"Bill Sheppard" wrote in message...
...

From Painius:

The nuclear "strong force" is believed to
exist solely to bond together all those
positively charged protons, thereby
overcoming the effects of the electrical
repulsion of these charges. Moreover,
scientists at present believe that the
strong force has absolutely no influence
out beyond the confines of the atomic
nucleus.

The key term is "_believed_ not to exist outside the nucleus". Yet what
is magnetism if not the spatial inflow into the _poles_ of the proton..
into the seat of the strong nuclear force within? Seems sorta like a no
brainer. Magnetism's 'sign', i.e., its 'N' and 'S' polarity, is
determined by spin direction of the inflow.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. My disagreement lies with gravity
*also* being associated with the strong force. Neither you nor Wolter
seem to go along with the quantum need for the Weak Nuclear Force.
It is needed for several reasons, and because of this, scientists are
convinced that there indeed *is* a weak nuclear force.

And for me the no-brainer has always been that electromagnetic force
is associated with the strong nuclear force and that gravity is connected
with the weak nuclear force.

Since science does not consider the strong nuclear force as being an
inverse square force, science of course does not accept these
associations.

. . .
And it would seem to be a simple matter
to show this connection using
mathematics.

And what if we were operating under the Roman numeral system? Would we
be forever barred and banned from understanding unification? Seems more
like the 'primacy of math' fixation is barring understanding.

And yet, we are *not* operating under the Roman numeral system. You
are not operating under *any* system of mathematics, and that's the rub.

To make sure we understand each other, i want you to know that after
many months of studying Wolter's ideas, i happen to see a lot of good
in them.

I am *not* talking about using math to understand your ideas. Yes, there
have been times when math was the path to understanding. We all seem
to remember a time when, under Newton, there were two separate laws
of conservation for mass and for energy. Then along came the old man
and, using math, was able to show the equivalency of mass and energy.
So this is a classic case where math was instrumental in understanding a
new idea.

Many other times in the history of science, the understanding of an idea
came *before* the math, such as in your case. Ptolemy, for example
was certain that everything in the sky revolved around the Earth. He
*understood* this "fact" first, and then used math to "confirm" the idea.

And Ptolemy's math stood up to scientific scrutiny for a long, long time.

All too often this has been the case. We understand something, and
then use math to prove that what we understand is true. And all too
often, as in the case of Ptolemy, later students use math to refute the
earlier understanding and to bring the world to a better understanding
of how the universe works.

So hopefully you can see why others may be turned off by the idea of
understanding something without the aid of the scientifically universal
usage of math to confirm or refute the understanding. I forget whether
it was John or OG who implied it, but your dedication to undermining
the need for math smacks of your fear that Wolter's ideas would be
refuted if math were applied to them. Though i believe that many of
Wolter's ideas would be confirmed if math were to be applied to them.

You may call it the "primacy of math" and shun it if you wish, but math,
primal or not, is the Universal Scientific Language or tool used *not*
just to understand an idea, but also to confirm or deny it. Without
math, you and Wolter's ideas will never go any farther than this. The
only other possibility would be that someone else will apply the math
and take credit for Wolter's confirmed ideas. This seems to be what
you want to happen.

happy days and...
starry starry nights!

--
Everytime you listen to a song,
When you hear a voice who likes to sing
How your lovin' eyes are everything,
Think of me just singin' right along.

Close your eyes and listen carefully,
Hear me sing my love forever true,
Every word of my love meant for you,
Every song a sing-a-long from me.

Paine Ellsworth