canopus56 wrote:
145 CMa (HD056577) - the Winter Albireo - is at it's most favorable low
declination position (J071636.00-231912.0) for 41N op's. 145 CMa is
visible in small refractors after sunset from urban light polluted
skies. snip
Offline, a correspondent "Mike" asked:
What catalogs do 145 CMa / HD 056577 appear in?
My apologies if the informal designation of Herschel 3945, the Winter
Albireo, as 145 CMa, caused more heat than light. I had always learned
this binary as "145 CMa," I believe it was from Harrington's TUBA. You
are correct to critize the informal desigation of this binary as 145
CMa. As to an authoritative cite, the short answer is that the "A"
component (HD56577, HR2764) are cross-referenced in Kostjuk (2002)
HD-DM-GC-HR-HIP-Bayer-Flamsteed Cross Index CDS IV/27 as:
HD56577
HR2764
CD-23 5189
HIP35210
---- 145 CMa ------
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?IV/27
One simple method establishing an association between Component A of
Herschel 3945 and 145 CMa, is to in "145 CMa" into the CDS Simbad
database.
http://simbad.u-strasbg.fr/sim-fid.pl
Simbad returns a number of cross-references for 145 CMa, including:
* 145 CMa
ADS 5951 A
CCDM J07166-2319A
HD 56577
HR 2764
SAO 173349
SKY# 13175
Feeding in the HD designation for the B Component of Herschel 3945 -
HD56578 - gives:
** HJ 3945B
ADS 5951 B
CCDM J07166-2319B
CD-23 5192
HIC 35213
HIP 35213
SKY# 13177
As to how CDS Simbad associates 145 CMa with the A Component of
Herschel 3945, a more detailed list of catalogue links between
Component A and 145 CMa is appended.
Again, you are correct to critize the informal designation of this
binary as 145 CMa. A better, and admittedly less confusing
designation, would have been it's formal discoverer designation -
Herschel 3945.
From the perspective of non-double star observing amateurs - the
intended target of the post - Herschel 3945 is the designation used in
the Belmont Society Colorful Doubles List and is the most returned
designation from a web engine search on the phrase "Winter Albireo."
Personally, I can never seem to remember "HJ3945," while the Flamsteed
designation "145 CMa" is more easily remembered.
In general, the appropriate method to refer to multiple star systems is
by their CCDM (Catalogue of the Components of Double and Multiple
Stars) designation, or their discover designation, e.g. HJ3945,
**STF761.
For informal observing of bright doubles, I prefer to simply remember
the Flamsteed or Bayer designation of the star, e.g. sig Ori, pi Gem,
zet Per, or 145 CMa. That is technically improper, but it is easier to
use when pointing the telescope.
This triggered an inquiry to the Starry Night
support forum (figured I was doing something wrong),
and the response I got was that there are hundreds
of catalogs and the developers could not
use them all, and they agreed that these
numbers are not in the SN database.
The software I use is Cartes du Ciel which also does not return 145
CMa, but does position fix on "HD56577". In my defense of the informal
designation use, Cartes du Ciel, as installed out-of-the-box, does not
return Herschel 3945 either - at least unless specialty supplemental
catalogues are installed. I suspect that Starry Night will not return
"Herschel 3945" either.
As a general note on using various software packages, it is not unusual
to have various software package not return positions to the most
commonly used catalogue name designations. Alot of time is spent
"decoding" designations and finding the one that your software will
recognize. Typically, users install add-on catalogues and indices for
their area of interest, e.g. DSOs or double stars.
From my infrequent use of Starry Night (and hazy recollections my
difficulties in using it), for example, out-of-the-box, Starry Night
would not find a number of galaxies by NGC number - you had to decode
and find the "PGC" Principal Galaxy Catalogue cross-reference number.
In conclusion, you are not doing anything wrong. Failed
cross-references within a software package is a common problem in the
hobby. For DSOs and stars, I find the CDS Simbad database and
invaluable tool in that regard:
CDS Simbad in Strasbourg, France
http://simbad.u-strasbg.fr/sim-fid.pl
CDS Simbad mirrored at Harvard, U.S.
http://simbad.harvard.edu/Simbad
For bright stars, Kostjuk (2002) catalogue
("HD-DM-GC-HR-HIP-Bayer-Flamsteed Cross Index") is an invaluable
resource that I frequently use. I have downloaded a copy of the entire
catalogue as an HTML document using the Simbad catalogue service.
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?IV/27
Then I imported a local copy of the catalogue as an HTML document into
Excel and cleaned it up.
In conclusion, it is unfortunate that Starry Night and/or Cartes du
Ciel do not quickly return a position fix on common references to this
beautiful winter binary. It is a colorful binary that is often
overlooked by beginners. Hopefully, your web conversations will spur
the developers to correct this minor omission.
- Regards, Canopus56
Addendum
===============
Catalogue linking Herschel 3945 to 145 CMa
===============
----------------
The CCDM links CCDM J07166-2319A to HJ3945, the Winter Albireo's most
formal-discover designation, to:
CCDMJ07166-2319B and HIC35213 and the A component - HIC35210.
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?I/274
----------------
Dommanget, J. The visual double stars observed by the Hipparcos
satellite. Astron. Astrophys. 363, 991 (2000)
links HJ3945 to:
HIP35210
CCDM07166-2319A
HIP35213
CCDM07166-2319B
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?I/260
----------------
The Hipparcos Input Catalogue, Version 2 (1993) links HIP35210 and
HIP3523 provides the following cross-references:
HIC35210
BD-23 117
CD -23 5189
HD56577
SAO173349
HIC35213
BD -23 118
CD -23 5192
CPD-23 2015
HD56578
SAO173353
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?I/196
----------------
The Yale Bright Star Catalogue, 5th Revised Ed.(Hoffleit+, 1991)
catalogue cross-references HD56577 to:
HR2764
ADS5951
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?V/50
----------------
Kostjuk (2002) HD-DM-GC-HR-HIP-Bayer-Flamsteed Cross Index CDS IV/27
cross-references HR2764 and HD56577 to 145 CMa, as discussed above.
http://cdsweb.u-strasbg.fr/viz-bin/Cat?IV/27