How early can life have started? 12 billion years ago!

Or at least that's the theory put forward by two scientists. They are
calculating how early several essential ingredients of life may have
started in the universe and when they would've been in enough abundance
to start forming life somewhere in the Universe.

Yousuf Khan

SPACE.com -- Could Life Be 12 Billion Years Old?
"Aparna Venkatesan, of the University of San Francisco, and Lynn
Rothschild, of NASA's Ames Research Center in Moffett Field, Calif., are
using models of star formation and destruction to determine when in the
roughly 13.7 billion-year history of the universe the biogenic elements
– those essential to life as we know it – might have been pervasive
enough to allow life to form."
http://www.space.com/scienceastronom...-elements.html

Sam Wormley wrote:
H, C, N, O should be sufficient... the latter three produced in the
first generation of stars.


Well, actually, they say that it took a bit longer for C & N to form,
since the first generation of stars were likely behemoths that blew up
quickly and produced a lot of iron and magnesium. Later generations of
small and medium sized stars were needed to form C, N, O.

Yousuf Khan

On Jun 17, 1:07 pm, Sam Wormley wrote:
Yousuf Khan wrote:
Sam Wormley wrote:
H, C, N, O should be sufficient... the latter three produced in the
first generation of stars.

Well, actually, they say that it took a bit longer for C & N to form,
since the first generation of stars were likely behemoths that blew up
quickly and produced a lot of iron and magnesium. Later generations of
small and medium sized stars were needed to form C, N, O.

Yousuf Khan

You are wrong... look up stellar evolution... stars can't fuse magnesium
(and eventually iron) directly from hydrogen (or helium).

And you are in fantasyland.
We've looked that far away and seen
fully-formed galaxies.

And surprise, surprise- all the galaxies all the
way out to the limit of our sight have fully-formed
discrete ARMS of stars from center to edge.
Imagine that!?

There was no Big Bang.

The only way EVERY point can observe uniform
red-shifting is if it is solely due to the effect
of distance on the light.

NUMBskulls. But too hardened in your false
premises to change- oh well- like your diet of
God's creatures; enslaved, tortured, and then
eaten. Surprise, surprise- cancer, arthritis, suffering is
what you get, but you gotta taste that burger!!!

Graze the cows on half the
world's grains- cut down rainforest to feed them
one season- let people go hungry.

HEY. It's a good life until you are in
your twenties, then give your money to the
drug companies and your spine slowly curls
up.

john

Yousuf Khan wrote:

Or at least that's the theory put forward by two scientists. They are
calculating how early several essential ingredients of life may have
started in the universe and when they would've been in enough abundance
to start forming life somewhere in the Universe.
[snip]

So sad.

Google Images
miller urey 8520 hits

--
Uncle Al
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/
(Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals)
http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/lajos.htm#a2

On Jun 17, 1:53 pm, Uncle Al wrote:
Yousuf Khan wrote:

Or at least that's the theory put forward by two scientists. They are
calculating how early several essential ingredients of life may have
started in the universe and when they would've been in enough abundance
to start forming life somewhere in the Universe.

[snip]

So sad.

Google Images
miller urey 8520 hits

--
The only way EVERY point can observe uniform
red-shifting is if it is solely due to the effect
of distance on the light.
Translation: no expansion

On Jun 17, 10:59*am, Yousuf Khan wrote:
Or at least that's the theory put forward by two scientists. They are
calculating how early several essential ingredients of life may have
started in the universe and when they would've been in enough abundance
to start forming life somewhere in the Universe.

Oxygen begins to bind hydrogen at sunspot temperatures ~3200 K.
The atmospheres of K and M stars are awash with water.
http://www.aanda.org/index.php?optio...34/aade292.pdf
Below 3200 K, water is the primary substrate of interstellar
chemistry:
C + H2O -- CO, the marker (maser) for interstellar hydrogen
Si + H20 -- SiO4, the anion of olivine FeMgSiO4, the pincipal
component of circumstellar dust.
John Curtis

Dear john240509:

"john240509" wrote in message
...
....
The only way EVERY point can observe uniform
red-shifting is if it is solely due to the effect
of distance on the light.
Translation: no expansion

No. Translation, distance changes are the same for all points at
a given age. Aka. expansion with allowance for acceleration.

David A. Smith

"N:dlzc D:aol T:com (dlzc)" wrote in message
...
Dear john240509:

"john240509" wrote in message
...
...
The only way EVERY point can observe uniform
red-shifting is if it is solely due to the effect
of distance on the light.
Translation: no expansion

No. Translation, distance changes are the same for all points at a given
age. Aka. expansion with allowance for acceleration.

David A. Smith

Deer N:dlzc D:aol T:com (dlzc):
No. Translation, the pencil is bent if you can see it is.
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu...ic/brokpen.jpg

BTW... idiot.

Sam Wormley wrote:
Yousuf Khan wrote:
Sam Wormley wrote:
H, C, N, O should be sufficient... the latter three produced in the
first generation of stars.


Well, actually, they say that it took a bit longer for C & N to form,
since the first generation of stars were likely behemoths that blew up
quickly and produced a lot of iron and magnesium. Later generations of
small and medium sized stars were needed to form C, N, O.

Yousuf Khan

You are wrong... look up stellar evolution... stars can't fuse magnesium
(and eventually iron) directly from hydrogen (or helium).

That's not what I said, I said that when those behemoths blow up, they
will have already fused a lot of iron and magnesium in their cores which
are then spread around by the explosion. The percentage of C, N, & O are
smaller in these massive cores, presumably because they've been consumed
to produce the Fe and Mg. No one said anything about fusing hydrogen or
helium directly to Mg & Fe.

Yousuf Khan