A *real* observation report

I know this is going to upset some people. But remember, this is an
unmoderated forum here so I will speak my mind. I won't be the first
and I certainly won't be the last to stray into taboo OT.


The following was posted today in Moderated sci.astro.amateur by a
fine and well-known amateur:

FYI, I installed wxAstroCapture software available for download from
http://arnholm.org/astro/software/wxAstroCapture/ on my notebook
with MS Vista and it works great - in fact it works better than any
capture program I have tried.


Here is my reply to that individual:

Well, let me step up to the plate and say that is wonderful news,
Jeff. Others would be stepping up to the plate to say the same thing
I am sure, but for some reason they seem to have forgotten where our
plate is. Several of our members, who have posted and replied here in
the past, are quite active in sci.astro.amateur now, while not coming
back here even to read the forum. Seems real strange to me. One of
our previously active topic starters and posters contributed a very
nice post today to s.a.a. only to be told to "dream on. . .fuc
nuts" (sic) by a resident *****. Why on earth anyone would tolerate
that stuff escapes me. It is possible that some have been swimming
and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****. I think it is more
likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.

So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

wrote in message
oups.com...

I know this is going to upset some people. But remember, this is an
unmoderated forum here so I will speak my mind. I won't be the first
and I certainly won't be the last to stray into taboo OT.


The following was posted today in Moderated sci.astro.amateur by a
fine and well-known amateur:

FYI, I installed wxAstroCapture software available for download from
http://arnholm.org/astro/software/wxAstroCapture/ on my notebook
with MS Vista and it works great - in fact it works better than any
capture program I have tried.


Here is my reply to that individual:

Well, let me step up to the plate and say that is wonderful news,
Jeff. Others would be stepping up to the plate to say the same thing
I am sure, but for some reason they seem to have forgotten where our
plate is. Several of our members, who have posted and replied here in
the past, are quite active in sci.astro.amateur now, while not coming
back here even to read the forum. Seems real strange to me. One of
our previously active topic starters and posters contributed a very
nice post today to s.a.a. only to be told to "dream on. . .fuc
nuts" (sic) by a resident *****. Why on earth anyone would tolerate
that stuff escapes me. It is possible that some have been swimming
and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****. I think it is more
likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.

So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

You know, Martin, your group needs to sink or swim on it's OWN merits, and
not by your politicking here...

Bye, now...

--
Jan Owen

To reach me directly, remove the Z, if one appears in my e-mail address...
Latitude: 33.6
Longitude: -112.3
http://community.webshots.com/user/janowen21

wrote in message
oups.com...

I know this is going to upset some people. But remember, this is an
unmoderated forum here so I will speak my mind. I won't be the first
and I certainly won't be the last to stray into taboo OT.


The following was posted today in Moderated sci.astro.amateur by a
fine and well-known amateur:

FYI, I installed wxAstroCapture software available for download from
http://arnholm.org/astro/software/wxAstroCapture/ on my notebook
with MS Vista and it works great - in fact it works better than any
capture program I have tried.


Here is my reply to that individual:

Well, let me step up to the plate and say that is wonderful news,
Jeff. Others would be stepping up to the plate to say the same thing
I am sure, but for some reason they seem to have forgotten where our
plate is. Several of our members, who have posted and replied here in
the past, are quite active in sci.astro.amateur now, while not coming
back here even to read the forum. Seems real strange to me. One of
our previously active topic starters and posters contributed a very
nice post today to s.a.a. only to be told to "dream on. . .fuc
nuts" (sic) by a resident *****. Why on earth anyone would tolerate
that stuff escapes me. It is possible that some have been swimming
and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****. I think it is more
likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.

So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.


I just tried to unsubscribe from your *whatever it is* wannabe SAA, and it
won't LET me... So YOU take care of it YOURSELF... But never fear, I won't
be back...

--
Jan Owen

To reach me directly, remove the Z, if one appears in my e-mail address...
Latitude: 33.6
Longitude: -112.3
http://community.webshots.com/user/janowen21

--
Jan Owen

To reach me directly, remove the Z, if one appears in my e-mail address...
Latitude: 33.6
Longitude: -112.3
http://community.webshots.com/user/janowen21

On Aug 25, 6:04 pm, Esmail wrote:
wrote:

It is possible that some have been swimming and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****.

...
I think it is more

likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.

I don't think your approach of insulting those of us who frequent
s.a.a. is a very effective way to attract (and retain?) members.

Any curiosity I may have had about your forum has consequently
been lost. I don't think you are doing your forum or anyone a
service with these sorts of postings.

Just my 2 cents.



This is not an indictment of all. Note the word I used twice. . .the
word "some."

I will not defend my remarks. I think they are spot-on for many
people. Not all. I posted here a couple of days ago to the Dumbell
Nebula tread and I couldn't whether that reply of mine was tossed or
stroked by people. Let the chips fall where they may. I put many,
many, hours and much work into the forum and am proud of it and have
made certain it goes places and offers things not available in others.

