Falcon Heavy - What can you do with 53 tonnes?

* I'm trying to 'find' payloads for this vehicle (although I'm sure Mr
Musk and company have ideas)....

* Dragon is a tad on the small size, but what about a sort of
'midi-shuttle'? A reuseable spaceplane would be a handy replacement for
STS.

* The payload fairing is way too small for the payload capacity, so will
there be other payload fairings for the FHeavy?

* Space stations, like Bigelow's BA-330?

* Moon program? I've come up with an idea that would have required
seven 'Delta V' (an LV that consists of four Delta IV CBC's strapped to
a New Core Stage with two RS-68 engines and the same burn time as the
CBC and a new upper stage with two RL-60/MB-60 engines; payload to LEO
was about 55 tonnes - 2 more than FHeavy, but I think I can tweek the
design) LV's and would put people back on the Moon in less than six
years. That program would cost over $300million per launch - SpaceX
just 'saved' me over $1.2 billion per year - more flights, or less
overall cost, or more development.

Mind you, Dragon might not be able to deal with the higher G ratings
needed for Lunar return, so a new crew return vehicle might be needed.

* Large interplanetary probes? What about a lander on Europa, Ganymede
or Callisto to perform a search for life. The lander would have to be
somewhat bigger than Viking (Mars) to carry a drilling rig, or it could
use a RTG-powered 'melter' to get through the ice.

Any other ideas? What about the much-touted fuel depot?

I think that in the light of the not really solid thinking they have gone
for something that could be handy for many things, which is probably a good
move.
On the re entry from the moon, I was thinking that maybe some kind of
inflatable large size sacrificial system might be possible for the short
critical period of max heating.

Brian

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Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Alan Erskine" wrote in message
nd.com...
* I'm trying to 'find' payloads for this vehicle (although I'm sure Mr
Musk and company have ideas)....

* Dragon is a tad on the small size, but what about a sort of
'midi-shuttle'? A reuseable spaceplane would be a handy replacement for
STS.

* The payload fairing is way too small for the payload capacity, so will
there be other payload fairings for the FHeavy?

* Space stations, like Bigelow's BA-330?

* Moon program? I've come up with an idea that would have required seven
'Delta V' (an LV that consists of four Delta IV CBC's strapped to a New
Core Stage with two RS-68 engines and the same burn time as the CBC and a
new upper stage with two RL-60/MB-60 engines; payload to LEO was about 55
tonnes - 2 more than FHeavy, but I think I can tweek the design) LV's and
would put people back on the Moon in less than six years. That program
would cost over $300million per launch - SpaceX just 'saved' me over $1.2
billion per year - more flights, or less overall cost, or more
development.

Mind you, Dragon might not be able to deal with the higher G ratings
needed for Lunar return, so a new crew return vehicle might be needed.

* Large interplanetary probes? What about a lander on Europa, Ganymede or
Callisto to perform a search for life. The lander would have to be
somewhat bigger than Viking (Mars) to carry a drilling rig, or it could
use a RTG-powered 'melter' to get through the ice.

Any other ideas? What about the much-touted fuel depot?

In article om,
says...

* I'm trying to 'find' payloads for this vehicle (although I'm sure Mr
Musk and company have ideas)....

Anything and everything DOD wants to fly, but at cheaper prices than
Delta IV Heavy. That alone ought to make Falcon Heavy successful.

On top of that, if NASA got off it's butt and flew a LEO fuel depot
demonstrator, Falcon Heavy tankers, and an appropriate reusable LOX/LH2
upper stage would give you a lot of capability for all sorts of beyond
LEO missions.

Jeff
--
" Solids are a branch of fireworks, not rocketry. :-) :-) ", Henry
Spencer 1/28/2011

In sci.space.shuttle message
gpond.com, Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:15:06, Alan Erskine
posted:

Mind you, Dragon might not be able to deal with the higher G ratings
needed for Lunar return, so a new crew return vehicle might be needed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_...Specifications :
In 2010 SpaceX's Elon Musk stated that the "Dragon is capable of re-
entering from a Lunar velocity, or even a Mars velocity with the heat
shield that it has."[10]

--
(c) John Stockton, nr London, UK. Turnpike v6.05.
Website http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/ - w. FAQish topics, links, acronyms
PAS EXE etc. : http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/programs/ - see in 00index.htm
Dates - miscdate.htm estrdate.htm js-dates.htm pas-time.htm critdate.htm etc.

