89mm Questar takes on 206mm Astro-Physics at Mars Skywatch!

Howard County, Maryland, Nov 5, 2005 -- The Howard Community College
(HCC) Science Department and the Howard Astronomical League (Howard
Astro) http://www.howardastro.org presented "Mars Skywatch 2005" at
the HCC's Belmont Conference Center on the evening of Saturday,
November 5. Several hundred members of the public came out to get a
look at Mars (and the crescent Moon and Venus earlier in the evening.)
I was too busy to get around to count the number of Howard Astro
members who brought telescopes, but it could easily have been 40 or
more.

The forecast had called for partly cloudy weather, but light clouds
dissipated before dark and seeing was very good, particularly
considering that the event was held between Baltimore and Washington,
D.C.

Martin Cohen of Company 7 http://www.company7.com, aided by
volunteers from Howard Astro, brought the legendary 206mm Astro-Physics
Starfire EDF from his showroom. This remarkable instrument (which is
not available for purchase*) was the undisputed star of the show, and
there were long lines of people waiting to look through it.

Next to Martin was Louis Mamakos with his exquisite 155mm Astro-Physics
Starfire 155EDFS. Louis remains a member of Howard Astro, even after
moving to New Jersey to take the position of CTO of Vonage, Inc. See
http://www.vonage.com/corporate/aboutus_mamakos.php and
http://www.transsys.com/~louie/louie.html.

I was next to Louis with my 1982 3-1/2 inch (89mm) Questar Duplex
("Q"). As far as I know, my Q was the smallest 'scope present -- the
largest being a 20" Dob. The Q was mounted on a modified Meade standard
wedge, which was, in turn, mounted on a Meade standard tripod**. In
addition to direct visual observing, the Q was equipped with an Orange
Micro iBot FireWire webcam mounted behind a Questar 2X Barlow. The iBot
was connected to a 17" PowerBook running Astro IIDC
http://www.outcastsoft.com/ASCASTROIIDC.html. Astro IIDC supports
astronomy and microscopy imaging with FireWire cameras under Macintosh
OS X (BSD Unix). Everything was powered by a large marine deep-cycle
battery.

Louis and I are seen setting up in the first photo at
http://www.howardastro.org/Mars2005/event.html.

I have found that displaying live images of Solar System objects with
the Questar-iBot-PowerBook combination is extremely popular with the
public at outreach programs. Telescope eyepieces are often too high for
children and too low for adults; first-time observers may have trouble
seeing anything at all through them, especially if forced to stretch or
bend in an uncomfortable position to get to the eyepiece. Under good
seeing conditions such as we enjoyed on this occasion the
Questar/Barlow/iBot combination provides a considerably larger image
than is seen in most telescope eyepieces.

Even experienced observers were amazed at the quality of the displayed
image under such good conditions. Venus (at half phase) was lovely, of
course, without the color fringing that nearly every other telescope
that I looked through showed. Some members of the public remarked that
my Q was likely "too small to show Venus' red and green areas." ;-) A
number of people put their hands in front of the Q's dew cap to prove
to themselves that the image on the PowerBook was live.

The Main Event: Viewing Mars, and the Q and the big A-P going
toe-to-toe.

The public put it best: "Why do they need such big telescopes when you
can see Mars like this with such a tiny one?***" Contrast (always a Q
strong point, even causing the Q to seemingly outperform for its size
on faint deep-sky objects) was superb; terrain features were easily
distinguished. Some turbulence in the Earth's atmosphere was evident,
of course, but the bluish haze over Mars' north pole was consistently
prominent, and drew the attention of even those who had never seen a
planet through a telescope. More experienced observers said that they
caught glimpses of the polar ice cap. I thought I saw it, too, but I
would not swear to it -- it might have just been a random brightening
of the haze caused by turbulence in the Earth's atmosphere. The
brightening appeared in the right place, however, on the planet's rim
inside the haze, not outside.

The winner, as judged by both the public and many experience observers:
the Questar, based on the larger, easier to view image on the PowerBook
display, the excellent terrain contrast, and the prominent polar haze.

