Some Basic Telescope Questions

Hi there,

I'm very new here, as I was pointed at this newsgroup as a good place to
ask some beginner questions, so be gentle :-)

I was given a Celestron telescope for my birthday recently, and haven't
spent too much time with it beyond going out and looking at pretty
things, but as I moved to South America recently, I would like to get a
bit more into the subject. I've ordered some starting astronomy books,
and would tremendously appreciate some help or pointers with some
questions about accessories (my Spanish is still poor, so local
astronomy clubs probably wouldn't help me much.) I can't determine the
exact model of scope & mount--there are no markings on either, beyond "4
1/2" (114mm) Newtonian Telescope -- 910mm f/L" Based on searching the
web I guess it's an "equatorial mount", but that's as much as I've
figured out.

First, I would like to buy a motor that I can control from my laptop
(Powerbook), but am not sure whether this even exists for my mount.
Could anyone give me a hint as to the type of mount and whether there
are such motors for it based on these pictures?

http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1235.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1236.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1237.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1238.JPG

Am I just SOL with this mount if I want to control it with my PC and do
I need to buy a new one?

Second, a colleague explained the concept of a polaris sight to me, but
I got stupid looks from the staff when I asked for one in a shop in
Chile (Southern hemisphere.) What is the equivalent of something like
this south of the equator?

And lastly, I'm curious as to whether there's a way to mount a camera on
this sort of scope? Without knowing the model, I can't really figure
out what sort of accessories exist.

Sorry for the stupid questions, as I'm kind of lost and would
tremendously appreciate any assistance,

-John

"John Morgan Salomon" wrote in message
...
Hi there,

I'm very new here, as I was pointed at this newsgroup as a good place to
ask some beginner questions, so be gentle :-)

I was given a Celestron telescope for my birthday recently, and haven't
spent too much time with it beyond going out and looking at pretty
things, but as I moved to South America recently, I would like to get a
bit more into the subject. I've ordered some starting astronomy books,
and would tremendously appreciate some help or pointers with some
questions about accessories (my Spanish is still poor, so local
astronomy clubs probably wouldn't help me much.) I can't determine the
exact model of scope & mount--there are no markings on either, beyond "4
1/2" (114mm) Newtonian Telescope -- 910mm f/L" Based on searching the
web I guess it's an "equatorial mount", but that's as much as I've
figured out.


The Celestron 114mm reflector is 900mm FL, not 910mm. Also, the mount (and
it is an equatorial) is different. See
http://www.celestron.com/prod_pgs/tel/fs114eq.htm FWIW, your mount looks
sturdier than the one they currently show on their website.

First, I would like to buy a motor that I can control from my laptop
(Powerbook), but am not sure whether this even exists for my mount.
Could anyone give me a hint as to the type of mount and whether there
are such motors for it based on these pictures?

http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1235.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1236.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1237.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1238.JPG

Am I just SOL with this mount if I want to control it with my PC and do
I need to buy a new one?


The mount is manually operated. Unless it came with a hand controller or
has obvious inputs for electronics on it, you won't be able to control this
with anything other than your hands. Not that that is a bad thing, mind
you, but if you want an automated Go To mount or one that can connected to a
computer, you will need a new one.

Second, a colleague explained the concept of a polaris sight to me, but
I got stupid looks from the staff when I asked for one in a shop in
Chile (Southern hemisphere.) What is the equivalent of something like
this south of the equator?


You mean a polar alignment scope. Since Polaris, the North Star, is not
visible south of the equator, you need to align with the south celestial
pole. The problem is, there is not a "South Star" like there is a "North
Star". The best you can do is to learn to recognize the stars that surround
the south pole and aim for them. BTW, some of the pictures suggest you have
polar scope already, especially 1236. The brass colored ring with set
screws on the right is the eye end of the polar scope (is there an eyepiece
there?). Take the cap off the other end - best visible in 1238 - and aim
the scope at the south celestial pole, fine tuning by using the silver
push/pull screw arrangement also seen in 1236, below the black setting
circle. There was a large "N" mark visible in 1238. In the Southern
hemisphere, this should be an "S" and you should point this side of the
tripod/mount toward the south.

