Uh... scuse me. Aren't we over-reacting here
just a smidge? Everybody who sets up a little
dramatic tension on a list isn't a troll, after all.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Trolls are
attracted to goats - fat old goats in particular.
There are two defenses against trolls:

1) A sense of humor; and

2) A bunch of old goats bigger than the troll.

Seems ta me this list has a tradition of choosing
option 2. That sorta works, only the effect on
the list gets worse than the effect of the trolls was.

I humbly suggest we stop buckin' around and
lighten up.

-Larry (Eyes as big as saucers) C.



Jan Owen wrote:

Jon was TOTALLY right, you know.

And you just confirmed it to him, and to everyone else here on SAA, just
like you did with David Knisely, and Brian Tung.

I had been hoping you could stop spewing your mindless trolls long enough
to give us a little data on your new Parks OTA, but William Mattil has
more than filled the bill, where Parks is concerned, today, with an
excellent post and photos.

And so now you are history.

PLONK!

--
To reply, remove the "z" if one appears in my address
"Alan W. Craft" wrote in message
...
On 16 Nov 2003 11:58:05 GMT, (Jon Isaacs) wrote:

Of all the portable Newtonians on the market, I gravitate towards
the
'Portaball' with its Zambuto primary, or any other design that allows
the
rotating of the tube.

Alan:

I would have privately Emailed this to you but in the past you have not
responded.

I rarely access my Hotmail account; I apologise.

It has taken the good part of an hour to write this post so take
some time reading it and thinking about it before you blow it off.

It has been suggested to me that you are a troll.

...a convenient term to throw out when disagreeing with someone.

I'm not so bad, really. I simply have opinions is all, and a
need to
express them.

I am not sure that this is the case but it is clear to me that you are
more
interested in expounding upon some limited knowledge and experience
than in listening to what others who have more knowledge and experience
than you.

Rather, I elicit that knowledge and experience out into the
open
while admittedly so doing, and for all to disseminate and absorb; to get
whatever they may get out of it, therefore what's so bad about that?

Rather than Plonk you, I have decided to explain my perspective.

You're most gracious, truly.

Have I not been so as well, for the most part anyway?

You posted something that your Klee is a magic Coma Corrector. This is
a myth
that still exists. David Knisely responded with a carefully written
post and
you replied with "I knew that."

This is just rude and uncalled for.

Like his "ad hominem" in inferring that I was a snob, and while
discussing the process by which the erroneous term "Dobsonian" came
into being as applied to a Newtonian in addition to its mounting?

I agree.

So far, he's inferred one name and called me another, and all because he
disagrees with me. Mind you, I've not called him a single name.

He and others simply can't stand to have their preconceived notions of
what
is right and wrong questioned, much less shaken.

People are taking their time to try to help you understand this hobby
and expand
your understanding.

And I hereby sincerely thank each and every one.

This is not some Yahoo forum where people like you and me trade in myth
and
ignorance. This is the big league and you need to respect that fact.
Myself
I consider it an honor to be able to have such an intimate contact with
these
folks and I have learned a great deal from them. There is much to
learn here
if you listen.

I do read, but I like to write, too; and yes, I recognise this
group as being
worthwhile, otherwise I wouldn't want to be a part of it, albeit a very
miniscule
part.

I myself have spent a fair amount of time responding to your posts...

I appreciate that, truly, but if you consider it an investment
with the
expectation of some sort of return(s), then I'm afraid that I may have
to
disappoint, depending.

...only to have you respond with something similar to your response to
David.
In this case it was the 300 lb 12.5 inch Parks which then transformed
into the
"Portaball."

I don't see the connection at all. Of course a 10" or 12.5"
Portaball would
be much easier for me to tote out the door and into the yard, and over a
Parks
12.5" 'Superior.'

What could've possibly rattled your chain within that?

Unless you have actually seen and used various designs like the
Portaballs and
Starmasters then you have no real idea what you will choose when the
time
comes. I could go on about the advantages and disadvantges of
Portaballs and
Starmasters but I have decided not to.

Have you yourself owned one?

---------

So I say this:

I don't know if you are a troll or not. I have given you the benefit
of my
doubt.

But if you don't clean up your act, show some respect, listen to what
other
people are saying and only post when you have actual experience and
knowledge,
then I, for one am joining David Knisely and several others who will
simply not
respond to your posts.

You do precisely what you feel you need to do, Mr. Issacs, and
no, Mr. Knisely
owes me a public apology instead, hence...

snip

I think you're just tired of seeing all the bickering and
fighting that goes on
within this group, and with just the argument between Mr. Knisely and
myself being
the last straw.

In toto, I am here primarily to express my views, mostly upon
things astronomical,
but also on other things as they arise, and just as others have done,
do, and will do
still. There are no rigid set of rules that govern how discussions are
to be carried out
and what they are to contain. May I remind you, sir, that this is an
unmoderated group,
and while I agree that that should not give license to one's conscience
to run over
everyone and everything, at the same time it is not to constrict said
freedom of
expression, either.

I find it rather humorous to see so many running about within this group
attempting
to tidy it up and sweep it clean, but only to have it get all dirty
again. In vain they
do so, I'm afraid, in vain.

But, if it'll make you feel better, and since you did sincerely and
patiently compose
your call to sanity, I will take some of your points into serious
consideration. That's
the best I may do.

Toodles.

Alan