the refractor craze??

Now getting back into the astro hobby after a few years recess, I've noticed
a trend towards refractors. I visited a local SP a few weeks ago and I'll
bet close to 70% of the scopes there were refractors. I'm curious as to
what's caused this trend or shift as when I was active in the past, close to
15 years ago, the "light bucket" Dobsonian seemed to be the favorite at star
parties. How does a refractor, which I seldom see in apertures greater
than 100mm due to expense, compare with a light bucket Dob or reflector? It
certainly can't be DSO's as an 18" Dob would win that battle hands down. I
would also think that the larger reflector would be the winner for planets
too, especially if it has a good mirror. So, what is the appeal?
Portability, but what else? There must be something I'm missing regarding
their appeal especially when you compare the cost per aperture differences
between refractors and other scopes.

Thanks,
Juan

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 16:31:08 GMT, "Juan Calculus" wrote:

Now getting back into the astro hobby after a few years recess, I've noticed
a trend towards refractors. I visited a local SP a few weeks ago and I'll
bet close to 70% of the scopes there were refractors. I'm curious as to
what's caused this trend or shift as when I was active in the past, close to
15 years ago, the "light bucket" Dobsonian seemed to be the favorite at star
parties. How does a refractor, which I seldom see in apertures greater
than 100mm due to expense, compare with a light bucket Dob or reflector? It
certainly can't be DSO's as an 18" Dob would win that battle hands down. I
would also think that the larger reflector would be the winner for planets
too, especially if it has a good mirror. So, what is the appeal?
Portability, but what else? There must be something I'm missing regarding
their appeal especially when you compare the cost per aperture differences
between refractors and other scopes.

I don't know if there is a real craze, a marketing craze, or no craze at all.
But I do know that if you go to a star party, not one telescope in 20 is a
refractor. People who actually use telescopes visually know what makes sense.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

I don't think there is a craze going on. I think people are choosing the
right teleswcope for the right job. Most amatuers that I know prefer
20cm SCT's as their primary scope, larger Dobs are a distant 2nd. The
refractors are being bought often as travel scopes because they can be
easily carrier on airplanes. Also in the last 15 years there has been
major improvements in refractor designs.

Terry


On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 16:31:08 +0000, Juan Calculus wrote:

Now getting back into the astro hobby after a few years recess, I've noticed
a trend towards refractors. I visited a local SP a few weeks ago and I'll
bet close to 70% of the scopes there were refractors. I'm curious as to
what's caused this trend or shift as when I was active in the past, close to
15 years ago, the "light bucket" Dobsonian seemed to be the favorite at star
parties. How does a refractor, which I seldom see in apertures greater
than 100mm due to expense, compare with a light bucket Dob or reflector? It
certainly can't be DSO's as an 18" Dob would win that battle hands down. I
would also think that the larger reflector would be the winner for planets
too, especially if it has a good mirror. So, what is the appeal?
Portability, but what else? There must be something I'm missing regarding
their appeal especially when you compare the cost per aperture differences
between refractors and other scopes.

Thanks,
Juan

So, what is the appeal?

Portability, super quality image, minimum cool down time, contrast,
splitting and measuring double-stars refractor is the best, large aperture
scope more sensitive for atmospheric disturbances, refractor has the largest
field of view for visual or photo purposes etc...
Primarily for CCD photography, since the advance in technology and
affordability of CCD's, you don't need a large aperture telescope, which
require heavy large mount, to take excelent images of DSO's..

Julius

"Juan Calculus" wrote in message
ink.net...
Now getting back into the astro hobby after a few years recess, I've
noticed
a trend towards refractors. I visited a local SP a few weeks ago and I'll
bet close to 70% of the scopes there were refractors. I'm curious as to
what's caused this trend or shift as when I was active in the past, close
to
15 years ago, the "light bucket" Dobsonian seemed to be the favorite at
star
parties. How does a refractor, which I seldom see in apertures greater
than 100mm due to expense, compare with a light bucket Dob or reflector?
It
certainly can't be DSO's as an 18" Dob would win that battle hands down.
I
would also think that the larger reflector would be the winner for planets
too, especially if it has a good mirror. So, what is the appeal?
Portability, but what else? There must be something I'm missing regarding
their appeal especially when you compare the cost per aperture differences
between refractors and other scopes.

Thanks,
Juan

"Juan Calculus" wrote:

Now getting back into the astro hobby after a few years recess, I've noticed
a trend towards refractors. I visited a local SP a few weeks ago and I'll
bet close to 70% of the scopes there were refractors.