Since the public were so fascinated with the PowerBook display I did
not do very much direct observing through the Q's 8mm Brandon. My quick
impression was that the view was pretty much on a par with the view
through the A-P refractors, with one exception -- toward the end of the
evening, with Mars very high, Martin put a Denkmeier Binoviewer on the
206mm A-P. The view was as stunning as one might expect. (I didn't
learn what eyepieces were mounted, as I didn't want to hold up the line
with technical questions that would be of no interest to the public.)

Another crowd pleaser: my new 60GB iPod Video. I was able to show
people processed images of Mars that I had made during the past week,
as well as the movies from which the images were derived. I also had on
the iPod slide shows of both Solar System images with my Q and some of
the deep-sky images that I have made with my TeleVue 76 and Canon 20D.
Those who have seen my web site know that I'm far from being in the top
class of astrophotographers; nonetheless, the images that I showed
seemed to be crowd pleasers.

Other notes: - The Celestron and Meade SCT's I looked through all
presented excellent views, as expected (I have an 8" Meade in my little
observatory http://www.davidillig.com/observatory14.shtml.) A good
friend of mine would have brought his 16" Meade, but he is recovering
from surgery to his right hand, and can't handle the transportation of
that monster at this time.

- Most of the Dobs I looked through had pretty good images. Images were
sometimes ever-so-slightly fuzzy, lacking in contrast (compared to the
Q and the A-P's), and displaying some color fringing (collimation?). I
did not have the opportunity to look through the 20" Dob, but it is
said to be very good.

- Many members of the public seemed to have done their homework, and
they asked cogent, informed questions. Whether I knew all the answers
is another matter. Even the 'tweens and teens were not particularly
obnoxious.

- With so many people coming around I had no time to do any imaging.
This is unfortunate, as atmospheric turbulence was considerably less
than I have experienced from my home over the past week or so. I made
several short QuickTime movies to demonstrate to the public and to
interested amateurs how webcam images are captured, aligned, and
stacked to produce still images. This process quite amazed the public
as well as quite a few amateurs who had heard of the process but who
had not tried it or even seen it done.

I ended my evening by thanking Martin Cohen for going to all the
trouble of bringing that magnificent 206mm refractor, and by expressing
my hope that Martin's business will improve to the point where he can
afford a Questar!

Mars Skywatch 2005 was probably the most successful public outreach
program that I have attended, and I seriously doubt if any individual,
lay person or amateur astronomer, was left disappointed.

Davoud
www.davidillig.com

* For those who haven't had the pleasure of visiting the Company 7
showroom in Laurel, Maryland, it is as much a museum as it is a store.
There are many optical instruments, both historical and modern, on
display that are not for sale. And Martin /does/ have a number of
Questars in the museum collection.

** Stay tuned on the Questar mount. I've recently purchased a Losmandy
G-11 from Company 7, and, weather permitting, I'll install it in my
observatory as soon as I receive my 18VDC power supply and the mounting
plate for my Astro Pier from LeSueur. I'm going to put the 8" Meade OTA
and the TeleVue 76 and sometimes, perhaps, the Questar, on the
Losmandy. Then I'm going to try to put the Questar on the Meade fork
mount using a cradle that I recently purchased at Astromart. Having the
Q on a goto mount will be a great timesaver at public outreach events,
where people don't want to stand around and wait while I look up RA and
DEC and fiddle with manual setting circles.

*** I explained to the public that, while the Questar is superb for
Solar System observing and imaging, the Q and I would quietly slip out
the back way if the Astro-Physics refractors turned to deep-sky
observing.