And lastly, I'm curious as to whether there's a way to mount a camera on
this sort of scope? Without knowing the model, I can't really figure
out what sort of accessories exist.


Your best bet, at first, would be to try your hand at afocal imaging, I.E.,
pointing a camera at the eyepiece and taking a picture of the object that
way. Orion (www.telescope.com) and Scopetronix (www.scopetronix.com) both
sell various adapters and clamp mounts for your specific camera and
eyepieces.



John

Good reply, John. I've inserted some comments.

johnschiap wrote:


The Celestron 114mm reflector is 900mm FL, not 910mm. Also, the mount (and
it is an equatorial) is different. See
http://www.celestron.com/prod_pgs/tel/fs114eq.htm FWIW, your mount looks
sturdier than the one they currently show on their website.


Definitely a sturdier mount than the one at the Celestron website.
Makes me wonder if this was packaged by Orion or someone, since it
sounds like a recent purchase.

BTW .. I was guessing it was a Powerseeker 127 as he

http://www.celestron.com/prod_pgs/tel/ps_index.htm

But if John's scope came with a manual, it should say what model it is.



First, I would like to buy a motor that I can control from my laptop
(Powerbook), but am not sure whether this even exists for my mount.
Could anyone give me a hint as to the type of mount and whether there
are such motors for it based on these pictures?

http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1235.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1236.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1237.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1238.JPG

Am I just SOL with this mount if I want to control it with my PC and do
I need to buy a new one?



The mount is manually operated. Unless it came with a hand controller or
has obvious inputs for electronics on it, you won't be able to control this
with anything other than your hands. Not that that is a bad thing, mind
you, but if you want an automated Go To mount or one that can connected to a
computer, you will need a new one.


Given the sturdier mount, I wonder if there is a motor drive option for
it? Would not provide computer control, but could let it track in right
ascension.



Second, a colleague explained the concept of a polaris sight to me, but
I got stupid looks from the staff when I asked for one in a shop in
Chile (Southern hemisphere.) What is the equivalent of something like
this south of the equator?



You mean a polar alignment scope. Since Polaris, the North Star, is not
visible south of the equator, you need to align with the south celestial
pole. The problem is, there is not a "South Star" like there is a "North
Star". The best you can do is to learn to recognize the stars that surround
the south pole and aim for them. BTW, some of the pictures suggest you have
polar scope already, especially 1236. The brass colored ring with set
screws on the right is the eye end of the polar scope (is there an eyepiece
there?). Take the cap off the other end - best visible in 1238 - and aim
the scope at the south celestial pole, fine tuning by using the silver
push/pull screw arrangement also seen in 1236, below the black setting
circle. There was a large "N" mark visible in 1238. In the Southern
hemisphere, this should be an "S" and you should point this side of the
tripod/mount toward the south.


That was my take, too.


And lastly, I'm curious as to whether there's a way to mount a camera on
this sort of scope? Without knowing the model, I can't really figure
out what sort of accessories exist.



Your best bet, at first, would be to try your hand at afocal imaging, I.E.,
pointing a camera at the eyepiece and taking a picture of the object that
way. Orion (www.telescope.com) and Scopetronix (www.scopetronix.com) both
sell various adapters and clamp mounts for your specific camera and
eyepieces.



Good suggestions!

Phil

John Morgan Salomon wrote:
Hi there,

I'm very new here, as I was pointed at this newsgroup as a good place to
ask some beginner questions, so be gentle :-)

I was given a Celestron telescope for my birthday recently, and haven't
spent too much time with it beyond going out and looking at pretty
things, but as I moved to South America recently, I would like to get a
bit more into the subject.

John, didn't it come with a manual?

Phil

Phil Wheeler wrote:

BTW .. I was guessing it was a Powerseeker 127 as he

http://www.celestron.com/prod_pgs/tel/ps_index.htm

But if John's scope came with a manual, it should say what model it is.




