Tom Back

Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

"ValeryD" wrote in message
om...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

Let it be known that because of your personal attacks on Mr. Back , which
have spilled over into
my Refractors group for whatever reason, your posts in that group will now
be moderated. That is one step away
from being banned.
And..before you accuse me of being a dictator and start shouting the word
censorship at me, may I remind you
that all of the Yahoo groups I belong to or run are not a democracy. If
your(or anyone's) prime objective is to make personal attacks
then you(plural) serve no useful purpose and I can not and will not hesitate
in putting you on moderation status and if that doesn't work..
ban you from the group.

I hope that is perfectly clear to you.

Bill

Hey VD,

Take a "chill pill" and get back to making optics.

Rob

"ValeryD" wrote in message
om...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

"ValeryD" skrev i en meddelelse
om...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

Don't be childish. Before your obscured attacks on Tom I had only heard
about you, and was under the assumption that you were an asset to this
newsgroup. BUT NOW!!!! After all your childish and frankly embarrassing
comments and threads here, I will never ever consider buying anything from
or made by you.

By the way, welcome on my killfile.

Peter


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.520 / Virus Database: 318 - Release Date: 18-09-2003

On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:27:57 +0200, "Peter M" wrote:

"ValeryD" skrev i en meddelelse
. com...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."




Don't be childish. Before your obscured attacks on Tom I had only heard
about you, and was under the assumption that you were an asset to this
newsgroup. BUT NOW!!!! After all your childish and frankly embarrassing
comments and threads here, I will never ever consider buying anything from
or made by you.

By the way, welcome on my killfile.

Peter


What does Valery D make in terms of telescopes to deserve such a
retort?

"Bill Becker" wrote in message ...
"ValeryD" wrote in message
om...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

Let it be known that because of your personal attacks on Mr. Back , which
have spilled over into
my Refractors group for whatever reason, your posts in that group will now
be moderated. That is one step away
from being banned.
And..before you accuse me of being a dictator and start shouting the word
censorship at me, may I remind you
that all of the Yahoo groups I belong to or run are not a democracy. If
your(or anyone's) prime objective is to make personal attacks
then you(plural) serve no useful purpose and I can not and will not hesitate
in putting you on moderation status and if that doesn't work..
ban you from the group.

I hope that is perfectly clear to you.

Bill


Bill,

Don't wait from me any comments about you or your behavior. Really,
what you did wrong now and in a past? Nothing. So, why you provoke
me to tell something bad about you?

I also would like to see any facts where you or anybody else will
show me real attac on Tom Back. The only idea of my posts was to
restore a real history - when Markus with Tom's Back full support
developed attacks against other products (TAK, AP, ARIES) with falsely
(and IMO, intentionally) cooked pictures - as "factual" provement of
TMB's scopes superiority in color correction and overall correction.
If you are not blind, re-read these threads and see all yourself.
I also advice you to not to frighten me by ban from your group, but
instead of this try to stay on position of other APO (same color-free and
TMB's or even better) manufacturers thouse production Markus and Tom
tried to belittle vs their own LZOS one.

BTW. I am not wonder why TMB now joint with SV. Very similar methods in
fight against competitors. ;-)
We can expect further development of their methods. The very firs
results was: Tom Back claimed here, in the s.a.a., that ORION 80mm F/7.5
ED APO is not an APO (despite it show no false color on Vega, while
130mm F/6 Super-puper TMB does.)


V.D.

On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 15:03:02 GMT, Garney Malenfant ...reflected:

On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 12:27:57 +0200, "Peter M" wrote:

"ValeryD" skrev i en meddelelse
.com...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."




Don't be childish. Before your obscured attacks on Tom I had only heard
about you, and was under the assumption that you were an asset to this
newsgroup. BUT NOW!!!! After all your childish and frankly embarrassing
comments and threads here, I will never ever consider buying anything from
or made by you.

By the way, welcome on my killfile.

Peter


What does Valery D make in terms of telescopes to deserve such a
retort?

A seemingly magic device that enables an achromat to emulate
an apochromat.

Alan

Valery,

It's clear to me and I hope that it's clear to you that you are your own
worse enemy. In the past, I've been forced to live through some of your
disruptive flame wars and tirades beginning with the one a few years ago
when you turned the Yahoo "Chinese Refractors" group into rubble. Too bad,
because I enjoyed that group and your antics is the reason I left. Not too
much later, you used SAA as a stage to duel with Astro Physics and then
later with Ed Ting and the Chromacor review debacle. Everytime you do this,
Valery, a few guys vow never to buy your product again, no matter how good
they are.

I hope you will do yourself a favor and consider not dominating SAA for the
next week with your gripes. Try using private email or the telephone.


Al


"ValeryD" wrote in message
om...
"Bill Becker" wrote in message
...
"ValeryD" wrote in message
om...
Tom,

in your n.g. you wrote:

"The other "Tim" was warned numerous times, but he just became
a conduit for Valery, who is the only person that we ever had
to ban on this group. Anyone that remembers how he disrupted
the TMB Optical group when I was in the hospital getting multiple
spinal surgeries, and took advantage of the fact I could not
respond to his slander and lies, shows what type of human being
that person is."

