Raving Loonie wrote:
Double-A wrote:
Raving Loonie wrote:
Double-A wrote:


I see what you are saying there, Double-A

Tholen: Famous astronomer.
- asterism

Bruce: Infamous arsehole.
- asterick

Are you suggesting that they are made for each other ?



Double-A

RL


RL, the more I find out about Tholen, the more impressed I am with his
standing in the scientific community. I am at a loss to explain his
antics here on Usenet, but when I went back over that most recent
thread, he really was asking a serious question about OS2 in the
appropriate group, when Bruce jumped him with an insult, followed by
PJR, and then the rest of the AUKers jumped in, followed by the rest of
us. Perhaps he just perceived us as more harassers. I really wish he
would share some of his knowledge with some astronomy related posts,
but I guess if he doesn't want to, he has that choice. Since it
appears to be really he who is posting here (with that noted
exception), I am not feeling good about being any further part of
harassing the man.

Double-A

as=B7ter=B7ism Audio pronunciation of "asterism" ( P ) Pronunciation
Key (st-rzm)
n.

1. Printing. Three asterisks in a triangular formation used to call
attention to a following passage.
2. Astronomy. A cluster of stars smaller than a constellation.
3. Mineralogy. A six-rayed starlike figure optically produced in
some crystal structures by reflected or transmitted light.

~ dictionary.com

Double-A, notice that I did not say anything disrespectful of Prof.
Tholen in my response to you.


I never meant to imply that you did.


I am glad that you came to this conclusion, yourself. I have been aware
of such for quite awhile.


I know that you've been more respectful of him than I have. It's just
that when I saw his posts in alt.astronomy, I wanted to see if I could
get him to make some astronomy related posts. It went down hill from
there. Looking back at the entire thread in comp.os.os2.apps, I can
now see how his serious tread was hijacked and crossposted. Can't
blame him for being ****ed at everybody.

He has been through alt.astronomy before, giving everybody that "what
has this got to do with astronomy" line (at least I think it was him),
so I already had an attitude about him. But I now must defer to his
many discoveries in astronomy and respect him for that.

That audio interview with Tholen that I posted is very interesting. To
learn of all the football sized asteroids that pass between the Earth
and Moon and are moving too fast to photographed is unnerving!


The "Tholen" travelling road show has been going on for quite a few
years now. I think that everyone, including David Tholen would benefit
from having a few more considerations pointed out.

He has suffered a great deal through relentless harassment over the
years. It's easy to be sympathetic to how he feels about this. I am
happy to accept him, any way that I find him.

Unfortunately, like anyone, he sometimes doesn't make things easy for
himself.

Not everyone seems able to come to recognize what you do about David
Tholen. Wheeas you and I may accept him, there are others who
don't/cannot do so. ... That is what perpetuates the "circus", herein.

Criticizing Tholen on his behavior as arises from him being bullied by
his detractors is a non starter ... Such relentless intrusion could
turn anyone into a 'nutjob'. You, yourself have had a small dose of
it. Imagine what it must be like having to deal with it for years!

In the last day or two, I have allowed myself to become deliberately
angry with David. I am very deliberate about this.

Myself and others have considerable genuine respect and sympathy for
him. I have no difficulty with emphasizing with his predicament.

For whatever reasons ??? , he doesn't seem to know who his friends are,
or at least those who appreciate and respect his contribution, here in
Usenet.


Until I started researching him, I hadn't seen him make any serious
posts. That's why I thought he might be merely a bot. But I finally
found that he has attempted to make serious posts, and gotten hijacked!


Everyone has their own skill, Double-A. I may not know much about
astronomy; .. I may be a third rate, physical scientist, but I do know
what I do well; what I can be confident in.

I knew when I had outperformed Prof. Tholen in an intellectual sense;
whilst at one and the same time as being supportive and respectful of
his own efforts.

Instead of seeing the situation as such, he treated me as a detractor
and started to be nasty about it. ... See http://tinyurl.com/bn9fx
which is where I went negative.

He failed to pick up on someone (such as myself) who appreciates him
for who he is in the skilled sense and re-interprets it as disrespect.

There is nothing unique in this. This awkward turn of interpretation
has occured with others on Usenet.

Frankly, I don't care. I respect David Tholen and I will continue to do
so, regardless of whatever his response is or isn't to me. My
accpetance isn't contingent upon any reciprocity. Prof. Tholen earned
my respect by being himself and doing what he does. We are both
'irrelevent'. This is Usenet.

Other people are not "me". They have their own ability. In my
experience they are apt to be far less tolerant and understanding of
being unilaterally and unconditionally rebuffed by David Tholen.

And thus they temporarily or otherwise join the ranks of those who
continue to harrang the man.

----------

My purpose in all of this ?

To call 'bull ****' on David.
To say, .. "Listen, mate ... I respect you for REAL". So do
others.
It sure hurts me to see that you can't accept your own self. ..
I've got no problem with it. You sure, as heck shouldn't have any
qualms about belonging ...

And if Tholen's answer is 'No', then it's 'No'. I tried ... I did what
I could ... I sure as heck don't think any less of him because of such
one way or the other.

It would just be nice to see him be kind to himself for a change.

---------------

Whether Tholen is a great astronomer or a nobody really doesn't matter
to me Double-A. I felt that he was relentlessly harrased, and quitely
clearly undeserving of such, months ago; soon after I got invoved in
Usenet.

I earned a 'Busted Urinal Award' because I deliberately and
systematically acted to denounce the 'bullying' against David Tholen
and Charles Bohne.

In standing up, I was criticized. My anctics were mocked ... Not just
by those of AUK; but some of those in r.m.c. At the time of voting for
'Raving Loonie' for busted urinal, ... I was ignored through not
voting against the motion.
Perhaps some voted in favor of the motion.


I voted against your receiving that award. That's on the record.


This disregard of myself is comparable in quality to the rejection and
isolation suffered by Tholen.

I don't care. It was my deliberate choice. I accepted the consequences
of my actions.

I can say that I was dismayed that others did not see what I was
attempting to accomplish and/or were unsupportive of such. But that's
not important.

In the main, I am quite saddened to see that David Tholen couldn't see
it.

... That he can't take comfort and satisfaction that there are other
people in this world who are on his side. ... who accept, understand
and support him.

I admire David Tholen standing up to internet bullies.

Sheesh, enough already, he doesn't neeed to be so strident about it!

IMO, it ends up doing more harm than good.

----------

Albeit, irrelevent; given the hardship that Tholen has gone through all
these years ... I can accept and respect whatever he does ...
including treating me as one of his detractors.

I just hope that David Tholen can be kinder to himself.

RL


I'm sure that with all that's gone on in his life, that Usenet is just
a minor diversion.

Double-A