I meant, of course, a Powerseeker 114

"John Morgan Salomon" wrote in message
...
Hi there,

I'm very new here, as I was pointed at this newsgroup as a good place to
ask some beginner questions, so be gentle :-)

I was given a Celestron telescope for my birthday recently, and haven't
spent too much time with it beyond going out and looking at pretty
things, but as I moved to South America recently, I would like to get a
bit more into the subject. I've ordered some starting astronomy books,
and would tremendously appreciate some help or pointers with some
questions about accessories (my Spanish is still poor, so local
astronomy clubs probably wouldn't help me much.) I can't determine the
exact model of scope & mount--there are no markings on either, beyond "4
1/2" (114mm) Newtonian Telescope -- 910mm f/L" Based on searching the
web I guess it's an "equatorial mount", but that's as much as I've
figured out.
I'd guess, this is the Firstscope 114EQ. The 'EQ', stands for
'equatorial', the '114' is the aperture. The mount, is what Celestron call
a 'CG3'.

First, I would like to buy a motor that I can control from my laptop
(Powerbook), but am not sure whether this even exists for my mount.
Could anyone give me a hint as to the type of mount and whether there
are such motors for it based on these pictures?

http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1235.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1236.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1237.JPG
http://www.zog.net/Temp/IMG_1238.JPG
There are two 'parts' to this. Simple motors, will allow the scope to
move. Control from a PC, need something relatively more complex. Simple
motors for this mount, are available from Celestron. Their part number
93515, is a single axis drive, that will make the scope 'track' the sky.
Going beyond this, on this mount, requires some mechanical 'art' from the
user. Some people, have in the past fitted the Vixen dual axis drives to
this type of mount (requires making brackets etc., yourself), and there is
nothing (potentially), to stop you from attaching a full 'goto' controller
to the mount in the same way (which would then allow PC control). However
the cost of doing this, is likely to exceed that of buying a mount that
already has such a controller.

Am I just SOL with this mount if I want to control it with my PC and do
I need to buy a new one?
Realistically, to do this properly, it will actually be cheaper to buy a
'goto' mount.

Second, a colleague explained the concept of a polaris sight to me, but
I got stupid looks from the staff when I asked for one in a shop in
Chile (Southern hemisphere.) What is the equivalent of something like
this south of the equator?
The same thing!. However only in the more expensive versions, or with a
bit more work. For instance, the polar scope (the name normally used for
this), from Losmandy, and similar people, has two sets of reticule marks
on the single scope. The first has the pole star, and three stars near the
pole, that are used for northern alignment, and then there is a second set
of marks, giving two of the stars in Octans, used for southern alignment.
The more basic scopes (like the unit supplied by Celestron for your
scope), don't have this type of reticule. However they can still be used!.
On this scope, there is a single crosshair only. What is done, is that you
have to 'drift align' the scope, till it's axis is accurately pointed at
the SCP. Then use the control rings to rotate the scope RA axis, till it
is orientated to the index location based on the date and time (this is
the same index point used for the northern alignment). Then you have to
adjust the _crosshairs_ in the polar scope, to centre Sigma Octans. I
future, if you set the scope to the index location, and centre the same
star, with the _mount's adjustments_, you will be close to polar aligned.
The same system actually has to be used in the Northern hemisphere.
Polaris is quite a large fraction of a degree 'away' from where the pole
really is. Unfortunately, the problem is that whereas Polaris is bright,
and easily locatable, Sigma Octans, is not... :-(

And lastly, I'm curious as to whether there's a way to mount a camera on
this sort of scope? Without knowing the model, I can't really figure
out what sort of accessories exist.
Depends what you mean. You can just attach a camera 'parallel' to the tube
of the scope. With a tracking motor, long exposures then become possible,
and you can even manually guide, to take really long exposures. Imaging
'through' the scope, is harder. The 'Newtonian' telescope (which is what
this unit is), has a relatively limited range of 'backfocus' (how far
'outside' the top of the focusser, the scope can focus). Hence on such
scopes, you have to be careful to use very short (optically) accessories.
A simple webcam, could be attached, and would provide the simplest route
into imaging for the brighter objects.

