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![]() As you all know, there's currently a heated debate in the sci news groups about what Charles Darwin really said about the evolution of the eye. It's time this matter is cleared up -- simply and concisely -- once and for all. Actually, I thought I had ended all the confusion back on Saturday, May 11, 1996, when a pseudo named Michael Clark accused me of misquoting Darwin. He had the balls to say I used only a portion of Darwin's quote. ============================================= Here's what I said: ``To suppose that the eye (with so many parts all working together) . . . could have been formed by natural selection seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree." ============================================= Here's what Charles Darwin really said: 'To suppose that the eye with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree. When it was first said that the sun stood still and the world turned round, the common sense of mankind declared the doctrine false; but the old saying of Vox populi, vox Dei, as every philosopher knows, cannot be trusted in science. Reason tells me, that if numerous gradations from a simple and imperfect eye to one complex and perfect can be shown to exist, (Wake me when it's over) Z Z Z Z Z Z Z z z z z z z . . . . each grade being useful to its possessor, as is certainly the case; if further, the eye ever varies and the variations be inherited, as is likewise certainly the case and if such variations should be useful to any animal under changing conditions of life, then the difficulty of believing that a perfect and complex eye could be formed by natural selection, though insuperable by our imagination, should not be considered as subversive of the theory. How a nerve comes to be sensitive to light, hardly concerns us more than how life itself Z Z Z Z Z Z Z Z Z Z Z z z z z z z . . . originated; but I may remark that, as some of the lowest organisms, in which nerves cannot be detected, are capable of perceiving light, it does not seem impossible that certain sensitive elements in their barcode should become aggregated and developed into nerves, endowed with this special sensibility.' Darwin, 1859, Origin of Species ================================================== ======== I thought I said what Darwin had said but David Ian Greig said what I said wasn't what Darwin really had said because he said Darwin had more to say than what I said he had said, then Steve Vickers of the UK butts in and says HE knows what Darwin really said, claiming what I said he had said wasn't what Darwin really had said, so I said, 'Okay, I'll say what they say about what Darwin really said, since I suppose that this is indeed what he had said, even though I really don't know for sure if he had said it, but this is what they say he had said.' =============================================== = Nice little song and dance, there, Zippy. Can you balance a ball on your nose? ---- Michael Clark Up your's, Bumblebrain! http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/FOSSILS/TightFit.jpg Folks, please excuse the rude interruption! ================================================ Actually, it really doesn't matter what Darwin had said or what these fellas said he had said -- or what they say I said or didn't say about what he said or didn't say --- since what I said, whether Darwin said it or not, isn't something that really needed to be said. Perhaps Darwin said what they say he had said because he felt he had to say it -- he certainly was entitled to say what he wanted to say. But by saying what they say he had said, he actually said more than he needed to say, so maybe he didn't have to say what he said. 'Course, IF Darwin did say what these fellas said he had said, critics could later say he had nothing to say even though he had said it. Ed Conrad Emeritus Professor of Clear and Concise Journalism Penn State University University Park, Pa. http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...dDartboard.jpg ============================== http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...soldemboss.gif TRUTH VS. THE MONUMENTAL LIE OF MAN'S EVOLUTION (Fossils -- SOME HUMAN -- Found Between Coal Veins) http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...HumanSkull.JPG http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...sOldasCoal.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...iscoveries.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...oreFossils.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...HumanBrain.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...estResults.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...OldestTool.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/FOSSILS/Scorpion.jpg http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/FOSSILS/MVC-013F.JPG http://www.edconrad.com ===================== U.S. PROFESSIONAL SCIENTIFIC SOCIETES American Association for the Advancement of Science American Association of Physical Anthropology Acoustical Society of America American Anthropological Association American Association of Colleges of Pharmacy American Association of Cereal Chemists American Association of Engineering Societies American Association of Physics Teachers American Association of University Professors American Association of University Women American Astronautical Society American Astronomical Society American Chemical Society American College of Dentists American Dental Association American Economic Association American Educational Research Association American Ethnological Society American Fisheries Society American Geological Institute American Geophysical Union American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics American Institute of Biological Sciences American Institute of Chemical Engineers American Institute of Chemists American Mathematical Society American Medical Association American Meteorological Society American Nuclear Society American Oil Chemists' Society American Physical Society American Physiological Society American Phytopathological Society American Psychiatric Association American Psychological Association American Society for Cell Biology American Society for Engineering Education American Society for Horticultural Science American Society for Information Science ASM International American Society for Microbiology American Society for Pharmacology and Experimental Therapeutics American Society for Quality Control American Society of Aesthetics American Society of Agricultural Engineers American Society of Agronomy American Society of Animal Science American Society of Civil Engineers American Society of Mechanical Engineers American Society of Plant Physiologists American Society of Zoologists American Speech-Language-Hearing Association American Statistical Association American Vacuum Society Association of American Geographers Association of Research Libraries Association of Southeastern Biologists Association for Women in Science Astronomical Society of the Pacific Biophysical Society Crop Science Society of America Ecological Society of America Entomological Society of America FASEB (Federation of American Societies for Experimental Biology) Geological Society of America History of Science Society Industrial Research Institute Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers, Inc.(IEEE) Institute of Industrial Engineers Institute of Navigation Instrument Society of America International Association for Impact Assessment International Communication Association International Society for Measurement and Control International Society for Systems Sciences Marine Technology Society Mathematical Association of America Medical Library Association, Inc. Microscopy Society of America National Association for Research in Science Teaching National Association of Biology Teachers National Council of Teachers of Mathematics National Geographic Society National Science Teachers Association National Society of Black Engineers National Society of Professional Engineers National Speleological Society Optical Society of America Planetary Society Rural Sociological Society School Science and Mathematics Association Sigma Delta Epsilon/Graduate Women in Science, Inc. Sigma Xi, The Scientific Research Society Society of American Foresters Society for Applied Anthropology Society for Economic Botany Society for Industrial Microbiology Society for Social Studies of Science Society of Women Engineers Soil Science Society of America Speech Communication Association Volunteers in Technical Assistance (VITA) The Wildlife Conservation Society WORLD'S NATURAL HISTORY MUSEUMS Academy of Natural Sciences of Philadelphia Alaska Museum of Natural History Alaska State Museums, Juneau, Alaska Albany Museum, Rhodes University, Grahamston, South Africa The Raymond M. Alf Museum of Paleontology, Claremont, Calif American Museum of Natural History, New York City, New York Arizona-Sonora Desert Museum Australian Museum Online Australian National Botanical Garden Berkeley Natural History Museums consortium, Berkeley, California Bernice Bishop Museum, Honolulu, Hawaii Bob Campbell Geology Museum, Clemson University Buena Vista Museum of Natural History Burke Museum, University of Washington, Seattle The California Academy of Sciences Canadian Museum of Nature Carnegie Museum of Natural History, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania Centennial Museum, University of Texas at El Paso The Notebaert Nature Museum, Chicago, Illinois Chula Vista Nature Center, Chula Vista, California Cincinnati Museum Center, Cincinnati, Ohio City of Santa Cruz Museum of Natural History Cleveland Museum of Natural History, Cleveland, Ohio College of Eastern Utah Prehistoric Museum Connecticut State Museum of Natural History Cumberland Lodge, Museum, and Center for Leadership Studies, Williamsburg, Kentucky Dallas Museum of Natural History Denver Museum of Nature & Science, Denver, Colorado Johnston Geology Museum, Emporia, Kansas Essig Museum of Entomology, University of California, Berkeley Fernbank Museum of Natural History, Atlanta, Georgia Fick Fossil and History Museum, Oakley, Kansas The Field Museum of Natural History, Chicago Finnish Museum of Natural History: Botanical Museum The Florida Museum of Natural History Georgia Museum of Natural History Harvard Museum of Natural History Haus der Natur, Cismar, Germany Haus der Natur, Salzburg, Austria The High Desert Museum, Bend, Oregon Honolulu Community College Dinosaur Exhibit, Honolulu, Hawaii Hooper Virtual Paleontological Museum, Canada Houston Museum of Natural Science Humboldt State University Natural History Museum, Humboldt, California Hunterian Museum and Art Gallery, Glasgow, Scotland Illinois Natural History Survey Illinois State Museum Institute of Systematics, Evolution of Animals, Polish Academy of Sciences Kansas University Natural History Museum, Lawrence, Kansas Los Angeles County Museum of Natural History Louisiana State University Museum of Natural Science Manchester Museum, University of Manchester, England Massachusetts Museum of Natural History, University of Massachusetts Milwaukee Public Museum, Milwaukee, Wisconsin Missouri Botanical Garden Monterey Bay Aquarium, Monterey, California Montshire Museum of Science, Norwich, Vermont Musée de Minéralogie, Êcole des Mines, Paris Musée d'Histoire Naturelle, Fribourg, Switzerland Musée National d'Histoire Naturelle, Paris, France Musée National d'Histoire Naturelle,Luxembourg Muséum