On 16/04/2011 5:31 AM, Dr J R Stockton wrote:
In sci.space.shuttle
gpond.com, Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:15:06, Alan Erskine
posted:

Mind you, Dragon might not be able to deal with the higher G ratings
needed for Lunar return, so a new crew return vehicle might be needed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_...Specifications :
In 2010 SpaceX's Elon Musk stated that the "Dragon is capable of re-
entering from a Lunar velocity, or even a Mars velocity with the heat
shield that it has."[10]


Now that's interesting; I didn't know that! Thanks, Doc. Assuming
Falcon 9 can put 11 tonnes into orbit (no payload shroad will add
something to the payload ability), and with the figures of 6 tonnes
payload, it's 'safe' to assume Dragon weighs between four and five
tonnes empty. Right in the ball park of what I need.

Hmmm.... radiation sheilding....

On Apr 14, 6:06*am, Jeff Findley wrote:
In article om,
says...



* *I'm trying to 'find' payloads for this vehicle (although I'm sure Mr
Musk and company have ideas)....

Anything and everything DOD wants to fly, but at cheaper prices than
Delta IV Heavy. *That alone ought to make Falcon Heavy successful. *

On top of that, if NASA got off it's butt and flew a LEO fuel depot
demonstrator, Falcon Heavy tankers, and an appropriate reusable LOX/LH2
upper stage would give you a lot of capability for all sorts of beyond
LEO missions.

Jeff
--
" Solids are a branch of fireworks, not rocketry. :-) :-) ", Henry
Spencer 1/28/2011

The Boeing OASIS was a done deal as of more than a decade ago.

"L1 Gateway Report"

"Orbital Aggregation & Space Infrastructure Systems (OASIS)"

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...VDDb27MWQDQj4A

Not to mention my LSE-CM/ISS (lunar space elevator and its counter
mass international space station).

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

On 16/04/2011 10:54 PM, Brad Guth wrote:

Not to mention my LSE-CM/ISS (lunar space elevator and its counter
mass international space station).

http://translate.google.com/#
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / “Guth Usenet”

There's a problem with any space elevator - it's called 'other
satellites' - a space elevator will pass through the orbit of all LEO
satellites - so either the elevator will go, or the satellites will - I
doubt space elevators, even for the Moon will ever be built - simply not
useful enough.

In sci.space.shuttle message
pond.com, Sat, 16 Apr 2011 09:31:21, Alan Erskine
posted:

On 16/04/2011 5:31 AM, Dr J R Stockton wrote:
In sci.space.shuttle
gpond.com, Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:15:06, Alan Erskine
posted:

Mind you, Dragon might not be able to deal with the higher G ratings
needed for Lunar return, so a new crew return vehicle might be needed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_...Specifications :
In 2010 SpaceX's Elon Musk stated that the "Dragon is capable of re-
entering from a Lunar velocity, or even a Mars velocity with the heat
shield that it has."[10]


Now that's interesting; I didn't know that! Thanks, Doc. Assuming
Falcon 9 can put 11 tonnes into orbit (no payload shroad will add
something to the payload ability), and with the figures of 6 tonnes
payload, it's 'safe' to assume Dragon weighs between four and five
tonnes empty. Right in the ball park of what I need.

That agrees with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_%28spacecraft%29
4200kg dry mass, apparently copied from old http://www.spacex.com/Space
X_Brochure_V7_All.pdf. The dry mass seems not to be in the more recent
http://www.spacex.com/downloads/spacex-brochure.pdf.

--
(c) John Stockton, nr London, UK. Turnpike v6.05.
Website http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/ - w. FAQish topics, links, acronyms
PAS EXE etc. : http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/programs/ - see in 00index.htm
Dates - miscdate.htm estrdate.htm js-dates.htm pas-time.htm critdate.htm etc.