This is my last post to s.a.a.

Have fun, all.

On Sun, 26 Aug 2007 00:28:23 -0000, wrote:

So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

Martin-

You have to have known there was a real risk in what you're trying to do
with your forum. After all, there are already a number of forums that
are similar, such as Cloudy Nights, as well as any number of Yahoo
groups. The fact is, most of the folks hanging out here on SAA like this
environment. It's evolution: those who don't like it have already left.
The newsgroup interface is a good one, which can't be duplicated on the
Web (although Yahoo groups, listservs, and other email-based systems can
come close). I also expect most of us have pretty thick skins. Good
discussions continue here, and if the occasional idiot tosses in some
insult or non-sequitor, it doesn't really matter. I certainly don't feel
insulted by anything Gerald or Min can toss at me. And frankly, I find
some of the off-the-wall stuff quite amusing.

Best of luck with your project... it's obvious you've invested a lot of
time in it, and I hope it works out for you and that you find your
niche.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

wrote:

I think it is more likely though that some continue to post there and not
here because...

You think /way/ too much. Get a freakin' life.

Holycow, Martin...

wrote:
I know this is going to upset some people.

So you're saying that you're aware of trampling on others' toes. That
alone could qualify someone as being a jerk.

But remember, this is an unmoderated forum here so I will speak my mind.

Sounds like you have a problem with free speech, so you're going to do
your darndest to be as ofensive as possible to impose your personal
concept of being a benevolent dictator.

I won't be the first and I certainly won't be the last to stray into taboo OT.

Does that make it right to do so? No despot sice the first in history
was the first, but good riddance to all of them.

The following was posted today in Moderated sci.astro.amateur by a
fine and well-known amateur:

Giving validity to your credentials?

FYI, I installed wxAstroCapture software available for download from
http://arnholm.org/astro/software/wxAstroCapture/ on my notebook
with MS Vista and it works great - in fact it works better than any
capture program I have tried.

Okay, nice beginning to an on-topic post...

Here is my reply to that individual:

The pitch...

Well, let me step up to the plate and say that is wonderful news,
Jeff.

Building the foundation that you know how to be nice...

Others would be stepping up to the plate to say the same thing
I am sure, but for some reason they seem to have forgotten where our
plate is.

So not only do you have things to say about what people shouldn't say,
but you feel you can complain about *lack* of speech.

Several of our members, who have posted and replied here in
the past, are quite active in sci.astro.amateur now, while not coming
back here even to read the forum. Seems real strange to me.

It could be because you're into your own invention, and have no
understanding for how the options available can have advantages.
That's pretty single-minded.

One of our previously active topic starters and posters contributed a very
nice post today to s.a.a. only to be told to "dream on. . .fuc
nuts" (sic) by a resident *****.

Life's unfair, and there are reasons to belive the gene pool could use
some chlorine. Oh well.

Why on earth anyone would tolerate that stuff escapes me.

For my part, I'd consider the source. If it any of a variety of
nitwits, I wouldn't care about their opinion. Everybody can find
offense at anything anyone says, so you just have to put up with
offending someone no matter what you might say. You have to grow a
skin.

It is possible that some have been swimming
and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****.

Was that really necessary? It certainly wasn't critical thinking.

I think it is more
likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.

I think it sounds more like you're trying to make those of us who stay
here feel bad about being here at all. Talk about needing attention...

So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

Do you seriously think that because old-timers stay here is because
they need some strokling?

This place has been here for over a decade. Longer than you. Unless
there's a major shift in how the Internet as a whole works in the
future, it will be here for a long time to come.

You AND your forum could disappear tomorrow. Sure, someone else could
start a new one. Indeed, some have. So we might need to pick up 'nyms
again, have to fire up some web browser, and log in and hope that
everything is working AOK, remember yet more passwords. For Usenet, we
can have a variety of clients, and even have Usenet delievered via
e-mail (yes, such service does exist - not well known because it's
clumsy, but for some it's the only way...). We CAN use web browsers to
get to a variety of other servers, like Google, Usenet Replayer... But
for your forum, we need to rely on you or an anointed bishop (no pun
there, Dennis) in your See to decide you have the time to approve
messages. You could get bored, or a life, and then the game is
sporadic.

Usenet is as old as the Internet, and it seems it'll be here for a
while, and we don't have a megalomaniac whining about what we should
and shouldn't say.

Thanks, but your attitude makes me wary of your world as a place I
want to visit.

Good luck with your dominion.
=============
- Dale Gombert (SkySea at aol.com)
122.38W, 47.58N, W. Seattle, WA

wrote:

I know this is going to upset some people. But remember, this is an
unmoderated forum here so I will speak my mind. I won't be the first
and I certainly won't be the last to stray into taboo OT.