Sorry for the stupid questions, as I'm kind of lost and would
tremendously appreciate any assistance,
Seriously, imaging is _hard work_, and really requires a more rigid mount
than this. However a simple tracking motor, would allow you to see objects
better, and could be used with something like a webcam, to look at
planets, and the brighter DSO's.

Good Luck

Looking at the pictures, this looks like the EQ3-2 mount, rather than the
CG3, that this size scope is normally comes on!. Several companies sell
motor drive kits for these.
This is a _much_ more hopeful mount, but makes the scope model very
'puzzling'. Are you absolutely sure the scope is a Celestron?. As far as I
am aware, Celestron have never sold this mount version!...

Best Wishes

Roger Hamlett wrote:
Looking at the pictures, this looks like the EQ3-2 mount, rather than the
CG3, that this size scope is normally comes on!. Several companies sell
motor drive kits for these.
This is a _much_ more hopeful mount, but makes the scope model very
'puzzling'. Are you absolutely sure the scope is a Celestron?. As far as I
am aware, Celestron have never sold this mount version!...

Best Wishes




I thought I detected a Celestron label in one of those images. I will
check again.

Surprising there is no manual, which would settle the issue :-)

Phil

Hi all,

thank you very much for all the help and replies--you've been very
friendly in getting me on my way.

The scope is definitely a Celestron--at least that's what the sticker on
the side says--and it does say 910mm f/L (whether that's accurate is
another issue!)

There is a manual for the scope, but it was put into long-term storage
during our fairly stressful move to South America.

I think Mr. Hamlett is spot-on about the FirstScope 114EQ and the EQ3-2
mount--

http://www.telescopes.ca/telescopes/...051/11236.html

Due to the brute size and heft of this thing, I thought it screamed
"industrial strength--motorize me", but I guess I can wait with the
gizmos until I've spent a little more time with the basics. I have
found "dual-axis motors" online for this, but nothing PC-controllable.
I do succumb to gadget-itis, and as it was a gift, I didn't want to
start replacing major parts of it for sentimental reasons.

As for the polar alignment scope (thanks, wasn't sure of the right term)
there is what appears to be a socket through the "center" of the mount
which would fit some sort of accessory--I can't imagine that this would
be used to sight "as is". I've seen a friend's mount on a different
model/make telescope that had a proper optical sight with markings on
it. The brass ring at the bottom has three screws, and on the opposite
side of the mount there is a plastic cap which can be removed--it looks
very much like something could be slotted in there. Can someone offer
me a hint about where to go looking for this sort of thing?

Thanks for everyone's help, it is all enormously kind and appreciated!

-John

In article ,
Phil Wheeler wrote:

Phil Wheeler wrote:

BTW .. I was guessing it was a Powerseeker 127 as he

http://www.celestron.com/prod_pgs/tel/ps_index.htm

But if John's scope came with a manual, it should say what model it is.




I meant, of course, a Powerseeker 114

John Morgan Salomon wrote:
Hi all,

thank you very much for all the help and replies--you've been very
friendly in getting me on my way.

The scope is definitely a Celestron--at least that's what the sticker
on the side says--and it does say 910mm f/L (whether that's accurate
is another issue!)

There is a manual for the scope, but it was put into long-term
storage during our fairly stressful move to South America.

I think Mr. Hamlett is spot-on about the FirstScope 114EQ and the
EQ3-2 mount--

http://www.telescopes.ca/telescopes/...051/11236.html


Yup! It does list motor drives as an option at that website and says:

The heavy-duty EQ3-2 mount features 360 degree worm-gear tracking
controls on both axes, large knob-style R.A. and Dec. lock bolts,
dual metal setting circle dials, a latitude adjustment screw, and a
built-in polar scope holder. It can be fitted with both single and
double axis motor drive for auto-tracking.

but does not list the polar scope as an accessory. However, this
website does, near the bottom of page:

http://www.sherwoods-photo.co.uk/sky...nts_motors.htm

also he

http://www.islandeyepiece.com/starfi...polarscope.htm

and here is a manual on its use:

http://www.skywatchertelescope.net/D...Polarscope.pdf