d'Histoire Naturelle de Genève (Natural History), Geneva Museo di Storia Naturale di Firenze, Firenze (Florence), Italy Museo di Storia Naturale dell'Università di Pisa, Italy Museo Mundo de Ambar, Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic Museo Nacional de Ciencias Naturales de Madrid Museo Tridentino di Scienze Naturali, Trento, Italy Museon, Den Haag (The Hague), Netherlands Museum of Natural History - Cormack Planetarium, Providence, RI Museums of Natural History, University of Copenhagen, Denmark Museum of Natural Sciences, Brussels, Belgium Museum of Southwestern Biology, University of New Mexico Museum of Vertebrate Zoology, University of California, Berkeley Museum of Victoria, Melbourne, Australia National Museum of Natural History, Smithsonian Institution Washington, DC National Museum of Natural History: Naturalis, Leiden, Netherlands The Natural History Museum, Berne, Switzerland The Natural History Museum, London Natuurhistorisch Museum Maastricht, The Netherlands Natuurmuseum Rotterdam, The Netherlands Neanderthal Museum, Mettmann, Germany New England Aquarium, Boston, Massachusetts The New Mexico Museum of Natural History and Science The New York State Museum Nichols Arboretum, University of Michigan North Carolina Museum of Life and Science The North Carolina State Museum of Natural Sciences Nova Scotia Museum The Oakland Museum of California, Oakland, California The Oklahoma Biological Survey Oklahoma Museum of Natural History Pacific Grove Museum of Natural History, Monterey County, Cal. Paleontological Museum, University of Oslo, Norway The Peabody Museum of Natural History, Yale University Pratt Museum of Natural History, Amherst College Provincial Museum of Alberta, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada The Rankin Museum of American and Natural History The Raptor Center, University of Minnesota Redpath Museum, McGill University, Montréal, Qué., Canada The Royal British Columbia Museum The Royal Ontario Museum (ROM), Toronto The Royal Tyrrell Museum of Paleontology, Alberta, Canada San Diego Natural History Museum, San Diego, California Santa Barbara Museum of Natural History Satrosphere , Aberdeen, Scotland Senckenberg Natural History Museum, Frankfurt, Germany Sierra College Natural History Museum The Smithsonian Institution, National Museum of Natural History St. Louis Science Center Staatliches Museum für Naturkunde, Stuttgart, Germany State Darwin Museum, Moscow, Russia Birch Aquarium-Museum, Scripps Institute of Oceanography Sternberg Museum of Natural History Stoke-on-Trent City Museum Mayborn Museum Complex, Baylor University The Swedish Museum of Natural History Tallahassee Museum of History and Natural Science Tate Geological Museum, Casper, Wyoming The Tennessee Aquarium, Chattanooga, Tennessee The Texas Memorial Museum, University of Texas at Austin Teylers Museum, Haarlem, The Netherlands University of Alaska Museum, Fairbanks, Alaska University of Alberta Museum of Zoology University of California Museum of Paleontology University of Colorado Museum of Natural History University of Michigan Museum of Paleontology University of Michigan Museum of Zoology University of Michigan Exhibit Museum of Natural History University of Nebraska State Museum, Lincoln, Nebraska University of Oregon Museum of Natural History University of Washington Fish Collection University of Wisconsin-Madison Geology Museum University of Wyoming Geological Museum The Vanderbilt Museum, Centerport, Long Island, New York The Virginia Living Museum, Newport News, Virginia Virginia Marine Science Museum, Hampton Roads, Virginia Virginia Museum of Natural History Virginia Museum of Natural History, Virginia Tech branch Voralberger Naturschau Dornbirn, Dornbirn, Austria Worldwide Museum of Natural History Wyoming Dinosaur Center, Thermopolis, Wyoming Zoological Museum of University of Amsterdam, Netherlands Zoological Museum of the University of Copenhagen, Denmark (cc) Sir Isaac Newton Johannes Keppler Ed Conrad Copernicus Galilei Galileo Christopher Columbus Immanuel Velikovsky Sir Jean-Paul Turcaud Matthew, Mark, Luke and Jack Wal-Mart New York Times Daily News Post Newsday Newsweek USA Today Wall Street Journal Time Nation War in Iraq Heaven Hell ABC CBS NBC MSNBC Larry King Larry Silverstein CNN Keith Olbermann Fox News Rupert Murdoch PBS BBC Lou Dobbs Chris Matthews Brian Williams Katie Couric Charles Gibson White House Billy Meier Intelligent Design Bill Moyers Keith Olbermann Stephen Colbert Jon Stewart Hubble Evolution Stephen Hawking Evolution Tony Blair Intelligent Design ACLU Bill Moyers UFO Brad Guth London News of the World New England Journal of Medicine Alan Mann UofP Bill Gates The Sun London s The View 60 Minutes Oprah Winfrey Bennie Hill Rosie O'Donnell Meet the Press Nightline Anderson Cooper Christianity Hinduism Islam Judaism Buddhism Sikhism American Association for the Advancement of Science L'Osservatore Romano Vatican Pope Benedict Republican Democrat Pope John XXIII American Association of Physical Anthropology Evolutionists History Channel Philadelphia Inquirer Paul Myers PZ News of the World Jay Leno Roseanna UPS Extraterrestrials St. Judas Iscariot Pray for Us http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...veTheWhale.jpg A PLEA FOR CONSERVATION Plase keep all responses brie. four-five lines at best.. We can't allow Cyberspace to go the route of our clean air and water. I thank you and so does Blue. http://mysite.verizon.net/edconrad/F...onrad&Blue.jpg Troll-O-Meter 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ________________________________ | | | | | | | | | | | ! --------------------------------------------------- ==================================== |
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