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![]() astro-ph/0701238 Title: Exploring the Galaxy using space probes Authors: Rasmus Bjoerk Comments: 6 pages, 4 figures, accepted by International Journal of Astrobiology This paper investigates the possible use of space probes to explore the Milky Way, as a means both of finding life elsewhere in the Galaxy and as finding an answer to the Fermi paradox. I simulate exploration of the Galaxy by first examining how long time it takes a given number of space probes to explore 40,000 stars in a box from -300 to 300 pc above the Galactic thin disk, as a function of Galactic radius. I then model the Galaxy to consist of ~260,000 of these 40,000 stellar systems all located in a defined Galactic Habitable Zone and show how long time it takes to explore this zone. The result is that with 8 probes, each with 8 subprobes ~4% of the Galaxy can be explored in 9.57*10^{9} years. Increasing the number of probes to 200, still with 8 subprobes each, reduces the exploration time to 4*10^{8} years. -- Lt. Lazio, HTML police | e-mail: No means no, stop rape. | http://patriot.net/%7Ejlazio/ sci.astro FAQ at http://sciastro.astronomy.net/sci.astro.html |
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My 2 cents:
1. Aside from confiming something that we already know, that sending probes is an incredibly difficult thing to do (even though it ignores the enormous engineering and economic reasons why it is so hard to explore with probes) nothing can be ruled out by this mental exercise (ie. it's less useful than the Drake equation and does nothing to resolve the so-called Fermi Paradox because there are too many other factors that could affect the answer to Fermi's question.) 2. The initial stellar population estimate is from 1973 and is too low (although perhaps his local densities are correct?) 3. The space probe longevities are impossible (as noted by the author) making the exercise mute. 4. Space probes probably won't have to be within a stellar system to be able to detect whether or not they are inhabited (i.e. advanced sensor technologies should permit them to operate at considerable distances, letting them examine multiple stars at a median distance between them and still be able to detect civilizations with technological and physical footprints, if, and that's a BIG IF, they are like ours, i.e. light pollution, EM leakage, modification of planetary surfaces etc.) 5. Speculation referred to by the author about the probes turning against their makers are old science fiction (and pre-date the sources cited, see the Berserker series by Fred Saberhagen, HAL from Arthur C. Clarke's 2001, NOMAD [Star Trek TV show] and V'ger [Star Trek movie] and others) and are an interesting genre, but it doesn't help to resolve Fermi's question (which is not a paradox) or even shed new light on it. Regards, Jason H. Joseph Lazio wrote: astro-ph/0701238 Title: Exploring the Galaxy using space probes Authors: Rasmus Bjoerk Comments: 6 pages, 4 figures, accepted by International Journal of Astrobiology This paper investigates the possible use of space probes to explore the Milky Way, as a means both of finding life elsewhere in the Galaxy and as finding an answer to the Fermi paradox. I simulate exploration of the Galaxy by first examining how long time it takes a given number of space probes to explore 40,000 stars in a box from -300 to 300 pc above the Galactic thin disk, as a function of Galactic radius. I then model the Galaxy to consist of ~260,000 of these 40,000 stellar systems all located in a defined Galactic Habitable Zone and show how long time it takes to explore this zone. The result is that with 8 probes, each with 8 subprobes ~4% of the Galaxy can be explored in 9.57*10^{9} years. Increasing the number of probes to 200, still with 8 subprobes each, reduces the exploration time to 4*10^{8} years. -- Lt. Lazio, HTML police | e-mail: No means no, stop rape. | http://patriot.net/%7Ejlazio/ sci.astro FAQ at http://sciastro.astronomy.net/sci.astro.html |
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Some day I need to get my response into a single, general purpose response in
favor of probes. My interest arose when I read of the energetics of probes being less than those of RF transmitting at about 20 light years. This is based solely upon technologies being developed today. Granted they are still too far in the future to know their ultimate form and practicality. Jason H. wrote: My 2 cents: 1. Aside from confiming something that we already know, that sending probes is an incredibly difficult thing to do (even though it ignores the enormous engineering and economic reasons why it is so hard to explore with probes) nothing can be ruled out by this mental exercise (ie. it's less useful than the Drake equation and does nothing to resolve the so-called Fermi Paradox because there are too many other factors that could affect the answer to Fermi's question.) It starts depending upon what one means by a probe. It seems obvious it will be some sort of electronic system and the size of it can be established by the rate of miniaturization. When one talks economics one does not start with house sized probes rather with grapefruit sized probes. How are they made? An autonomous factory on an asteroid. How do they travel? Solar sails. How do they report? They come home. When does the first one leave? Less than a century from now. When do they start coming back even with negative results? In less time than HSS has been around. 2. The initial stellar population estimate is from 1973 and is too low (although perhaps his local densities are correct?) 3. The space probe longevities are impossible (as noted by the author) making the exercise mute. Self repairing probes and self-repairing factories are sent out. And there is also the possibility of self-replicating probes. When they arrive in a solar system the move to convenient asteroid and manufacture planetary landing probes. 