Is the new AP 160 a bargain?

Does the newest offering from AP (the 160 EDF) represent the bargain
that AP refractors have traditionally held?
Historically AP scopes have sold at relative bargains. For most of the
late eighties and nineties the only other generally available 5"+
APO's were Tak and (for a while) Zeiss. Both were priced higher (in
the case of Zeiss, much higher) than AP's. The Tak's were not quite up
to the same quality level. Being higher quality than the more
expensive Tak's and being close, if not equal or superior to, much
higher priced Zeiss', made AP's a relative bargain in the APO market.
This was evidenced by long waiting lists and much higher than cost-new
resale prices.

Why did they sell at "bargain" prices? Roland has mentioned on the
newsgroups that he didn't make much money on some of these scopes. The
7"+ models required excessive hand figuring and the glass was mucho
expensive. He said that the last batch of 155 EDF's were basically
sold at cost (same for the 600 mount).

Of course as word spread about AP scopes, as disposable income
increased, and as more baby-boomers came to our hobby, AP couldn't
satisfy demand. The hew and cry went up "expand your capacity",
"increase output". Roland's response – I'm only one guy and I hand
figure (at some stage) _every_ lens that leaves here. He couldn't
produce them any quicker.

AP seemed content to being a low-volume production company that
delivered tremendous quality at an affordable price for the amateur.
When asked about expanding capacity back in 1999 Roland said "You make
it sound simple, indeed. Problem is, we are at capacity in our
building and with the machines we have. To double our capacity would
require investing approx. $1million just for capital equipment and
facilities. This money I ain't got. Our growth is pretty much
controlled by our banker to a comfortable 15% per year. More than that
requires going deeply into debt, which is not a good idea. … In short,
for us to double our production would mean tremendous capital
expenditure plus the addition of a rather large payroll. We're not
ready for it."

That was 1999. The 1999 list price for a 155EDF (with the 2.7"
focuser) was $4900. If you ordered it in 1997 or 98 you got in 1999
and you paid $4900. Not too bad considering that when you signed up
for it in 1997 or 98 the quoted price was $4500. In fact the scope was
priced at $4500 as far back as 1993 – a 1.45% annual increase thru
1999! Great value relative to the market! Zeiss APO's at super high
prices had come and gone. The Tak 150 cost much, much, more and was no
better (if as good). Yes, those lucky guys who got the last batch of
the 155's for $4900 in 1999 ($5400 in today's dollars) got a hell of a
deal.

Everyone kept saying "Roland, you can sell your scopes for much higher
prices, just look at the resale prices; why don't you?" Well, Roland
wasn't the only one listening. Tom Back and Markus started
collaborating on bringing APO's of AP level quality to the market.
They took a completely different approach by outsourcing components.
Nevertheless, thanks to Tom's stringent QC the scopes proved to be
outstanding and demand was/is high. The pricing was based on what the
market would bear – no doubt influenced by the prices that used AP's
were fetching.
Two things happened: It became readily apparent what the market would
pay for a quality APO, and affordable APO's became much less rare.

Where are we today? Amateurs have more choices than ever in APO
refractors of high quality. That is great! However, back to my
original question; does the latest AP scope offer the same bargain
that AP's once did? I believe the answer is no. AP has invested
considerable capital in expansion. This must be paid for. AP is
pricing the scopes to be competitive with TMB/TEC scopes. They are no
longer priced "under the market" as they were back when the
competition was Tak and Zeiss.

Can those lucky enough to be on the list buy the scope, use it for a
few years and be confident that it will sell at a highly appreciated
price, like they used to? Again, (only time will tell of course) I
think the answer is no. Roland has developed a new lens design that
lends itself better to higher volume production. AP scope production
will more closely approach demand. High quality APO's in general are
much more plentiful now thanks to TMB and TEC. Look at recent TMB
resale's on Astromart. Most go for about the same (sometimes a little
less) as cost-new. Other suppliers (Burgess/Back, Aries, other
Oriental makes) are coming to the market, thereby increasing supply,
and reducing scarcity.

Conclusion:
The latest AP scope is selling at a market-supported price. It is
worth the asking price. However, It no longer represents a "bargain"
like past AP scopes did. It won't resell at a highly increased price.
All of you who extolled Roland to increase production and raise prices
– Merry Christmas – you got your wish.

Disclaimers:
I either currently own or have owned both AP and TMB apo's and I like
them very much indeed. Roland and Tom have done a great service to
this hobby.

I know the value of a scope is in its use, not as a great financial
investment. However, isn't it even better when you reap both?

Is it sour grapes from one who didn't "buy in early"? Yeah, somewhat.

This isn't a knock or criticism of anyone. It is simply my
observations of the economic dynamics of the current premium- APO
market. I find it interesting. If you don't, you only wasted a little
of your time reading this )