The following was posted today in Moderated sci.astro.amateur by a
fine and well-known amateur:

FYI, I installed wxAstroCapture software available for download from
http://arnholm.org/astro/software/wxAstroCapture/ on my notebook
with MS Vista and it works great - in fact it works better than any
capture program I have tried.

Here is my reply to that individual:

Well, let me step up to the plate and say that is wonderful news,
Jeff. Others would be stepping up to the plate to say the same thing
I am sure, but for some reason they seem to have forgotten where our
plate is. Several of our members, who have posted and replied here in
the past, are quite active in sci.astro.amateur now, while not coming
back here even to read the forum. Seems real strange to me. One of
our previously active topic starters and posters contributed a very
nice post today to s.a.a. only to be told to "dream on. . .fuc
nuts" (sic) by a resident *****. Why on earth anyone would tolerate
that stuff escapes me. It is possible that some have been swimming
and drinking from the cesspool that s.a.a. has become so long now that
they are used to the smell and taste of ****. I think it is more
likely though that some continue to post there and not here because
they are seeking and need the attention -- and perhaps a few ego
stroking responses -- that one or more of the remaining "good" people
there MAY offer.


You can stop right here. Arnholm software is good. I use
several of his and would be almost lost without them, and fair
priced also not to mention the free advice he has given me
several times which mattered a lot to me.

Th rest of what you say sounds a little hypocritical to me. Good
luck with your group and better luck here at SAA!

Reagrds.




So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

wrote:


This is my last post to s.a.a.

Have fun, all.


Hi, there, Martin, and I'll miss you here.

Personally I'd urge that we take each forum as a positive asset,
celebrate it in its own terms, and accept that people quite
naturally will have different tastes or priorities.

Judicious moderation can sometimes promote civility, something
I indeed value; this calls for delicate judgement, and I'm sure
that you'll strive to make your forum a hospitable place.

An unmoderated forum also has its advantages, but at the high
price of some abuse _on_ the net and _of_ the net that could
hardly be considered an admirable feature. People might choose
to stay, to go, or even use both this forum and moderated ones
such as yours -- and I'd respect all of these options. I can
feel at home on unmoderated and moderated forums alike, as long
as the moderation is exercised with restraint and fairness --
which I understand is your approach.

Let's not underestimate the strength of community in settings
new and old. Reading the observation reports that get posted
here can lend lots of impetus to my own observing, and it's
fun to compare notes -- also possible on moderated forums,
of course.

Thus I'd like to thank you for your contributions here, one of
which gave both my Mom and I a bit of comic relief and also
caused us to praise your talents as a poet, and wish your
forum the best.

This is a big universe, with room for lots of forums.

Most appreciatively,

Margo Schulter

Lat. 38.566 Long. -121.430

On Aug 26, 2:31 am, Chris L Peterson wrote:
On Sun, 26 Aug 2007 00:28:23 -0000, wrote:
So thanks to the few that continue to be active here. Perhaps at some
point, the others who register and never return (for months) or post
once or twice never to return, will sooner or later have more pride
than to needlessly take the abuse being shelved on them at s.a.a.

Martin-

You have to have known there was a real risk in what you're trying to do
with your forum. After all, there are already a number of forums that
are similar, such as Cloudy Nights, as well as any number of Yahoo
groups. The fact is, most of the folks hanging out here on SAA like this
environment. It's evolution: those who don't like it have already left.
The newsgroup interface is a good one, which can't be duplicated on the
Web (although Yahoo groups, listservs, and other email-based systems can
come close). I also expect most of us have pretty thick skins. Good
discussions continue here, and if the occasional idiot tosses in some
insult or non-sequitor, it doesn't really matter. I certainly don't feel
insulted by anything Gerald or Min can toss at me. And frankly, I find
some of the off-the-wall stuff quite amusing.


No offense sunshine but you share the same astrological outlook as
Daniel,as far as I am concerned you insult yourselves by believing in
ideas such as the natural noon cycle is 24 hours exactly in order to
justify the value of 23 hours 56 minutes 04 seconds -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidereal_time

Far from dying,the first signs of astronomy are surfacing from behind
the weak magnification exercise to which you lot limit astronomy and
especially from behind the unnatural astrological framework which you
believe exists.

The creation of the equable 24 hour day and how each of these cycle
elapse into each other represents one of the greatest of human
achievements by recognising how the natural noon cycles are
unequal,then you go on to admire how clocks are kept in sync with the
axial cycle for the purpose of determining location based on the
correlation between 4 minutes of clock time for each degree of
geographical seperation.

You can go on to make the really big discoveries in climatological and
geological disciplines based on terrestrial dynamics but if you cannot
rise above the dumb view of tying axial rotation directly to a
constellational framework then you will remain nothing other than
astrologers with telescopes and that is that.

Insult you !,you insult yourselves quite nicely .



Best of luck with your project... it's obvious you've invested a lot of
time in it, and I hope it works out for you and that you find your
niche.

_________________________________________________

Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatoryhttp://www.cloudbait.com