4. Space probes probably won't have to be within a stellar system to be able to detect whether or not they are inhabited (i.e. advanced sensor technologies should permit them to operate at considerable distances, letting them examine multiple stars at a median distance between them and still be able to detect civilizations with technological and physical footprints, if, and that's a BIG IF, they are like ours, i.e. light pollution, EM leakage, modification of planetary surfaces etc.) Actually detection technology should increase much faster than the time it takes to get a probe closer to a target. That is why I expect we will be looking at the surfaces of extra-solar planets before anyone starts sending probes. 5. Speculation referred to by the author about the probes turning against their makers are old science fiction (and pre-date the sources cited, see the Berserker series by Fred Saberhagen, HAL from Arthur C. Clarke's 2001, NOMAD [Star Trek TV show] and V'ger [Star Trek movie] and others) and are an interesting genre, but it doesn't help to resolve Fermi's question (which is not a paradox) or even shed new light on it. (This came out way too long but the last sentence is the bottom line. The filler is how to get to the last sentence. Scroll down if bored.) Fermi is not a real issue. If 1/100 of 1% of the UFO sightings are alien visitors Earth is a popular tourist destination. What is the point of being a tourist if can't go native? Put on your human suit or your elephant suit and enjoy! From my thinking in soc.history.what-if with the back in time WIs I am fairly convinced we may be nearly the last generation that has a chance of communicating with the ancient Greeks or Romans or even Renaissance folks for lack of common cultural references. As a kid I saw coal being handled for winter heat and I have had to explain what little I remember it was like to the 50 year old youngsters. Very few people today have ever ridden a horse and I haven't since a teenager. My son never has as there was never a place to ride one near any place we have lived. Our first hand experience with "natural" fire is the rustic fireplace and then without newspapers forget getting a fire started. Every other use of fire we have common experience with is something that did not exist a couple hundred years ago. Explain to the Romans how to make flint and the steel to strike it with. Add a few hundred more years of technology, the kind needed to be a space tourist, and there would be next to nothing of a technological nature we could communicate. Go back in time to 1965 and impart integrated circuit technology? Fat chance. The best you could say is that investing in it will pay off. In any event trying to convey advanced technology would make you sound like Brad Guth. What could you possibly take back in time to Rome to gain enough money to live on? There is really very little. Knives and swords of modern steel and sugar are about it for one reason or another. They can't work our raw steel. Medicines sound great but it takes a wide range of them and good diagnostic ability but you don't know any incantations to invoke the right god so no one will trust you. Crank powered LED flashlights are a possibility but expect people to do dumb things with them like use them underwater and a dozen other things even our young children know not to do. I did not read First Contact but from what the movie showed the major flaw was the absence of the complete manufacturing processes of each component back to the raw materials as well as test specs and the manufacturing processes themselves. And then all the technology to begin the manufacturing processes. Essentially the transmission is the sum total all the entire technology and science upon which the device is based. Caesar likes your .45 and asks how to make more of them. Where do you start? Say you just want to raise the locals to the next step in something. You first trip has to totally research how they do that something already. Say for example better quality transparent glass in the Renaissance. Totally research their methods then look up the modern method then duplicate the old method and adapt the modern method to it and then go back and teach it. And that is trivial compared to a multi-technology based object. Say you want to speed the industrial revolution by improving the steam engine. Certainly you can introduce single improvements a few years before its time if you think that is worth it. But to jump an early brass engine to one suitable for a steam locomotive you have to start with improving mining techniques, the metallurgy of iron, building factories to produce it, all the technical advances in the engine itself and in the end you have advanced history maybe 40 years out of 80 and you have NOT created a demand for trains as there are not enough people or great enough distances to use them nor even the excess population to lay the rail lines. There are very few things in our history that could be introduced at any time and be of major value. The chimney was invented about 1000 AD (believe it or not) but would have been of value any time in history and could have been built any time in history. The horse collar and stirrup are other inventions. The compass is another. There are not many more basic inventions that would have worked at any time in history and have been of significant value. Even the compass would not have been that important when most commerce was in the Med or followed the shore. The horse collar and stirrup depend upon Earth animals so alien visitors cannot introduce them. Which leads us back to the common tourist wisdom: Blend in and do not try to educate the locals. It is wasted on the locals and embarrasses the tourist. -- American troops in Iraq have to know they are risking their lives for people who hate them. -- The Iron Webmaster, 3727 nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml Old Testament http://www.giwersworld.org/bible/ot.phtml a6 |
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