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

According to Davoud, in a desperate plea for attention:

# Terry Schiavo, an innocent victim of fate, lies dying in a Florida
# Hospice. She has done no wrong, created no legal problems for anyone,

# and is an insignificant drain on the public purse. Medical experts
# agree that she is in a persistent vegetative state and cannot recover

# from the brain damage that she suffered 15 years ago.
# Ms. Schiavo's husband and legal guardian, Mr. Michael Schiavo, wants
# her to die in peace and dignity. Medical experts agree that this is a

# humane solution. The courts agree that her husband is acting in
# accordance with Ms. Schiavo's stated wishes in making the decision to

# allow Ms. Schiavo to die, and that he is legally entitled to act in
# this manner.
# Ms. Shciavo's parents, Mr. Robert Schindler and Ms. Mary Schindler,
and
# Ms. Schiavo's siblings, however, are unwilling to accept her death;
# they have exhausted every legal and extra-legal means of keeping her
# alive, but, by their own admission, remain desparate to do so.
# I propose a Compromise Solution which is just and humane. It is that
# feeding of Ms. Schiavo, an innocent victim of fate who has harmed no
# one and broken no laws, shall be resumed immediately.
# At the same time, Ms. Schiavo's parents and blood siblings, who have
# caused great pain to this nation, have attempted to abuse and
# circumvent the sacred laws of the United States and the sacred and
# immutable laws of Nature, and have caused the public purse to be
# depleted of millions of dollars in pursuit of their private aims,
shall
# agree to be put to death immediately.
# Ms. Schiavo shall be placed under the guardianship of the Republican
# National Committee (RNC), which shall be required to reimburse the
# public purse for her medical care to date, and which shall be
required,
# at its sole expense, to keep Ms. Schiavo alive as long as medical
# science permits, even if that term is beyond any normal and
reasonable
# human life span. Dr. William Frist shall be appointed her personal
# physician for the rest of his natural life and beyond, if it is
# medically possible to keep his body functioning after his brain has
# ceased to function, and if that is not already the case. The RNC
shall
# reimburse the public purse for the cost of all legal proceedings
# undertaken in this instance, to include the cost of implementing this

# Compromise Solution. Dr. Frist shall issue medical bulletins on Ms.
# Schiavo's condition each day at 12:00 noon in the time zone in which
# Ms. Schiavo's person is located, and as early as possible, but not
# later than one hour, after the discovery of an improvement in Ms.
# Schiavo's condition.
# The RNC shall be the sole authority licensed to use Ms. Schiavo's
# likeness on campaign posters (and you can bet that plans for that are

# already underway) and may transport Ms. Schiavo's person as it deems
# appropriate for display in political campaigns. In the event of Ms.
# Schiavo's death, which shall be certified by an impartial board of
# qualified moral and medical experts consisting of George W. Bush, Jeb

# Bush, and Dr. Frist, the remains of Ms. Schiavo shall become the
# property of the RNC, and the RNC shall be the sole authority licensed

# to use said remains in political campaigns, subject to local sanitary

# regulations. Likewise, the likenesses and remains of the parents and
# siblings of Ms. Schiavo shall become the property of the RNC, and the

# RNC shall be the sole authority licensed to display said likenesses
and
# remains in political campaigns, subject to local sanitary
regulations.
# The collective estates of the deceased members of the family of Ms.
# Schiavo shall in no way be encumbered or garnished for the payment of

# the medical or legal expenses related to this instance. Instead, the
# net proceeds of these collective estates shall be divided in equal
# portions between the Hemlock Society and Mr. Michael Schiavo.
# The RNC shall be the sole beneficiary of any and all profits gained
# from the public display of Ms. Schiavo's likeness or remains, or of
the
# likenesses or remains of any of her family members who are deceased
# pursuant to this Compromise Solution.
# Finally, under the terms of this Compromise Solution, Mr. Michael
# Schiavo shall be granted a divorce a vinculo matrimonii if he so
# desires.
# I'm Davoud and I approved this message. I would venture to guess that
# not everyone who reads this will approve.

By golly, the man has some writing talent and a fair intellect!
Thanks for sharing that, Coppy!

Uncle Bob

Uncle Bob:
By golly, the man has some writing talent and a fair intellect!
You are most kind to say that!

Thanks for sharing that, Coppy!
I had forgotten about Coppy, having blocked him long ago, and I didn't
see his reply. I can guess what it said, however, and I'm quite pleased
with myself for having written that. I got a /lot/ of attaboy e-mails
in response to that!

Davoud

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

Do you have any images of Mars taken with the Questar to post?
Is sounds like the public prefered looking at the notebook image but I
can't imagine it showing more detail the the 8" AP?

