"Old Man" wrote in message ...
"Andr? Michaud" wrote in message
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"Old Man" wrote in message
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"Andr? Michaud" wrote in message
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Laura wrote:
"Andrew Usher" wrote in message
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This message is a continuation of the discussion in the thread
'Neutrino mass'.

It is more like a reiteration of your position, already stated in
that thread.


I admit to not being formally educated in QM.

Neither am I.
But I try not to criticise things I don't understand.

I am nevertheless trying
to criticise a belief normally taught in such education.

If you're referring to the idea of the electron being "smeared"
across the orbital, then it is you who has misunderstood.
"In a general paper on quantum mechanics, Schroedinger discusses and
rejects the interpretation that a single quantum is somehow
phyiscally "spread out" or "blurred" among the different parts of a
superposition ." That is what is being taught.

To my knowledge, what is being taught, in perfect accordance with
Heisenber's teachings is that the electron is not localized until
the wave function collapses. So, when in motion, it is definitely
considered in the Copenhagen school view of QM as being spread out.

Stationary states aren't subject to uncertainty. The
parameters of an electron in a stationary state can be
measured with precision. Via multiple observations
of identically prepared systems, one can measure the
distribution of degenerate states, that is, states of equal
energy and angular momentum, to unlimited accuracy.

[Old Man]

Strict copenhagen interpretation says that the uncertainty principle
always applies in atoms. ....

No it doesn't. The HUP applies to certain pairs of
canonically conjugate variables. It doesn't apply to the
quantum numbers that uniquely define atomic stationary
states. transitions between these states are subject to
strict causality.

There is an inherent uncertainty between degenerate states,
that is, between states that are slightly non-orthogonal, as in
radioactive nuclei. In those cases, the wave function is a
superposition of several states.

{snip verbose extension of fractured pottery}

Intriguing comment considering that the first sentence you snipped
said that I agree with you:

Quote:
"But common sense and, as you say, observation of identically
prepared systems say that you are right."

But I am way past wondering at people's attitudes.

As for the Copenhagen interpretation, I told you what I observed
how its supporters apply the HUP the case.

I'll let you debate the issue with them. I am not interested.

André Michaud