All what were written has nothing to do with your surgery.
I didn't knew, when the thread was started, that you was in
a hospital.
More, the thread about 100mm F/8 TMB (really LZOS, APM, TMBO)
superiority vs others was started BEFORE you was in a hospital.
All pictures of off-focus images, intendent to show and to prove
TMB's scopes superiority was taken by Markus _far before_
your surgery.

You had have a loooooot of time and opportunities to explain him
where he was wrong with his demonstration of TMB's superiority.
Before and after your surgery these opportunities were not used.
And I do understand your position. The position of dishonest man
who you _always_ was. Therefore I am not wonder.

Be sure, such opinion about you is not only my one. Some others
among manufacturers have the same opinion about you as ill, arrogant
and dishonest man. And what I want is simply spit on your opinion
about me.


V.D.

Let it be known that because of your personal attacks on Mr. Back ,
which
have spilled over into
my Refractors group for whatever reason, your posts in that group will
now
be moderated. That is one step away
from being banned.
And..before you accuse me of being a dictator and start shouting the
word
censorship at me, may I remind you
that all of the Yahoo groups I belong to or run are not a democracy. If
your(or anyone's) prime objective is to make personal attacks
then you(plural) serve no useful purpose and I can not and will not
hesitate
in putting you on moderation status and if that doesn't work..
ban you from the group.

I hope that is perfectly clear to you.

Bill


Bill,

Don't wait from me any comments about you or your behavior. Really,
what you did wrong now and in a past? Nothing. So, why you provoke
me to tell something bad about you?

I also would like to see any facts where you or anybody else will
show me real attac on Tom Back. The only idea of my posts was to
restore a real history - when Markus with Tom's Back full support
developed attacks against other products (TAK, AP, ARIES) with falsely
(and IMO, intentionally) cooked pictures - as "factual" provement of
TMB's scopes superiority in color correction and overall correction.
If you are not blind, re-read these threads and see all yourself.
I also advice you to not to frighten me by ban from your group, but
instead of this try to stay on position of other APO (same color-free and
TMB's or even better) manufacturers thouse production Markus and Tom
tried to belittle vs their own LZOS one.

BTW. I am not wonder why TMB now joint with SV. Very similar methods in
fight against competitors. ;-)
We can expect further development of their methods. The very firs
results was: Tom Back claimed here, in the s.a.a., that ORION 80mm F/7.5
ED APO is not an APO (despite it show no false color on Vega, while
130mm F/6 Super-puper TMB does.)


V.D.

Subject: Tom Back
From: "Al"
Date: 9/23/03 11:28 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

Valery,

It's clear to me and I hope that it's clear to you that you are your own
worse enemy. In the past, I've been forced to live through some of your
disruptive flame wars and tirades beginning with the one a few years ago
when you turned the Yahoo "Chinese Refractors" group into rubble. Too bad,
because I enjoyed that group and your antics is the reason I left. Not too
much later, you used SAA as a stage to duel with Astro Physics and then
later with Ed Ting and the Chromacor review debacle. Everytime you do this,
Valery, a few guys vow never to buy your product again, no matter how good
they are.

I hope you will do yourself a favor and consider not dominating SAA for the
next week with your gripes. Try using private email or the telephone.


Al
************************
Well you guys can think what ya want!
But i can tell ya TMB -APO's are some the best optics i have ever used. I had
a chance last week to use a 4" TMB, and let me tell ya, that was one sharp
scope! I could use over 400x with ease, i find it better than my TAK FL-102,
and it's built like a tank. About two years ago, i got a look thru another
4"TMB, it was about as perfect as perfect can be!

Guess there is no such thing as the perfect scope, but both TMB's would get a
10 on my list...

Chas P.

On 23 Sep 2003 18:38:49 GMT, (CHASLX200) ...reflected:

Subject: Tom Back
From: "Al"
Date: 9/23/03 11:28 AM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

Valery,

It's clear to me and I hope that it's clear to you that you are your own
worse enemy. In the past, I've been forced to live through some of your
disruptive flame wars and tirades beginning with the one a few years ago
when you turned the Yahoo "Chinese Refractors" group into rubble. Too bad,
because I enjoyed that group and your antics is the reason I left. Not too
much later, you used SAA as a stage to duel with Astro Physics and then
later with Ed Ting and the Chromacor review debacle. Everytime you do this,
Valery, a few guys vow never to buy your product again, no matter how good
they are.

I hope you will do yourself a favor and consider not dominating SAA for the
next week with your gripes. Try using private email or the telephone.


Al
************************
Well you guys can think what ya want!
But i can tell ya TMB -APO's are some the best optics i have ever used. I had
a chance last week to use a 4" TMB, and let me tell ya, that was one sharp
scope! I could use over 400x with ease, i find it better than my TAK FL-102,

Wha', your Takahashi ~FS-102~, or a ~VIXEN~ FL102S?

Whichever it is, do you still have it?

and it's built like a tank. About two years ago, i got a look thru another
4"TMB, it was about as perfect as perfect can be!

Guess there is no such thing as the perfect scope, but both TMB's would get a
10 on my list...

Alan