Was this local star party a one night thing, like a club observing
evening? If it was just for the evening it may be that people couldn't
be bothered to transport and set up their larger scopes for the
evening.


Tim
--
Foo.

I don't know if there is a real craze, a marketing craze, or no craze at all.
But I do know that if you go to a star party, not one telescope in 20 is a
refractor. People who actually use telescopes visually know what makes sense.

A lot of people use them for imaging, which you are not going to see at star
parties. It is hard to do with normal Dobs. People who buy high end apos know
exactly why they do so.

Roland Christen

On 20 Nov 2004 19:11:00 GMT, (Chris1011) wrote:

I don't know if there is a real craze, a marketing craze, or no craze at all.
But I do know that if you go to a star party, not one telescope in 20 is a
refractor. People who actually use telescopes visually know what makes sense.

A lot of people use them for imaging, which you are not going to see at star
parties. It is hard to do with normal Dobs. People who buy high end apos know
exactly why they do so.

Yup. That's why I used the term "visually", and referred to star parties. In my
book, a refractor has two primary uses- imaging, and visual for travel or rapid
setup (typically, casual use).

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

As others mention, there are some advantages to smaller refractors, and
also to the larger 6" plus refractors, mainly critical planetary
observation.

Sad thing is, there are other designs, specifically compound designs
(MN's MCT's SCT's) which also could be capable of first class
performance, but ultra high quality examples of these scopes I mention
just aren't all that commom at run of the mill star parties.

I think one would certainly be very impressed with an ultra high quality
SCT design, (In which there are a few sophisticated variants) with hand
figured optics to 1/10 wave system, and first class mechanics. I'm sure
many would cringe at the thought of a $5K-$7K 8" SCT though.

Would be nice though to see a company, or two arise in the future, who
could re-work off the shelf commercial SCT Optics for a reasonable cost.
Guess we can dream, can't we? :-) Mark

In article ,
Chris L Peterson wrote:

On 20 Nov 2004 19:11:00 GMT, (Chris1011) wrote:

I don't know if there is a real craze, a marketing craze, or no craze at
all.
But I do know that if you go to a star party, not one telescope in 20 is a
refractor. People who actually use telescopes visually know what makes
sense.

A lot of people use them for imaging, which you are not going to see at star
parties. It is hard to do with normal Dobs. People who buy high end apos
know
exactly why they do so.

Yup. That's why I used the term "visually", and referred to star parties. In
my
book, a refractor has two primary uses- imaging, and visual for travel or
rapid
setup (typically, casual use).

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Roland's right, you're wrong.

Refractors are a better instrument for their size than newts or dobs.
they're better for photography, deployment, contrast, and ease of use.

Big dobs/newts are a drag to move around, the tracking is cumbersome,
and they require ladders/stools/etc to have on hand to cover the zenith,
or anywhere near it.

Refractor images are excellent, they are portable, they are outstanding
visually AND photographically.

In a nutshell, the refractor is the perfect ALL around scope.

That ability to go deeper either visually or photographically is not up
for debate, everybody on SAA agrees (or should) that big newts and dobs
go deeper(in less time photograpically, and all the time visually)

But that doesn't make them (for most users) appropriate, considering all
of their downsides.

The refractor is the perfect telescope, and people who buy expensive
ones usually have come to that observation on their own, with no
counseling from this group, or any other.

Nobody is going to spend three grand on a refractor (or not) based on
anything anybody in SAA has said, they're already way beyond that and
making up their own minds based on experience.

What happens at star parties indicates trends of a very, very small
percentage of star party attendees.

And you're wrong to boot.....the largest refractors, the newest
refractors, and the coolest refractors are always at big star parties,
so I don't know what you're talking about.
The fact that there is ten times as many scopes at a star party that
cost five times less than a big refractor isn't indicative of anything
beyond the fact that there's always less of the most expensive/desirable
item at any hobby gathering.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 20:21:13 GMT, Simple Traveler
wrote:

Roland's right, you're wrong.

Roland's right about what, and I'm wrong about what? He and I said very nearly
the same thing.


In a nutshell, the refractor is the perfect ALL around scope.

That is a matter of opinion (yours apparently). I don't happen to agree. I don't
really think there is such a thing as a "perfect ALL around scope".


And you're wrong to boot.....the largest refractors, the newest
refractors, and the coolest refractors are always at big star parties...

All I said is that there are many more reflectors than refractors at all the
starparties I've been at. I figure that's because when people take a lot of
trouble and head for dark skies, they really want aperture- and that's something
you don't get with refractors.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com