New threat to Earth-based astronomy

If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Complete article he

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/11/16/international/i112951S42.DTL

wrote:
If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Complete article he

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/11/16/international/i112951S42.DTL

It would be terrible if saving New York, Miami, Rio De Janeiro, Los
Angeles, Tokyo, Hong Kong, Sidney, Cape Town, Hamburg, and London
interferred with amateur astronomy.

On 16 Nov 2006 11:54:28 -0800, wrote:

If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Unfortunately, we've allowed things to get so out of hand that drastic
measures are probably going to be required. There might still be time to
reverse things without such measures, but I just don't think the
political will is there to really try. So that leaves "geoengineering"
in another 20 or 30 years.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Don't Be Evil wrote:
wrote:
If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Complete article he

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/11/16/international/i112951S42.DTL

It would be terrible if saving New York, Miami, Rio De Janeiro, Los
Angeles, Tokyo, Hong Kong, Sidney, Cape Town, Hamburg, and London
interferred with amateur astronomy.

Maybe it's payback time; those cities you cited are among the worst
light-polluters interfering with amateur astronomy.

:-)

The proposal cited in the article (above) however would also affect
professional
observatories. If the atmosphere itself is dimmed with pollutants, ALL
are affected.

Seriously, though, it would seem that, perhaps, mylar (or carbon nano
flats or
something else) sheeting could be placed in orbit (near SOHO?) to act
as a
shield when/if necessary to eliminate the need to muck with Earth's
atmosphere.

Leave it to scientist to screw up in a new way. No way do I want them to do
anything that major. If they are wrong, there is probably no way to correct
it.

Sort of reminds me how their brainstorms usually do not work. Around here,
they released a bunch of Asian beetles (look like lady bugs) to kill the
aphids. Twice a year they drive us crazy as they leave the house and when
they come back. We collect hundreds of them each day during that time.
They not only stink, they also bite. I would rather have the aphids.

Keep the scientists from doing anything drastic.


wrote in message
ps.com...
If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Complete article he

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/11/16/international/i112951S42.DTL

Unfortunately, we've allowed things to get so out of hand that drastic
measures are probably going to be required. There might still be time to
reverse things without such measures, but I just don't think the
political will is there to really try. So that leaves "geoengineering"
in another 20 or 30 years.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

I agree. We barely have to political will to stop increasing CO2
output, nevermind starting to reduce it. And, natural forces may
already be starting to amplify the effect. For instance, the snowcover
is melting in the arctic, resulting in less sunlight being reflected
back into space.

However, they may be way lower-tech solutions. How about painting
roads, roofs, parking lots, etc white? How about growing more trees,
maybe diverting water from the Great Lakes to do it? Burying trash
instead of burning it?

Greg

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 07:36:38 -0500, "Fred Scharmann"
wrote:

Keep the scientists from doing anything drastic.

I agree. The money should be spent on developing alternative energy
sources. The Earth's weather is too complex to respond to such
simple-minded actions.

We can't predict the weather in 48 hours but somehow you want me to
believe they have the silver bullet for global climate change? Sorry,
no dice.

It is also ironic that cleaner burning hydrocarbons apparently
contribute more to the global warming problem since the sulphur
dioxide output is reduced. Think about that and all the
government-mandated pollution controls over the last years (especially
for coal-fired plants) along with the "environmental concerns" over
nuclear plants in the 80's.

---
Michael McCulloch

On Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:27:14 -0500, Michael McCulloch
wrote:

The Earth's weather is too complex to respond to such
simple-minded actions.

Nonsense. It will certainly respond. The question is do we know enough
about climate to know with any real certainty that it will respond the
way we want. There is a real chance here that the law of unintended
consequences will kick in (just as we are seeing now with global warming
side effects and unanticipated amplifiers).

It is because the climate system is so complex that it responds
(apparently) so sensitively to man-made effects.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

Chris L Peterson wrote:

Nonsense. It will certainly respond. The question is do we know enough
about climate to know with any real certainty that it will respond the
way we want.

Or just think we do?

Don't worry about it.


We will overpopulate the place, run out of food and water way before
any of that.

We are pumping out 1,000,000 new humans every 4 days. Do the math.

I'm just glad I'm 61 and won't (hopefully) be here when we go on the
menu.

Jim Klein

wrote:

If the sun warms the Earth too dangerously, the time may come to
draw the shade. The "shade" would be a layer of pollution
deliberately spewed into the atmosphere to help cool the
planet. This over-the-top idea comes from prominent scientists,
among them a Nobel laureate.

This weekend, NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field,
Calif., hosts a closed-door, high-level workshop on the global
haze proposal and other "geoengineering" ideas for fending off
climate change.

Complete article he

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2006/11/16/international/i112951S42.DTL

James E. Klein


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