On 30 Jan 2004 12:13:14 -0800, (Tom Merkle) wrote:

"Paul F. Dietz" wrote in message ...

But, in any case: **** you, Mr. Merkle. A spelling error
isn't the same as persistent aggressive ignorance
from the poster I was castigating.

Paul
ok, it was smartass, but:

A) lighten up dude.

Yes, sit back, relax and a few deep breaths.

B) you're wrong on what you were giving Cardman **** about. Ice wasn't
detected in the soil, hydrogen was detected in the soil. We assume
from the temperature and pressure that it has to be ice, but some
people are even starting to question that assumption based on the
observed behavior of soil around the Martian rovers.

And that explains my first comment about the ground looking a touch
wet, but there has been other areas of doubt in the past, which are
based around recently formed Mars surface features and the unexpected
huge volume of hydrogen detected in the top few meters of soil.

After all having that much water in the soil (if proved) already goes
to shatter standard models, when something unexpected must be going on
to account for such a huge volume.

It's been
proposed that with a high enough salt content

Oh yes I forget about that factor, when that hardly gets mentioned,
but equally there could even be other factors that come into play that
no one has yet thought of.

After all if they knew what was going on, then there would be no need
to look. I just hope that these MERs at least can detect salt content,
when that can certainly help in turning ice into water.

and certain soil
characteristics, there could be water that is liquid (at a microscopic
level) on the Martian surface.

Surface was a little further than I would have gone, even if the
ground at times looks a touch wet, but only a little way down I could
well believe that there is liquid water there.

One reason for such belief is that cramming your world full of water
down into the ground would produce a very water orientated result.

Not puddles of it, but high moisture content in the soil (that's wet
water, not ice.)

And if you ask me, then things are going to get a whole load more
impressive the further that you go down. That is why I am greatly
looking forwards to see what Mars Express can confirm.

After all no one has even looked more than a few meters down into the
soil before, where saying that you understand what is going on in the
ground is like saying that you can understand the inside of an orange
just by looking at the peel.

Obviously you cannot understand the soil of Mars until you have had a
really good look at it. Coming to a Martian probe near you soon.

So call him a moron
all you want, you end up looking dumb yourself.

Just someone getting upset believing that they know it all and
starting to find out that they don't.

Anyway, a toast to the Martian soil. May you have lots of water and
only a little ice. When after all finding water on Mars is a big step
towards finding life on Mars.

Cardman
http://www.cardman.com
http://www.cardman.co.uk