JD

I would think that a real-time image would appear rather washed-out on a
laptop screen and that a lot more detail would have been visible in the
smaller image seen in the 8 inch AP. Since the public are unseasoned
observers, maybe they prefer a larger more washed-out image to a smaller
image that shows much more detail?

3^2 != 8^2
-mij


"JD" wrote in message
...
Do you have any images of Mars taken with the Questar to post?
Is sounds like the public prefered looking at the notebook image but I
can't imagine it showing more detail the the 8" AP?

JD

Davoud wrote:

Howard County, Maryland, Nov 5, 2005 -- The Howard Community College
(HCC) Science Department and the Howard Astronomical League (Howard
Astro) http://www.howardastro.org presented "Mars Skywatch 2005"

http://www.howardastro.org/Mars2005/index.html

I brought my kids to this and was impressed by the turnout of both
astronomers and guests.

Jerry Persall's talk about observing Mars was interrupted by a double
Iridium flare--someone at the back of the crowd yelled "flare!" and we
all turned skyward to find it, as Jerry deftly switched gears to explain
what we were seeing.

A couple of things bugged me about Jerry's talk, though. He showed
Hubble images of Mars from both the 1995 and 2003 oppositions,

http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/1.../web_print.jpg
http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/2.../web_print.jpg

to make the point that not all oppositions are equal, but some of the
difference between the images is the result of improved imaging, not the
different distances to Mars. And his emphasis on oppositions may have
given some in the audience the impression that Mars was only visible
that night, or for only a few days. In my own outreach experience, this
is a common misapprehension that I'm always careful to clarify.

As if to emphasize this, the talk was given before any of the telescopes
had been pointed toward Mars, so we had the slightly surreal spectacle
of a small crowd looking at Hubble images of Mars on a TV while the real
thing hovered above them in the sky, mostly unrecognized.

I was next to Louis with my 1982 3-1/2 inch (89mm) Questar Duplex
("Q").

I wish I'd known that was you. I was over there talking to both Marty
and Louie for several minutes. I would've liked to have gotten the
scoop on your camera setup.

- Ernie http://home.comcast.net/~erniew

JD:
Do you have any images of Mars taken with the Questar to post?
Is sounds like the public prefered looking at the notebook image but I
can't imagine it showing more detail the the 8" AP?

Sorry, but I do not; I was too busy at the event to do any imaging, and
at home I usually image with my Meade and my TeleVue because they are
on a permanent mount in an observatory. There are planetary images with
my Questar and a webcam at
http://www.davidillig.com/ast-jupiter040319.shtml,
http://www.davidillig.com/ast-jupiter040416.shtml, and
http://www.davidillig.com/ast-jupiter040319enh.shtml.

Davoud

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

Mij Adyaw:
I would think that a real-time image would appear rather washed-out on a
laptop screen and that a lot more detail would have been visible in the
smaller image seen in the 8 inch AP. Since the public are unseasoned
observers, maybe they prefer a larger more washed-out image to a
smaller image that shows much more detail?

I'm not certain what you mean by "washed-out." I am unable to
scientifically quantify the quality of the image on my PowerBook, but I
can tell you that the image was very good. It was not only the public
who were surprised by this setup, but also the amateur observers who
saw it.

In reference to the "unseasoned observers," let me repeat part of my
original article: "I have found that displaying live images of Solar
System objects with the Questar-iBot-PowerBook combination is extremely
popular *with the public at outreach programs* ."

It was not the purpose of this event to carry out research on the
Martian terrain or atmosphere (though both were quite plainly shown on
my setup). In my view, the purpose of the event was to show Mars to the
public in a way that they could relate to. And the reason that this
method is popular with the public is not that they prefer washed-out
images, but that they are able to view the image comfortably and at
their leisure and have someone point to the various features and
explain what they are. Compared to having someone say, as the observer
assumes an unfamiliar and uncomfortable position and strains to look at
a tiny image through an eyepiece, "Look for the haze at the upper right
limb," this is a very powerful teaching tool.

Davoud

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com