict what will happen tomorroww?

Antartica can't melt away. Since for one thing,
it's only a collection of glaciers in the minds of severely
braindead idgits.




Since that appears to be what's happening, it's hard to get what your
problem is.



Found using research at Global Warming Hoax
http://www.GlobalWarmingHoax.com

OOPS - there's your problem. roflmao- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

wrote
Antartica can't melt away. Since for one thing,
it's only a collection of glaciers in the minds of severely braindead
idgits.


Antarctic Glaciers Melting Faster -Study
----------------------------------------
- Reuters - 09/21/2004 21:54


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Glaciers once held up by a
floating ice shelf off Antarctica are now sliding off
into the sea -- and they are going fast, scientists said
on Tuesday.

Two separate studies from climate researchers and the
space agency NASA show the glaciers are flowing into
Antarctica's Weddell Sea, freed by the 2002 breakup of
the Larsen B ice shelf.

Writing in the journal Geophysical Research Letters, the
researchers said their satellite measurements suggest
climate warming can lead to rapid sea level rise.

The teams at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in
Pasadena, California, the National Snow and Ice Data
Center at the University of Colorado in Boulder, and
NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt,
Maryland, said the findings also prove that ice shelves
hold back glaciers.


Many teams of researchers are keeping a close eye on
parts of Antarctica that are steadily melting.


Large ice shelves in the Antarctic Peninsula
disintegrated in 1995 and 2002 as a result of climate
warming. But these floating ice shelves did not affect
sea level as they melted.


Glaciers, however, are another story. They rest on land
and when they slide off into the water they instantly
affect sea level.


It was not clear how the loss of the Larsen B ice shelf
would affect nearby glaciers.


But soon after its collapse, researchers saw nearby
glaciers flowing up to eight times faster than before.


"If anyone was waiting to find out whether Antarctica
would respond quickly to climate warming, I think the
answer is yes," said Theodore Scambos, a University of
Colorado glacier expert who worked on one study.


"We've seen 150 miles of coastline change drastically in
just 15 years."


The affected area is at the far northern tip of the
Antarctic, just south of Chile and Argentina.
Temperatures there have risen by up to 4.5 degrees
Fahrenheit (2.5 degrees C) in the past 60 years --
faster than almost any region in the world.


In the past 30 years, ice shelves in the region have
lost more than 5,200 square miles of area.


"The Larsen area can be looked at as a miniature
experiment, showing how warming can dramatically change
the ice sheets, and how fast it can happen," Scambos
said in a statement. "At every step in the process,
things have occurred more rapidly than we expected."


But not all the melting in the Antarctic can be seen as
a "miniature experiment."


The Ross ice shelf, for example, is the main outlet for
the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, with several large
glaciers that could, if they melted completely, raise
sea levels by 16 feet.


"While the consequences of this area are small compared
to other parts of the Antarctic, it is a harbinger of
what will happen when the large ice sheets begin to
warm," Scambos said. "The much larger ice shelves in
other parts of Antarctica could have much greater
effects on the rate of sea level rise."

ExterminateAllRepubliKKKans wrote:
wrote
Antartica can't melt away. Since for one thing,
it's only a collection of glaciers in the minds of severely braindead
idgits.


Antarctic Glaciers Melting Faster -Study
----------------------------------------
- Reuters - 09/21/2004 21:54


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Glaciers once held up by a
floating ice shelf off Antarctica are now sliding off
into the sea -- and they are going fast, scientists said
on Tuesday.

Two separate studies from climate researchers and the
space agency NASA show the glaciers are flowing into
Antarctica's Weddell Sea, freed by the 2002 breakup of
the Larsen B ice shelf.


A few Co2ppm difference and the globe is at risk, if life is so tender,
we're dinosaurs.

--
http://OutSourcedNews.com
Our constitution protects aliens, drunks and U.S. Senators. Which at
times are, one and the same...

The problem with the global warming theory, is that a theory is like a
bowl of ice-cream, it only takes a little dab of bull**** to ruin the
whole thing. - Gump That -

"Talk-n-Dog" wrote
A few Co2ppm difference and the globe is at risk,

A 100% change is rather significant. If you doubt this, then I challenge
you to double your weight.